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The John Tavares Breakout Is Lifting Everyone

Each at age 28, Matt Moulson and P.A. Parenteau haven't suddenly gotten better since last year. They were good in 2010-11 and they are good now, whether with John Tavares (Moulson) or without him (Parenteau).

John Tavares, age 21? He's gotten better. In the last 20 games even. We'll get to a few advance stat/possession pictures of that in a moment, but one expression of this progress is the pace of his most frequent linemates (Parenteau has been on a different line now and in a previous stretch) this season:


GP G A P +/- EVPts PPPts Shots Sh%
2010-11 - Matt Moulson 82 31 22 53 -10 38 15 237 13.1%
2011-12 - Matt Moulson 45 22 21 43 10 28 15 123 17.9%
2010-11 - P.A. Parenteau 81 20 33 53 -8 33 20 161 12.4%
2011-12 - P.A. Parenteau 45 9 32 41 -3 28 13 94 9.6%

Just 55% of the season's schedule in the books, both players are around 80% of the way to matching last year's totals. (Tavares, who collected points at a .84 per game clip last season, is up to 1.0 points per game in 2011-12.)

No doubt they're on a hot run now and that pace is likely to taper off, but it's still impressive and Tavares' growth is the source.

Star-divide

Superb plays like the one Tavares made last night to Moulson (or rather to Kyle Okposo, with Moulson as the backup) are happening more frequently, and Moulson showed even in Tavares' lowest rookie-year moments that he has the ability to bury those. Tavares is pulling off moves that is drawing more defense to him, leaving his linemates more open.

This doesn't mean Tavares is what makes them good -- in today's NHL you can't just stick anyone on the wing of a good center and watch the points pile up. But it does mean Tavares' improvement has made all of them better.

Possession With Or Without Tavares

In fact, it's what's carrying the team overall right now as it rides a modest lift in play. I was going to express this another, typically long-winded way, but BenHasna pointed out some numbers in comments last night. Here is the Islanders Corsi (percentage of a game's shots for/against) for all even-strength situations with the score tied (that means when the game is up in the air and either team is equally inclined to play for goals, rather than sit back and protect the lead or, conversely, throw everything at the net to try to erase the opponent's lead):

Last 20 games:
Tavares individually: 58.33% (!)
team overall: 51.02%
team without JT: 46.19%

First 25 games:
Tavares individually: 50.97%
team overall: 48.44%
team without JT 46.99%

In a nutshell: Unlike his rookie year, the Islanders are unquestionably better when Tavares is on the ice. Even more so -- to an extreme -- in the last 20 games.

Tavares Carrying The Team, Boosting His Linemates

Now back to the Moulson/Parenteau counting stats above.

True shooting talent does not suddenly improve in a player's late 20s -- and over time much of the figure is beyond a player's control. So Moulson, who's been a 13-14% shooter in his career, should not be expected to stay near 18% this season, but the Islanders' improved powerplay may be helping (he already has seven PPG this season; he had nine in 2010-11).

Regardless, outsiders are understandably tempted to dismiss Moulson and Parenteau's production as purely Tavares-driven, but there is an egg that goes with that chicken.

(It's been pointed out before -- and BenHasna alluded to the numbers again in that comment -- that in Moulson's breakout year, his possession numbers were better without the then-rookie Tavares than with him. That doesn't mean Moulson is more talented. It means Moulson at 26 was better equipped to play an all-around NHL game than Tavares at 19. Given their ages, this should not be surprising.)

Moulson and Parenteau have always brought something to the table, and in fact helped Tavares through the difficult transition from junior star to NHL regular. It's hard for people to realize because we've seen Tavares' finer passes from day one (though far less often) in 2009, but it really has been a process for him to develop over the last 2.5 years. His skating and ability to physically protect the puck this year has been a massive improvement over his first two seasons.

And now that Tavares is becoming a top NHL forward on a nightly basis (instead of just an okay overall forward with some magical game-breaking hands) we're seeing the results of he, Moulson and Parenteau (before the line shakeup) and Okposo (now) firing on all cylinders.

'If He Had a True First-Line Mate...'

The whole "true first-line X" debate is a little overdone, because basically you want a top-six that can outplay the opposition more often than not, and however the pieces of that fit together doesn't really matter. You need to find the combo that makes the matchups with the opponent work in your favor.

