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Flyers 3, Islanders 2: The Legend of Sergei Bobrovsky.

Pin this one on Sergei Bobrovsky. Not one to applaud "good efforts" after losses here, but tonight was just one of those nights. The Islanders outplayed the Philadelphia Flyers through the first two periods yet came out of it down 2-0. They kept pouring on in the third and Kyle Okposo got one back just 22 seconds in to make it 2-1.

But not enough went their way. Sean Couturier potted a nice insurance goal with 90 seconds left, and John Tavares made that insurance necessary by netting his 15th with 16 seconds remaining.

GS | ES | H2H | Shifts | Corsi | Zones | Recaps: NHL | Isles | SBN

You can blame Evgeni Nabokov for setting up the second goal through poor puckhandling (and ceding a bad-angle shot), but he was quite good otherwise. Perhaps gripe with the officials for enabling the first goal, but in truth the difference was "Bob," the little goalie that could, standing on his head as his defense helped prevent second opportunities by boxing out and protecting well as the Islanders swarmed the net.

Star-divide

Among Bobrovsky's highlights was robbing Michael Grabner solo twice -- once when he outwaited Grabner on an early penalty shot, the other when he read the high backhand move and robbed him in frame-that-photo fashion.

The Islanders outshot the Flyers in every period and 35-22 overall. Outhit them 28-22 too (if you buy that stat category). That really is a fair reflection of the night, and the kind of frustration that has you thinking when a team has your number, it doesn't matter what you do. Martin Biron, Ray Emery, Michael Leighton, Bob -- you get the feeling they could dress Garth Snow or Ron Hextall and still stone the Isles.

Incredibly, the Islanders have played the Flyers quite well both times this year (and lost) and this one was considerably better than the first. Yet they get a regulation point out of the previous one and zero points out of this one. That's how it goes sometimes. These are the occasions when it is okay to compliment the effort in defeat.

Game Highlights

Notes

  • Mark Streit looked like Good Mark Streit all night long. Dangerous forays, good decisions, poised puck handling at the blueline, good work on the powerplay, cannon firing from the point all night long. Don't know how much having Milan Jurcina next to him instead of Steve Staios is a factor, but please keep up that combo.
  • Michael Grabner also erased any worries his groin is bothering him. Another game, another couple of breakaways (and a penalty drawn on the third). This time it wasn't the finishing, it was Bobrovsky.
  • The refs were pretty bad. Not pinning this on them -- they had head-scratchers in both directions, but even the Flyers announcers noted what was interference on Travis Hamonic three minutes into the game was not interference on a Flyer a few minutes later. Andrew MacDonald was carrying the puck and they still missed a blatant high stick by Claude Giroux that drew blood.
  • The Staios-Talbot Hit: They didn't overcall a Steve Staios hit on Maxime Talbot though. Initial hit looked good but may have had the dreaded elbow/head contact on the follow through. Talbot certainly was vulnerable. My replays weren't clear, the refs didn't call anything to begin with, so their conferencing afterward made me nervous. (And the league may yet review it, though Talbot didn't miss a shift and thus lacks the "evident injury on the play.")
  • The hit honestly reminded me of the league's first Rule 48 video when they used a similar pinch and hit by Chris Pronger as an example of a "clean" hit because the forward on the side boards is supposed to expect that hit (even to the head(!), at least a year ago). He may need to expect the hit, but not a hit to the head.
  • Respect: Staios appeared to be grinning from the bench at one point in the aftermath -- he was being jawed at by Flyers, of course -- and the Flyers announcers spoke of a lack of respect for fellow player. Which is a good point. But having seen Talbot not respect his "union brothers" in numerous on-ice instances, it's hard to picture him commanding it from others. It's a vicious cycle, that respect thing, and everyone thinks they're the innocent party.
  • Lavi Gets His Audience: On that play, the official gave Peter Laviolette plenty of one-on-one explanation time at the bench. Have you ever seen a coach get as much gentle counseling as Laviolette does? Just something I've noticed, even before the 24/7 action, that Lavi seems to get to call a conference whenever he desires. I miss him for many reasons, but if he has that Platinum Coach Card Service too, well that's one more reason for envy.
  • Danny Briere took two minors for hooking and has 43 PIM on the season. Heh.
  • Another game, another couple of points for John Tavares. That's what he do.
  • It ended up not mattering, but excellent read and break-up on the odd-man rush by Andrew MacDonald, breaking up a tricky Jaromir Jagr pass while the score was still 2-1. Alas, Couturier later added the insurance with a sweet top corner shot on Nabokov.
  • The suddenly fifth-ranked powerplay was 0-for-4 tonight, but it wasn't for a lack of good work. They moved the puck well, evaded aggressive Flyers PK pressure and looked dangerous every time. (This, too, was noted by Flyers announcers on Comcast.)
  • Travis Hamonic and MacDonald were on the ice for, and played a big part in, both Islanders goals -- A-Mac getting the second assist on each. That wasn't a coincidence. They moved the puck well and they possess that skill which is (outside of Streit) in low supply for this club.

