Dad, What Should Jan Do With All These Centers?
2 Brothers Scrap Metal Commercial (via waterboy1825)
You know the feeling: You're sitting by the piano in your lavishly furnished living room and naturally you think: scrap metal! what am I going to do with all of it? So you call your friend Vicki, whose father is some sort of scrap metal disposition maven, for advice.
In a similar vein, as reality slowly dawns upon Islanders fans that this season will not end as we hoped it would, we naturally turn to our proverbial Vickis to ask:
What should we do with all these Centers?
While the analogy to scrap metal is inexact, the Islanders do have an excess of Centers that will need to be addressed before next season. After John Tavares (we're basically anchored to this #26-er for the next half decade), here's how it looks:
The Dane: Will Frans Nielsen reach a deal with the Isles? Will he be dealt before the trade deadline? Will he become a UFA in the offseason?
The Rushed: Aside from Tavares, Bailey's spot at C seems the most assured of the bunch. He has shown slow yet certain progress this season in all parts of his game, although the scoresheet hasn't yet reflected it. He's signed through next year and the possibility of a trade seems remote.
The Prodigy: After two years of dominating juniors (and no ability to play at BPT), Ryan Strome looks likely to land a spot on the Isles next season.
The Reasoner: Brought on to add some skill and offensive punch to the fourth line, Marty Reasoner hasn't scored a goal, is a -16 and is now out with broken hand. He is signed to a two year contract.
The Umlaut: David Ullstrom impressed with his play with the Isles. Although he played wing with the Isles, he is currently playing C at BPT.
The Tonelli: Not sure who came up with the comparison first, but the sheer will and determination in Casey Cizikas's play is certainly reminiscent of the other JT -- John Tonellis. Check out this assist (at around 2:10) where Casey seems to be saying "excuse me sir, I'm trying to pass this puck to that guy, do you mind?" Casey is currently tearing it up at BPT and his skills seem perfectly designed for a role on the 3rd or 4th line. He will likely make a strong push for a place on the roster next year.
The Collegian: Brock Nelson is having a solid season in college.
So that's 5 centers vying for 3 spots without counting the college kid or Ullstrom. Competition is good but it presents tough choices:
Option 1: If Frans re-signs and we assume that Strome and Bailey stay at C, that means Casey stays in BPT, Ullstrom stays on the wing (or stays in BPT) and Reasoner goes where? 2 Brothers Scraps Metal?
Option 2: Trade Frans. 2nd and 3rd line centers would be Bailey and Strome and let the rest of 'em fight for the 4th line spot. But then you won't have Frans.
Option 3: Move Strome and/or Bailey to wing and Frans stays. The 4h line spot is open for the rest of them.
So, what do you think?
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Competition is good
I actually don’t think they’re anchored to any decisions because (assuming they extend Nielsen) they basically only have two centers they can be sure of. Bailey, though improving, is still a wild card. Cizikas is still an AHLer for now. Ullstrom might be a wing (so might Cizikas and Srome and Bailey and Nelson, you never know).
I’m a fan of finding out what you have first — or that you definitely have a surplus — before trading from that strength. But I agree if all card turn over positively then they’ll have to make a decision (and there might be some mild market for a distressed-value Reasoner).
P.S. Man, do they still run that ad?
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
MSG has since gone all national on us with that citibank commercial with the lady on the mountain
I don’t think the scrap metal ad gets as much play anymore.
I’ll have to think of a way to urn “Who Left the Gates Open” into a fan post title.
Lighthouse Hockey. Where Islanders fans come to panic with punctuation.
by DP'sknee(andhipandflubugandotherknee) on Jan 31, 2012 10:38 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Two brothers scrap metal is way better than that pretentious "Oh Im so punny" rock climber chick. She is SO annoying.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Jan 31, 2012 12:26 PM EST up reply actions
Well, DP won't be starting anymore
so he certainly won’t be leaving the gate to the net open this season.
Amateurs practice til they get it right. Professionals practice til they can't get it wrong.
by Torgo on Jan 31, 2012 12:37 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
The cream will rise to the top
One of the most obvious weaknesses of this team is a lack of a second scoring line to take pressure off JT’s first line. If the Islanders are to become contenders in the next few years, it is imperative that they get/develop a legitimate scoring threat as the center of the second line.