Still, sometimes people say, "Imagine how many points Tavares would have if he had true first-line wingers." I'd turn that around two years ago and much of last year and say, "Imagine how many points Moulson would have if he had a true NHL first-line center." We're now finding out.

It used to be Tavares was a very talented player who still needed the rounding every 19-year-old thrust into the NHL needs. Today, it appears that part is arriving before our eyes.

The Islanders' top line is now starting to outplay the opposition with some regularity. Tavares' improvement has made that possible. Whether or not they are ephemeral "true first-line" talents, one should consider Moulson or Parenteau/Okposo as 50-point players when given PP minutes and offensive roles next to a good center.

And now that they're next to a very good center (and worthy first-liner!), those totals are only going to grow.

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Apparently the idiot wrote an article titled

“Why John Tavares is Good, Not Great”

DId anyone read it on ESPN. I refuse to pay insider information for TMZ of sports, but if someone can sum up his points I’d be pretty interested to see.

You should've seen her face. It was the exact same look my father gave me when I told him I wanted to be a ventriloquist.

by mikefromVA on Jan 21, 2012 3:05 PM EST up reply actions  

It’s because he get a lot of offensive zone faceoffs.

by TA on Jan 21, 2012 6:45 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

After reading the article, I can tell how few Islanders games ESPN actually watches.

I know we’ve all seen how many times a game JT goes int the defensive zone, takes the puck away from someone, and leads a rush into the offensive zone. If he doesn’t attack the net to create a scoring chance, many times he holds onto the puck after crossing the blue line as the rest of the team comes in to start some pressure on the opposing goalie. But Greenberg is right, its only because he has so many offensive zone faceoffs.

by MineolaIsles on Jan 21, 2012 1:31 PM EST up reply actions  

JT is a Super Star

Watching JT control play is astonishing. This kid is lights out the best center in the league. Doubt what Im saying …… watch in wonder as his career progresses.

by TonyT1 on Jan 21, 2012 7:58 AM EST reply actions   2 recs

I don't know about just yet

But in a few years, I’d guess that he will be top 3 in centers. And that’s fucking awesome.

by sayvillelax94 on Jan 21, 2012 12:49 PM EST up reply actions  

If Tavares was on a teams like the Pens

right now, he would be receiving the recognition that Malkin is currently adorning. JT has been doing more with less for longer this year, while having less experience. I am not saying that JT is better than Malkin as a player, since Malkin has had 100 point seasons, just that a little credit for his recent tear and extra gear is never a bad thing.

A player like Tavares, though seemingly shy, rises and shines in the spotlight. This has been clear since his early days in junior as an underage player. He will put up more points and play better when the pressure is on and the attention is on him. Though he receives pretty much all the attention on the Island, besides a goaltender’s knees who will not be named, he rarely receives credit nationally.

We are lucky enough to see him transform every game and next season there is no reason not to believe he will be among the league leaders. Loving right now and the future of JT.

by ghalbart on Jan 21, 2012 8:04 AM EST reply actions  

next season there is no reason not to believe he will be among the league leaders

next season? He’s top ten in points now.

"Mark D: the internet's foremost chronicler of Milburian insanity" - Pretty Good Idiot
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.

by Mark D on Jan 21, 2012 8:20 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

JT is doing more with less this year?>

Um last I checked the play of several guys has gotten better this year, not just JT

Overall this team as a whole is better than last year, some of that is contributed to JT, but some of that is also attributed to the goaltending getting better ; as well as; players like Nino, Bailey, PAP and Martin getting better.

James T Paulson

by Jtpdolphins2009 on Jan 21, 2012 1:23 PM EST up reply actions  

His impact is amazing

especially when you start looking at some of his splits. Of course this outlines the downfall of the Islanders-that when he’s not going well they don’t have the depth/secondary scoring to win without him. It’s no surprise that the Islanders’ worst month (November) was JT’s as well, when he went just 1-4-5 in 13 games.

Even more striking are the splits in wins and losses:

18 Ws: 11-21-32 1.8PPG
27 Ls: 6-8-14 0.5PPG

Obviously his number will be better in wins, but I didn’t think it would be quite so stark. The scary thought is that if we can ever reliably find points from another line, it might open even more ice for him.

by afrosupreme on Jan 21, 2012 8:30 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

he's not that good.