Jack Capuano Post-Game Video


So that's 1-18-5 against the Flyers in the last bit of forever. They have work to do yet.

But who'd have thought this? After a tough, blown-lead loss to the poor Ducks, followed by a pretty bad loss to the average Coyotes, I did not expect the Islanders to dominate the Red Wings and outplay the Flyers at home.

Hockey, it confounds.

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Cruddy outcome

and that’s all that really matters against the Flyers.

Side note: the pressure builds on Strome. Couturier seems to be as advertised.

by afrosupreme on Jan 12, 2012 10:12 PM EST reply actions  

Ha, yes

Couturier carried the two-way rep and already delivers. Better hope Strome’s offense is truly special (which it could be).

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 12, 2012 10:14 PM EST up reply actions  

hope so as well

I was the Courier for Couturier around here and was sad the Isles passed on him. Of course, this being the Isles, if they had taken him and played him, right now he’d have eight points, be minus-15, and everyone would be raving about Philadelphia’s dynamic Ryan Strome (how do the Isles pass up this kid????)

I love you Hockey you incorrigible harlot.

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Jan 12, 2012 10:42 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I was definitely a fan of Couturier's profile

Surprised they passed on him when it happened, but Strome also sounded good.

And for sure, ultimately I don’t know enough to hold too much of a grudge, because anything I know could be proven wrong three years down the line.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 12, 2012 10:44 PM EST up reply actions  

I too was on the Couturier wagon, but...

…I didn’t know much about Strome until soon before the draft. I like the idea of Strome. I liked what we saw in the rookie games.

Couturier, Hamilton, and Strome could all turn into good players. Any of them could turn out better than Larsson, who looks good so far too.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 12, 2012 10:47 PM EST up reply actions  

Yea

I took a look at that fanpost I did pre-draft, and the Couturier wagon was pretty heavy-only behind Larsson in the polling, and a lot of Couturier in the top 3 in the comments.

Of course, that said, who knows how good he looks between Tim Wallace and Jay Pandolfo. Probably not quite the same.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 9:23 AM EST up reply actions  

It would be interesting for a game

…to put Tavares between Wallace and Pandolfo. Which would win-out?

(I said interesting, not smart.)

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 1:49 PM EST up reply actions  

All that does is remind me

that Boston and Philly, two already good teams, got Hamilton and Courturier.

…and NJ had a fluke bad year and won the draft lottery. BALLS!

"..."

by Thaddeus Ballpheasant on Jan 13, 2012 8:08 PM EST up reply actions  

Yet another major question mark for management

Why in fuck’s sake they didn’t take Couturier is a mystery.

In fact, is there anyone who will seriously say that Couturier right now isn’t significantly better than Bailey? Because that is an extremely hard case to make.

=d

by AP77 on Jan 13, 2012 12:25 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

Unfair Comparison

Last draft seemed to have more talent in the top-10.

The three players taken immediately before Bailey in 2008 were Filatov, Wilson, and Boedker. After were Hodgsen, Beach, and Myers.

PTS
Filatov: 14
Wilson: 72
Boedker: 60
Bailey: 99
Hodgson 27 (25 this season)
Beach: 0
Myers: 92 (defenseman)

Of course I’d rather have Myers. Probably Hodgson or Wilson (which wasn’t an option after dropping down) too. But Josh is doing okay, leading those forwards drafted around him in career points. He’s been playing a good two-way game the past few weeks. (Since Comeau left.)

If he had started the season with better wingers than Comeau and Rolston, our opinion of Josh may be quite a bit different. (And Isles would probably be much closer to a playoff spot.)

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 12:43 AM EST up reply actions  

Sorry, but JB is on pace to score a mighty six goals this year.

Six.

As a first round pick.

=d

by AP77 on Jan 13, 2012 1:00 AM EST up reply actions  

So your point is what? That they all suck as well? Ok. So Bailey has plenty of company in being terrible?