I think Strome is the key. Ideally, he will develop strength to complement his offensive abilities, and will become that anchor to the second line. That is probably not going to happen next year, though. His production in junior is actually down from last year; he’ll probably need more seasoning either in junior or the pros.
Centering the third and fourth lines of the future should be in good hands with Nielsen and (probably) Cizikas.
Bailey, though improving, has pathetic offensive production. Unless he dramatically improves his output, I think he will be gone in a few years.
Brock Nelson and Anders Lee were both drafted as centers, but are now playing on the wings, according to their team web sites.
And yeah, you never know. Maybe some will shift to wing or back to center. Maybe another prospect (Johan Sundstrom, or a 2012 draft pick) will take off and overtake the others on the depth chart. It should be fun to see how things shake out in the next few years.
Yeah I think Nelson's been on LW
Which I find kinda odd because he has a good defensive game.
No Sleep 'til....We Find Some Secondary Scoring
I think if you can get him on a line with a guy that can finish, he'd be fine.
He does seem to hold the puck a bit too long at times, but he also makes some nice passes. just seems like no one is ever expecting them, or they can’t handle them.
this
he makes these amazing passes and nobody is really expecting donkey shit so the pass just gets wasted. I think we will see with Rhett on his wing, these passes may start finding the back of the net, also vice versa. Rhett has hands.
I fully support a Martin/Bailey/Rahk line.
by Les Beaver on Feb 1, 2012 12:01 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I like that, its worth giving a genuine chance.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Feb 1, 2012 8:28 PM EST up reply actions
If all else fails
Come up with a novel approach to positioning and take the hockey world by Strome storm.
It is Diduck.
Just call Two Brothers Scrap Centers
Got scrap centers? Call Two Brothers scrap centers and recycle your natural goal scorers, snipers, 4th line enforcers, checking centers, or any centerman for the highest price.
Two Brothers also provides home and away pickup, used hockey equipment handling, radio dispatched centerman collection trucks, and free roll off service. Recycling makes sense. Now get dollars with those cents.
by Isles2011 on Jan 31, 2012 9:17 AM EST reply actions 3 recs
Ahahaha DP'sKnee
you nearly slayed me in the middle of my office with this fanpost’s title.
That said, should Strome be given a little more time to fill out before he starts playing with the big kids? I recall him (unless I"m mistaking him for someone else) not being especially large.
Still feels weird cheering for Nabokov
Unless Strome:
has a strong finish to this junior season (likely), goes deep in the playoffs, has a great offseason of JT style work ethic, and lights out training camp.
I think he should return to juniors for another year and not be called upon. I am very high on Strome as a either a 2nd line center or top 6 winger. If he comes up next year it is most likely on the wing. Much like Skinner started on the wing and routed back to a center position.
I think he is almost a JT light if one could say that. Certainly has the vision, the passing skills, the mits, and imo actually surpasses JT in skating and his slap shot (at the same age). Where he could improve is obviously his strength, where he could become the wheel house master much like JT behind the net. He has a ton of character, tremendous work ethic, and a very positive attitude, which is great for learning. As he works out in the same center as JT in the off season, I believe this will pay dividends, as JT is just getting the ball rolling and you can bet your ass that JT will come back from this following offseason in BEAST MODE. If Strome is in the same environment as JT, it will not only rub off on him, but he will most likely join his future teammates in their regiments, if he can keep up.
I bet we see a 6-2 190-5 lbs Strome by the time he reaches the Islanders. (btw currently 6-1 183lbs) Thats some good size, since he was drafted at about 6-0, 175ish lbs. and everyone said he was a bit undersized. This kid is going to fill out nicely, much like JT. BTW, I do not want to trade the kid for shit.
First thing is we need to determine who the 2nd line center is
It cannot be Nielsen. He’s the perfect 3rd line shutdown guy but we need a good 2nd scoring line. So either Bailey has to step up a bit more or you put Strome there. If you put Strome there then what do you do with Bailey? Assuming Frans is kept I think he becomes a winger (again). If Nelson is ready to leave college then I could easily see him making the team out of camp. I’d start him as 4th line center and waive Reasoner. But what about Cizikas? Ok so now Brock has to go to LW, CC at Center. That leaves one open forward slot: 4th RW. I’d imagine that’s Rhett or Kabanov. But wait that leaves out Matt Martin. So Martin is back at 4th LW and Brock is back in college or AHL.