One time in his rookie year the opposing team Had 3 more shots on goal while JT was on the ice vs when he wasn’t on the ice. Also, he likes red gatorade, when we all know that any true 25 under 25 player likes light purple gatorade.

Still waiting for a GOZO

by BobbyNystromOwnsYou on Jan 21, 2012 8:34 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

Capuano and Tavares

Last post I was complimentary of Capuano, but it is also fair to say that he is fortunate that the star of his team is a guy like Tavares, who is simply the highest skilled AND the hardest worker shift after shift each game (well, he and Hamonic).
I think it would be fairly difficult to sit on the bench, watch what JT does each shift, and not put forth a similar effort.
Right now, he is lifting all boats.

Which brings up a future point. Assuming Streit is still on the team, I would hope that he would next year voluntarily turn the “C” over to JT- he clearly is the true Captain of this team.

by JackandAce on Jan 21, 2012 8:34 AM EST reply actions  

I disagree with this
Assuming Streit is still on the team, I would hope that he would next year voluntarily turn the "C" over to JT- he clearly is the true Captain of this team.

JT is becoming a leader. He is not the “true Captain” of this team and should not be for some time to come, whether Streit is here or not.

Last summer, I indicated that one of my citeria for Captain was someone who would be around long enough so that JT could focus on getting better without the added responsibilty that comes with the “C”. This led to my conclusion that Streit was the only good choice for the role. Obviously, this is what has happened and should continue to happen.

JT MAY be a Captain of this team one day. Not now, and not next year, however.

STOP effin' messin' with my FnGO!!

by Nova Scotia Isles Fan on Jan 21, 2012 10:11 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

Some young captains

“…should not be Captain for some time to come…”

Tavares next year will be 22, and that will be his 4th in the NHL. Some young Captains in NHL history:
Crosby was 20 years old.
LeCavalier was 19 years old.
Toews was 20 years old.
Yzerman was 21 years old.
Bobby Clarke was drafted in ’69, and was Captain in ’72.
Thats just a few.
I think Tavares means as much to this team as the guys listed above did to theirs. And most importantly he reflects the work ethic that you want all other players on the team to emulate.

by JackandAce on Jan 21, 2012 10:39 AM EST up reply actions  

see if you can even find a list of "young" captains that didn't make it.

I definitely agree (and agreed) with NSIF. There’s just no need for it when you have a vet like Streit who can carry the burden. And if Streit finishes off the season in the condition he has been in for the past few weeks then I’d extend his Islander career and captaincy. I have no problems with either, and I have a feeling that they could get him for two extra years at a similar price without much drop off in production… with less responsibilities.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 21, 2012 11:50 AM EST up reply actions  

I think people believe JT is being dissed or something by “only” wearing an A. Which is, IMO, ridiculous.

Is there anyone out there who thinks that JT is holding back in any way right now? That he would somehow be BETTER if it was a C instead of an A? Does anyone actually believe that?

JT is doing great- but as great as he is, he is still a 21yo who is learning. We are seeing it right before our eyes. I am grateful that we have people around who he can learn from. He is staying here, guys- he is an Islander! He loves this team! Lets watch this happen naturally- the way it should. Lets not rush it, lets just enjoy it.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 21, 2012 2:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Lists

Lists of ANY Captains who did not make it would be quite short, since you are only named Captain if you are a fairly good player.
And if you are young and named Captain, you would have to be a very special player. Like all the players listed above. Like Tavares.

by JackandAce on Jan 21, 2012 12:26 PM EST up reply actions  

that's really not what i meant...

List of players who did continue on an upward path while being named captain early.
McCabe may be an example of that. As TA said, Vinny may also be an example. I’m not saying that making tavares captain would turn him into Josh Bailey… I’m just asking WHY? You have a good captain, and I think Streit has earned the respect of the team and there isn’t much doubt that he can handle it.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 21, 2012 1:17 PM EST up reply actions  

One more reason

Looking at that list of teams, there is one thing they have in similarity to the Isles. And that is that they all were stuck in a relatively long period of mediocrity, just like the Isles (although we aspire to mediocrity at this point).
But I would make two predictions:
If in fact Streit is not here next year, JT will be named Captain (unless we can import one from some other team and we know the chances of that are nil).
If Streit is here, he may remain Captain (that is is why I said he would have to voluntarily remove the C, the Isles would not take it from him). But if all things remain equal and JT continues his development, health, and dedication, that will be the last year that JT is not Captain.