=d

by AP77 on Jan 13, 2012 1:08 AM EST up reply actions  

My point was that top-10 was weaker...

than this past year’s top-10 picks. That was my original point.

But yeah, typically about 1/3 of 1st round picks end up being good (or better) NHL players. #9 in 2006 was Sheppard. 2007 was Couture. 2005 Lee. 2004 Smid. 2003 Phaneuf. 2002 Taticek. 2001 Ruutu. 2000 Krahn. It’s a mixed bag in the 1st round, especially after the top-5.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 1:16 AM EST up reply actions  

It's a weird apples/orange comparison

Bailey was in the 2008 draft. Couturier was in 2011. What’s the point here … the Islanders should’ve selected Cuoturier because they should have known he would play this year and be better than Bailey right now?

Why the HELL didn’t the Isles take Cam Fowler?! Does anyone disagree that he’s better than Calvin de Haan right now?!!1

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:17 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

I agree, it’s not a direct comparison. I just thought it was kind of funny that we see Couturier having some moderate success now (more than Bailey) and we think “ok, maybe Strome….” The same way that some folks still think Bailey will amount to anything.

Just off the cuff, though, the Isles track record with recent first round picks isn’t very great. (Setting aside JT, who was the brain dead pick.)

Shit, I would have taken Cam Fowler.

=d

by AP77 on Jan 13, 2012 1:25 AM EST up reply actions  

Agree on track record

But Strome:Couturier didn’t sound like quite the same. Or at least people called CDH and Nino reaches, but Strome was in that area where it didn’t sound like a reach (like Schiefele for WPG), just a case of which flavor you’d rather bet on.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:28 AM EST up reply actions  

Thanks to having the 3rd pick in the LHH Mock Draft

I did a lot of research on a lot of players, and I am obviously no scout, but from reading what actual ones said, I thought Strome wasn’t in the same class as Huberdeau, Larsson, and Couturier. I really thought they’d go 3-4-5 and thought Couturier would be going to Jersey and we’d get our pick of Huberdeau or Larsson.

As much as we can complain we didn’t take Couturier, starting with Florida, 4 teams besides the Isles passed on him, so there had to be some real concerns about his mental makeup.

Of course the way it works out is Philly ends up in the Top 10 and winds up having a talent like Couturier fall into their laps. If not Philly, it would’ve been Pittsburgh somehow. That’s just how it seems to go in the NHL.

The New York Islanders: saving their best for the wrong conference since '05

by Chris McNally on Jan 13, 2012 3:09 AM EST up reply actions  

Seemed to me like skating was a concern?

And also, I got the sense that it was like you’re picking a guy who’s guaranteed to at least be Jordan Staal vs. some guys who had higher offensive upside if not the same two-way awareness.

Couturier apparently had defensive intelligence that is rare at that age. But I suppose the theory is you can teach D responsibility, but can’t teach hands.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 3:23 AM EST up reply actions  

That seems to be the logic

but those hands at 18:30 of the third period looked pretty above average to me

The New York Islanders: saving their best for the wrong conference since '05

by Chris McNally on Jan 13, 2012 3:29 AM EST up reply actions  

They *better* be above average

But I figure GMs were looking for wizardry.

This will be really interesting, with Strome-Zidinnerjacket-Schiefele each going before Couturier, each with (at the time) decreasing degrees of reasons why.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 14, 2012 3:47 PM EST up reply actions  

But people discount how important a Jordan Staal is. That's a 6'4'' 220lbs Nielsen.

If Couturier can be that, like he’s billed to be, that would be a phenomenal acquisition. Even a 6’4’’ 210lbs staal/nielsen is a gamechanger. Imagine having Tavares/Staal/Nielsen down the middle. That combo is frigging incredible. I’ve been really surprised how good Couturier’s defensive game has transititoned into the NHL too. He’s been given d-zone heavy starts(albeit against bottom 6 competition) and still come out on the + side and on the verge of a 16goal/28pts rookie season. Not to mention he’s doing this with 2 undersized ahl fighters/scrubs on his line. Just talking about this makes me pissed and envious.

RNH could be a ppg offensive player, we’ll see, but no question about it Couturier was the most complete center out of that draft, most likely nhler, and he will likely be a top/elite checking center at his peak, the only question is how much offense will be he bring. And if this year is any indication of his future, I’d think he is gonna be a 40-50pts(safe guess) top 6 checking center.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 3:59 AM EST up reply actions  

Agree on the importance

But at the top 5 people are going for truly special talent — or at least I suspect that was part of the thinking.