Yeah something has to give there. Even sending Rolston & Pandolfo to the old Devil’s home still leaves a logjam. I really want to keep Fransie but he is looking expendable. I think Garth will keep the lines open for any possible trade there.
No Sleep 'til....We Find Some Secondary Scoring
Bailey hasn't even proven he's the short term solution for 3rd line center. Let's not get ahead of ourselves yet.
Bailey is the most likely “young” person on the team to be voted off the island when new castaways arrive and out battle him.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
"John Tavares(a top 10 forward in the NHL)"-Neil Greenberg
Question here
Looking at Nino this year, I don’t think we have anyone in the system with as much NHL readiness as Bailey right now. Strome has some great offensive skill but he’s very small I’d like to see him bulk up before he gets his shot at the big leauges. Baileys an NHL player and right now we don’t have enough of those. Our bottom three is Nino Wallace and Pandolfo the only one who should stay is Nino. So we have atleast 2 empty spots plus a spot in the press box once Rolstons gone. Bailey is important if only to put an NHL capable player right now. He’s 22, give him some time before we throw someone else to the wolves like we did with him.
Constantly building for the future.
I'm not gonna argue that he is the highly likely starting 3rd line center next year for us.
But that’s more of a knock on our NHL readiness for prospect centers than it is to say Bailey has been a good 3rd line center, because the numbers say he hasn’t been yet. I’m not even gonna say we should waive him or trade him asap. I’m just saying given Bailey’s track record and experience he should be producing a lot better than he is now regardless of having a weak linemate. Good players overcome adversity. Not to say Bailey will never do that, I just think that Bailey becoming a quality top 6er is a somewhat forgone conclusion, but I think he can definitely become a good 3rd liner if all things start clicking and he gels with linemates.
And aside from Strome(it could happen, we’ve seen Stromes hands and skating), I don’t think anyone will really challenge him for that starting 3rd line spot from within it’s likely be cizikas(or ullstrom, whom the isles like at wing?).
Not sure we’d really call Strome small, or should predict him to be “small” come the start of next year. On the “opening day” NHL isles rosters per their site, Bailey is 6’1’’ 190lbs and Strome is , So it shouldn’t be hard to think Strome won’t be around 190lbs come the start of next year, especially when we remember that he gained 20lbs “over the summer”(likely over the course of a year) the year before he was drafted. Plus, grabs and nielsen are 185lbs listed, so weight isn’t the biggest concern for him.
In conclusion, I don’t think we should give up on Bailey, I’m just saying limit your expectations. Yes, he was a top 10 draft pick(overdrafted), but he’s also a 3yr nhl vet who hasn’t been able to prove he’s capable of being a good 3rd line player. Yes he is 22yrs old, but people usually have a grasp of what they have with forwards after a few years in the league. I’m not writing him off yet, he’s got 1 and a half seasons to prove otherwise, he’s just been more disappointing than positive over the last year. And I do think Bailey is gonna be the opening day roster 3rd line center next year, with Strome on his wing.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
"John Tavares(a top 10 forward in the NHL)"-Neil Greenberg
bailey is bigger than strome
and always will be. this year bailey is listed at 190 but last year was at 200. so he trimmed down on his own but can easily go back to 200 if he wanted to. they have different frames. strome is 6’ and mostly listed at 180-183. bailey is 6’1. someone mentioned strome will grow to 6’2? lol. he’s done “heightening”. you dont get taller when your 19. he may put on 10 pounds or so but i think he’s topping out at 190 just from the looks of him. strome will never be a big player.
already up posted this up
but most places have Strome listed at 6-1 now around 185ish. To say he will not be 6-1 190+ next year is foolish. One thing I could say that is that just being that big doesnt necessarily mean he will use it like Bailey has this year.
by ghalbart on Feb 2, 2012 11:01 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Yeah, thanks for posting this. I forgot Strome's listed weight/height in the post above.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
"John Tavares(a top 10 forward in the NHL)"-Neil Greenberg
The things is that you cannot trust prospect height/weight listings
They are notoriously unreliable and outdated.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Feb 3, 2012 11:53 PM EST up reply actions
The more I read your post, the more I think that Snow has a lot of trade "chips".