by JackandAce on Jan 21, 2012 1:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Lists

Lists of ANY Captains who did not make it would be quite short since they would have had to be pretty good players in order to be named Captain. And if you are young and named Captain, you would have to be a special player. Like those listed above, and Tavares.

by JackandAce on Jan 21, 2012 12:31 PM EST up reply actions  

VL4 also had his "C" stripped from him

As they rushed him into the role and got their marketing mixed up with their on-ice symbolism. Yzerman and Crosby also had growing pains.

I don’t really see it as a big deal nor a reason to rush. The recent The Hockey News cover story (which not surprisingly was nowhere near as bad as the cover “why is it taking so long for him to save the Isles?” headline made it out to be) has quotes from multiple vets including Streit saying Tavares has been coming out of his shell this year and becoming more mature in many ways.

To me that means he’ll prob. be captain one day, but no need to rush or expect someone to give it up just because.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 21, 2012 1:09 PM EST up reply actions  

BTW...

Wasn’t everybody (the majority when polled) pro Okposo for captain… like he was the second coming?

Now JT is breaking out and all of a sudden he needs to be the captain… like this was teenage gang that was bored with it’s leader… 1970’s-80’s NY Yankees.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 21, 2012 1:26 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I wouldn’t be upset if JT only wore an A his entire time here. I’d still rather see Okposo get it (e v e n t u a l l y) or even Hamonic. Hell, if Bailey raises his game a bit, I’d toss his name into the hat too. Again tho, I’m hoping Streit is around for a few more years.

Maybe I’ve just been an Islanders fan for too long. This franchise has always looked to the grinders to wear the “C”.

by TA on Jan 21, 2012 1:51 PM EST up reply actions  

If the Islanders had made Bossy the Captain

Maybe then he would have been a great hockey player.
Oh, wait…

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 21, 2012 2:06 PM EST up reply actions  

Who is Bossy?

was he good or something?

Still waiting for a GOZO

by BobbyNystromOwnsYou on Jan 21, 2012 3:04 PM EST up reply actions  

Not me

NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey

by Keith Quinn on Jan 21, 2012 5:45 PM EST up reply actions  

You hit both ends of the extreme there

Crosby, Yzerman and Bobby Clarke are all Hall of Famers. Lecavalier hasn’t lived up to his potential, but is still a good player. Jury is still out on Toews. Maybe Lecavalier was stunted by being named Captain so young. I know he won a Cup, but is still not as good as he should be, and maybe the C had something to do with it.

by billymac23 on Jan 21, 2012 11:51 AM EST up reply actions  

One can also argue that Yzerman didn’t really become a great captain until he learned to play both ends. Or to put it another way, when he matured to enough to change his game for the good of the team.

by TA on Jan 21, 2012 12:08 PM EST up reply actions  

HOF

None of them were assuredly HOF’s when they were named Captain. They had to prove themselves, which they did, and they went on to win the Stanley Cup as well. It was recognition of who these players were at that time, as well as what they meant to the franchise.
Right now, Tavares is the franchise.

by JackandAce on Jan 21, 2012 12:29 PM EST up reply actions  

Tavares has been groomed for this his whole life...

I certainly don’t think streit should be stripped of the c, but if Tavares were to be named captain in the near future I seriously doubt it would effect his play negatively in any way. The kid is built for this.

by LaFontaine16 on Jan 21, 2012 2:37 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

I agree

If Streit is not here next year, can’t imagine anyone else being named C on this team. Now that would be a dis if it happened.

by JackandAce on Jan 21, 2012 4:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Sadly

Crosby may very well not be a HOFer.

by afrosupreme on Jan 21, 2012 12:32 PM EST up reply actions  

Obviously, this is what has happened and should continue to happen.

I think that presumes that JT couldn’t have made the advances he has if he also had the C on his jersey. I honestly don’t think that it’s a big deal if he is or isn’t, but I don’t think we can give any credit of his progress to not being captain. In my opinion there are probably a dozen or two things that would come before this as elements of his advancement.

by afrosupreme on Jan 21, 2012 12:31 PM EST up reply actions  

I never stated, although I suppose I DID imply

a causal relationship between his not having the “C” and his impressive development this season. I meant to say, and I stand by this, that he doesn’t need the added pressure of being the team Captain on top of his most important job, which is to become as good a player as he can be.