Sadly, the more I read this and think Snow thinks PAP could be expendable or possibly nielsen. I hope to hell that Snow is serious about the contract talks with those guys, because we don’t have fill-ins for either in the immediate future. But as you pointed out, just new “prospects” hitting the ahl and working themselves into the NHL should very nicely fill out our bottom 6 in the next few years. It’s really just a question of keeping the impact players we have and filling out the defense properly. The impact players are fairly easy to fill-in (Grabs/Okposo/JT/ and even Moulson are locked down for a couple years), with exception to PAP/Nielsen right now who should be resigned asap, it’s filling out the D that’s gonna be the big issue or question mark imo. Goaltending should work itself out or we should be able to have average goalies for cheap costs. I really wonder how that D is gonna play out though. Donovan or DeHaan could fill that top 4 slot, I think Donovan 1st and DeHaan will just end up a Wiz or MAB type player because of his strength issues and weakness on D(prediction for now). Than we need to fill-out the rest of the D and wonder about a-mac’s health imo. A-mac still hasn’t been close to what he was pre-surgery this year.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
"John Tavares(a top 10 forward in the NHL)"-Neil Greenberg
Your players' titles reminded me of Seinfeld episodes
Good points, I definitely think we should let them dog it out next year though.
Likewise enjoyed the player titles
Will have to remember these.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
Lots of ways to go
In any event, it’s a good problem to have. Once the prospects are established, then Garth can think about moving guys around or out. Nielsen is most likely resigned. If Strome, Nelson, Bailey (still holding out hope) or, even Cizikas, can fill that second line spot, they’re golden.
"He's depriving some small village of a pretty good idiot" - Mike Milbury on Ziggy Palffy's agent. On Twitter: @Dan_of_Science
Good write-up. I think things are gonna eventually work themselves out 1 way or another from within.
I’m not gonna give you every prediction on every forward, but I’ll tell you what I think is gonna happen. I think as prospects come up and work themselves up, they will work their way into NHL shots. And once they get to the nhl (or are at the nhl level) they will play themselves into nhl spots or into depth/ahl players. And if we have too many, we trade them away or move them to wing or eventually let them walk as UFA. And that’s without knowing the Nielsen factor, but I’d much prefer to have an elite checking center on my team then trade him away and have Bailey as a starting 2nd line center next year. Even if we traded Nielsen for a top 4 d-man, that’s 3 steps back and 1 step forward imo.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
"John Tavares(a top 10 forward in the NHL)"-Neil Greenberg
Option D
When Josh Bailey is the “most assured” of the bunch, it is time to reconsider whether you actually have an excess of non-terrible centers.
=d
by AP77 on Jan 31, 2012 7:05 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
Who knows who will even remain a center?
Strome might be a winger in the NHL for all we know. Remember how Minn kept trying to make Kyle a C in college? College and Jrs usually make their best forwards play center- that doesnt mean that where they will always be.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
Don't count the chickens before their hatched
right now Isles have 3 NHL centres, a 1st, 3rd and 4th, and no second line centre. The rest are all prospects, and some of those who make it will not be able to play centre at NHL level. Wait and see what we have, then take it from there.
by CanadianIsleslifer on Feb 1, 2012 10:47 PM EST reply actions
In two years, CC will be the Tonelli-type 2nd line center if they don't acquire another by trade/FA
As much as I dislike Snow, I consider Cizikas Snow’s best draft pick that he actually had to think about (JT was a no-brainer) . Casey was originally rated a low 1st-high 2nd rounder. Garth took a chance and stole this kid. Love the work ethic. Franz re-signs and becomes 3rd line, leaving the rest for 4th. If I’m right, and I’m usually not, it does still leave SnowWang a few bargaining chips.
"This season is a serious misallocation of valuable hockey resources"- Saving Private Tavares

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