One day, he may well BE Captain and I am sure he’ll be a great one, but we don’t need him to go there just yet.

STOP effin' messin' with my FnGO!!

by Nova Scotia Isles Fan on Jan 21, 2012 4:53 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

I agree

because however meaningless we all think it is, someone like JT would take it very seriously. Whether it would affect him otherwise, I don’t know-that’s all I meant. Any yeah, no rush at all.

by afrosupreme on Jan 21, 2012 6:13 PM EST up reply actions  

JT gives a confidence...

and belief to everyone players & fans alike that he is going to contribute to the team in a number of ways whether it be creating an opportunity for himself or a team mate, putting the puck in the net or dazzling with a piece of skill that makes everybody go WOW. He has also got a determination that if the opposition try to out muscle him or try to dominate him physically he’s gonna get up & keep going. We’re not a one man team & there’s other guys on the ice contributing to the wins we get but in my opinion he is the catalyst!!!!!

3 Teams 3 Different Sports Same Torture!!!

by Kung Fu Panda 48 on Jan 21, 2012 9:05 AM EST reply actions  

Seinfeld reference (in case that wasn't clear)

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 21, 2012 1:11 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I got that

But if he can tease me, I can tease back, schmoopy.

Still waiting for a GOZO

by BobbyNystromOwnsYou on Jan 21, 2012 3:03 PM EST up reply actions  

Tease away

Equal opportunity, as long as it doesn’t get carried away.

Success was survival and, kid, it still is

by IslesFanInNJ on Jan 21, 2012 5:03 PM EST up reply actions  

What do you expect?

Dom’s just not a clutch writer.

Official choice of Lighthouse Dog #1.

by Fabtraption on Jan 21, 2012 12:50 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Brian Burke endorses this research.

by TA on Jan 21, 2012 4:37 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

He is a wonder to behold

I remember last year when the conversation revolved around how to describe Tavares. He wasn’t a sniper, nor a playmaker, he was just a really good passer with the ability to score. Now, I think we can describe him just fine. He is a star. JT is hard to knock off the puck, persistent as any I have seen, and has a wicked pass ability that always astounds with his no look passes. This is the Tavares we hoped we develop when he was drafted, and now he is here.

All Who Oppose Grabner Shall Perish.

by pippup on Jan 21, 2012 9:53 AM EST reply actions  

I've been enjoying watching how the opposition treats him

Talbot’s run at him (and subsequent massive fail) was symbolic. Fisher in Nashville too took a few runs. They think they can just knock him off the puck and shut him down, but this isn’t JT 2010 anymore.

And on defense, the panic that sets in when he’s rushing the outside, it’s entertaining: They’re much more respectful of what he can do, and it gets them to get caught mid-decision in whether to stay with their man or support the poor sap who’s covering JT.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 21, 2012 1:14 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

This is what I enjoy the most

Even earlier this year, the opposition was able to frustrate him a bit. But as you say, the way he is playing now is just opening up the offense.

Success was survival and, kid, it still is

by IslesFanInNJ on Jan 21, 2012 5:08 PM EST up reply actions  

Great job as usual Dom!!

I like Ghalbart comparison to Malkin, he is one of the players I feel JT compares too regarding overall hockey skill/attributes. No, I’m not saying he is as good as Malkin (YET) but I see the correlation in talents.
Thanks for the post to help pass the snowy day here in CT :).

In loving memory;Dad thanks for making us Islanders fans, ACC 1918-2011

by bossy2219 on Jan 21, 2012 10:19 AM EST reply actions  

JT is like a lightbulb in a strand of Xmas lights for this team, if you take him out the rest will not light up.....

Moulson and PA are good players and each bring something different to the table, but to say they they can do it without JT, i just dont agree with it. Moulson has an undeniable talent to bury pucks and i will never take that away from him. I consider him almost a Ryan Smyth light. Parenteau is a decent playmaker and PP specialist. If you put them with any other center on the Islanders you can automatically cut their numbers almost in half. If Moulson and PA had another top line center in the NHL to play with then yes i think they can put up similar numbers. Tavares can play with anyone and make them better (ie: Okposo). Okposo has more than doubled his overall ppg since being put on that line. If you take Moulson off that line and play Bailey JT and Okposo i strongly feel you will get similar production, probably boosting JT’s goal output because he now becomes more of a shooter playing with Bailey.
I still strongly stand by my argument that if JT had a true star to play with we’d see him reach another level (almost crosby like). We’ve seen evidence of this with a 20 year old Tavares leading Canadian teams in scoring playing with the best players in the world. And its clear that Tavares is on another planet compared to where he was when he played on that team. While i dont disagree, i guess i didnt like the sound of " Imagine how many points Moulson would have if he had a true NHL first-line center." Moulson can bury the puck and he goes where he needs to to get it. Technically, we are seeing what moulson can do, but without JT giving him that puck, Moulson is much less effective.(which does prove your statement) Its no surprise that Moulson and Parenteau’s stats have made a jump since we’ve been seeing another level from Tavares(which you’ve stated). While Moulson and PA have played well, nobody is talking about their sudden change of play and how much better they are playing from last year and this new level the both of them have reached. They are a product of Tavares. JT is the main cog to the ship. Take him out and the ship is going down. Take out Parenteau and we’ve sprung a leak.
In a nutshell, Moulson and PA ARE good players, but i still feel JT and the team can benefit tremendously from a star. Who wouldnt right? I’d say we have 2/3rds of a top flight NHL 1st line. One more player puts it at an elite status.

by LaFontaine16 on Jan 21, 2012 10:51 AM EST reply actions  

I’d say we have 2/3rds of a top flight NHL 1st line. One more player puts it at an elite status.

Actually, for the last little while (and granted, JT has been on a streak), Isles have the most productive line in the NH for a while now. While I won’t disagree that adding another “star” would hurt the team, I don’t see any reason to mix up the 1st line. It’s a bit unfair to say Moulson or PAP or KO aren’t as good without JT… it’s like saying Kurri wasn’t good without Gretz. Of course youre right, but it’s not the fact that they aren’t as good away from their centers, it’s that they ARE good with that center.

Remember all the years of trying to find good wingers for Crosby? Trying to form a line of superstars might look really great on paper, but it seems like a silly endeavor when we’re actually getting really great production from the players we have on that line.

What the Isles need right now isn’t a great winger for Tavares. They need a steady offensive threat who DOESN’T play with Tavares.

by TA on Jan 21, 2012 11:15 AM EST up reply actions  

My issue is that people see JT and think, "wow, what if he had a star winger?!"

And then they translate that to knocking down Moulson or PAP and get bogged down in “true first line” arguments, and fail to account for who helped whom JT’s first two years.

Meanwhile, most team’s first lines do not have a Trottier and a Bossy. And even when they do … TB has multiple forward stars but it’s not really helping them get it done right now. (Stamkos has 51 pts., VL4 and MSL have almost 40. Their defense is crap.)

What you want when you have a star who can carry the team — which Tavares frankly has not been until this season — is players who can play with him. Of course those same players will be less effective with someone else.

So it’s misplaced: Yes, if Tavares had another star on his line, his points would explode further. Alas, not many teams have that; it’s almost a misallocation of investment. (Crosby — in another dimension from Tavares — has not had star wingers. He’s had interchangeable parts over the years because they are so invested in their centers.)

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 21, 2012 1:24 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't think moulson and parenteau should be garnering all this attention for "helping" Tavares through his first couple of seasons....

Tavares came into the league as a 19 year old and was immediately thrust into a 1st line center role and asked to carry an NHL offense. Moulson helped Tavares feel more comfortable because he knew him personally. That’s Is the only reason moulson was brought here in the 1st place. Granted it worked out, but it’s a far stretch to say moulson carried Tavares his 1st and 2nd yrs. I’d say it’s the other way around, even at the development Tavares was at in his first few seasons. I’d argue that Doug weight had much more of an influence on Tavares than moulson did his 1st season and there should have been far better options than parenteau to help Tavares along in his second season. Once again, both are good players but hardly deserve any credit for helping Tavares along. I’d argue that it made it harder on him. A solid veteran who can still carry the play would be an ideal person for that role, not two AHL journeymen trying to find their way as well.

by LaFontaine16 on Jan 21, 2012 2:51 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Developmentally, perhaps Weight was a bigger influence

But in terms of surviving on the ice while bleeding goals, PAP and Moulson played the game like veterans of the NHL’s two-way demands. JT simply did not.

So many scouts and outside observers voiced as much, about his D deficiencies. But it’s also not surprising, as 19-year-olds thrust into the NHL usually suck at D. They’re trying too hard to get the points they’re used to while still learning the tricks and the big bodies of the NHL.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 24, 2012 3:59 PM EST up reply actions  

agreed....

its almost stating the obvious, but the way JT plays the game its hard to think that putting someone more dominant on his other wing wouldnt produce tremendous results. By no means am i saying we should break up the top line. I was going to bring up the Crosby thing as well, but didtn want to really drag out the post. I also agree that the Isles are in need of more secondary scoring than tinkering w/ the top line.
My main point was taking guys away from Tavares will cause drops in production for them and putting any player with Tavares will cause their production to rise. Of course, Mouls, PA and Okposo all compliment him well. It’s really more of just stating the obvious, but trying to make my point clear that Tavares is running the show. Moulson and PA can only do so much away from Tavares.

by LaFontaine16 on Jan 21, 2012 11:34 AM EST reply actions  

For sure. This team would be scary if the 2nd line really got going. Grabs has to start burying breakaways and not just empty netters.

by TA on Jan 21, 2012 12:10 PM EST up reply actions  

JayTee9DWon

Nice mid-season feel good here Dom. I think we all have the sence that we are seeing greatness emerge, and it’s very cool being a part of it.
We are also starting to see JT pull away from his draft class. I think Duchene is a helluva hockey player, but by this time next year we won’t be hearing that debate anymore.
I like your point about, “Imagine how many points Moulson would have if he had a true NHL first-line center.” Well, if timed out correctly we may never have found that out. Oh the joy of $1 scratchers… because if Snow went for (and was able to land) a guy like tanguay there would not have been a Moulson, and maybe JT is at his 10,000 hours, but he’s not really as happy… (sorry, another Gladwell reference). The same thing goes for PAP. He is showing the NHL that he can produce as a stand alone entity, but maybe if he doesn’t work his way onto the top line last year (Okposo isn’t injured) his confidence level isn’t through the roof.
Now look what’s going on with Kyle. He is truly becoming the player we all pr*j*ct*d him to be.
Can we get Bailey and Nino some time with JT in the Dominican League this summer?
JT, you are AWESOME! When you visit other cities children should line up to kiss your Stanley Cup ring… SO GO GETCHOO ONE!!!

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 21, 2012 12:05 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

Great Piece

A couple comments…

1) I appreciate the restrained enthusiasm, but I think JT is in the process of making the move from “very good” to “elite” right now. Even the Flyers announcers acknowleged this the other night, calling him something to the effect of the most dominant player in the league at the moment. And we’ve seen this over the course of this season. Even during losing streaks, there have been games where he’s been the most dominant player on the ice against some of the most talent-laden teams in the league. Dominant not in the sense of being flashy, but in the sense of puck possession and creating legitimate scoring opportunities almost every time he steps foot on the ice. I still think there are areas of his game that need work, including finishing, but what we hoped we were getting from the 2009 draft has begun to arrive.

2) I still fall in the “If He Had a True First-Line Mate…” camp. I really like Moulson, Paranteau, and Okposo. I think the chemistry between Moulson and JT is a rare and special thing. And I think playing with these guys has been essential to his development, in part because it’s forced him into the role of playmaker, which makes him that much more well-rounded and threatening offensively. But I think the next evolution in his game is getting him a linemate – and perhaps this happens with Strome arriving and transitioning to wing or Nino eventually becoming a first-liner – so that JT has the space and the passes (coming to him, not just from him) that allow him to display the natural scoring talent that made him the all-time scoring leader in the OHL. I think this next step is crucial to us seeing JT in all his glory, and to the Isles becoming a true Stanley Cup contender.

by AlexTrots on Jan 21, 2012 12:19 PM EST reply actions  

1) is just sample size more than anything

No question the last 20 games and much of this season he’s played like an elite center already. I’m just wary because it’s still a short spell and these things go up and down as opponents adjust to new realities and alter their approach.

Plus, I know how people react the next time he goes 8 games without a goal or three games without a point. ;)

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 21, 2012 1:28 PM EST up reply actions  

he disappeared

Still waiting for a GOZO

by BobbyNystromOwnsYou on Jan 21, 2012 2:04 PM EST up reply actions  

I feel the reason tavares goes stretches without points.....

Is because his linemates don’t create enough. That line and the whole islanders offense is run through Tavares. If he’s not going that line and the team for that matter, aren’t going. Give him another player to control the play and draw players to him and you’ll open up a whole other dimension to Johnny’s game.

by LaFontaine16 on Jan 21, 2012 2:59 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

I hear ya...

I won’t give you a hard time for it ; ). Promise.

by AlexTrots on Jan 22, 2012 6:44 PM EST up reply actions  

Agree here....

Tavares is built in a different mold than most players. There’s no reason to think this won’t continue. I’m not expecting 17 points in 10 game stretches for the rest of his career but he should certainly eclipse the 90 point mark for years and years to come. That is elite status. Put another star player with him and w could be looking at multiple art Ross and Richard trophies. It’s not really jumping the gun because the talent, drive and motivation I there and he’s accomplished it at every level. He’s dominating now and hast touched upon his true potential yet.

by LaFontaine16 on Jan 21, 2012 2:56 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Moulson:

The JT-1000 has the same files I have. It knows what I know. It might anticipate this move.

by Isles2011 on Jan 21, 2012 1:49 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

No regression!!

Don’t take this team lightly, we see what happens when teams do that to us. A lot of times the kids take a step forward then take two back. This like the Flyer win, has to be a change… for the better. A good sign if you will. No more same old same old. They must continue to change things. Tonight.

Still waiting for a GOZO

by BobbyNystromOwnsYou on Jan 21, 2012 3:07 PM EST reply actions  

testing
&testing&

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 26, 2012 12:06 PM EST reply actions  

test

test

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 26, 2012 12:06 PM EST reply actions  

#test#
test

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 26, 2012 12:07 PM EST reply actions  


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1979-80


May 24, 1980: Tonelli to Nystrom. At long last, the steady build of the New York Islanders from expansion doormat to surprise semifinalist to annual contender reaches the promised land: Buoyed by a late season trade for Butch Goring that gave the team the depth up the middle GM Bill Torrey had been seeking, the Islanders knock off the Philadelphia Flyers in six games.

The victory justified the faith in coach Al Arbour who guided them from their second season to their first Stanley Cup seven seasons later. The Islanders would not be the first expansion team to win the Stanley Cup, but they would be the only one capable of a dynasty.

1980-81


May 21, 1981: This time it was much easier. After falling to "only" 91 points in the 1979-80 season, the Islanders returned to their division title tradition, piling up 110 points -- a whole 13 points over second-place Philadelphia.

Between the quarterfinals (where they beat the upstart Oilers in six games) and the finals, the Islanders reeled off eight consecutive wins -- with a four-game sweep of archrival Rangers in between. As they defeated the Minnesota North Stars in five games for their second Cup, their goal difference in the final was a combined +10.

1981-82


May 16, 1982: Another year, another landslide title. The Islanders won the Patrick Division by a whopping 26 points over the second-place Rangers, and were seven points clear of their nearest competition for the President's Trophy, the still-not-quite-ripe Edmonton Oilers.

A first-round scare against the Pittsburgh Penguins turned in the Isles' favor thanks to John Tonelli's heroics, and a true dynasty was on its way: Past the Rangers in six games, then an eight-game sweep of the Quebec Nordiques and Vancouver Canucks to run away with the Stanley Cup.

1982-83


May 17, 1983: Not so fast, whipper-snappers. The Edmonton Oilers' steadily rising challenge for league supremacy took them all the way to the finals for the first time, where the New York Islanders summarily dispatched them in a four-game sweep. For the Islanders, the Dynasty was secured. For the Oilers, it was a powerful lesson in where talent ends and the demands of playoff hockey begin.

Four years, four Cups, 16 consecutive playoff series wins (a record that would grow to 19 until the rematch with the Oilers the following year). Mike Bossy scored 60 goals yet again, and Wayne Gretzky became acquainted with Billy Smith's crease.


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