Weirdly, Couturier’s defensive intelligence may have actually harmed his stock on draft day — almost like a big body who “well sure he dominates kids but…”

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 14, 2012 3:44 PM EST up reply actions  

I hear you, but I'd take 4 Nielsen's down the middle any day.

Like we’ve said before, Nielsen is an underappreciated difference maker, one of the best checking/defensive centers in the NHL with top 6 offensive playmaking abilities. 1 Tavares and 2 Nielsen’s at center is a stanley cup middle. Or in this case, 1 tavares/1 nielsen/1 couturier is a possible stanley cup team down the middle, but so could be tavares/nielsen/strome.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 14, 2012 11:48 PM EST up reply actions  

I think

the main thing with Courturier was that people felt he’d be able to do his thing right away (and they were right), but that he wasn’t going to advance significantly beyond that as a player. On the other hand, guys like Hubredeau and Strome have that high, high ceiling where they could sniff 40 goals (or, scarily, flame out much more easily).

For whatever reason, the last draft saw a number of teams swing for the fences on that top 10 pick, and the safe pick, Courturier, landed in a situation that couldn’t be much better for him-playing fourth line minutes on a contender.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 9:31 AM EST up reply actions  

I hate to say this, but just from running through the numbers/corsi/offensive stats and quality of linemates, Couturier is having a better year then bailey and easily argued the better hockey player right now.

It’s frigging sad, but it’s true. Just look at the stats, linemates, competition, zone starts, offensive production. Couturier is better then Bailey right now.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 4:09 AM EST up reply actions  

I'll accept that, but...

…the comparison will be between Couturier and Strome 5 or 6 years from now. Couturier takes round one, but there’s a ways to go.

Last draft I gotta believe there was more talent #5-#10 than 2008.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 1:54 PM EST up reply actions  

I was just going to say the same thing.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 12:49 AM EST up reply actions  

Just pointing out that, forget about comparing Couturier to Strome (who is still in juniors). He ends up comparing favorably to another first round pick of this organization with three years in the NHL.

Not a direct comparison, obviously, but just throwing that out there.

=d

by AP77 on Jan 13, 2012 1:01 AM EST up reply actions  

*shrugs*

Several teams passed on Couturier. It’s a teenage lottery.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 12:52 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

I was pulling for Couturier

but given we have Rev. Nelson and Cizikas, it probably wasn’t a bad idea to go for the bigger upside. I view Couturier closer in role/style to Nelson and Cizikas- 2 way forwards/center with less offensive flair

by 4PeatSake on Jan 13, 2012 9:54 AM EST up reply actions  

That's a good point too.

And who knows if Petrov, Kabanov, Lee, or Nino will settle into middle-6 roles as well. They may become the kind of linemates who allow Bailey to rack up the assists as a 2nd or 3rd line center.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 1:57 PM EST up reply actions  

Bailey v Couturier

makes no sense. But I will argue that given their organizational needs, Dougie hamilton would have been a better choice than strome.
I have debated both sides of this, but Hamilton, a physical RH defenseman who can move the puck will make a bigger impact than Strome in about 3 years. they just have too many forwards, and no depth on the blue line… today, tomorrow and three years down the line.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 1:15 AM EST up reply actions  

I'd buy that case if I could believe it

D-men are just too hard to anticipate accurately. I don’t mind staying away from them early if you’re not sure (and I read enough people who reasonably wondered how much of an impact Hamilton would make).

I mean, I thought long and hard about Hedman v. Tavares for the same reason. Because if Hedman is what they dreamed and Tavares is just what a lot of scoring forwards become, then I’d take the immovable cornerstone who logs 25 minutes. It’s just too hard to know who that guy is going to be.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:21 AM EST up reply actions  

Awe Topsy

Going into this draft I think the consensus was for us to take hamilton. I read most of the scouting reports and there were some holes… but the first clue that it was a bad choice by Snow was who took him.
Boston took him in front of 4 other highly rated D. they can afford to let him develop properly, and we most likely don’t see him in the NHL until 2014 or 15… but after seeing him at the WJC, I’d say they missed a long term opportunity.
But lile you say, it’s a teenage lottery… it’s just that some balls are bigger than others. Dougy looked very Hamonic for team canada.
the biggest argument:
STROME/Tavares/Nino/Kabanov/Petrov/Lee/Nelson/Ullstrom/Moulson/Grabner/
Bailey/Nielsen/PAP/Martin
Hamilton/Hamonic/deHaan/donovan/macdonald/Katic/Mayfield…drop off

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 1:37 AM EST up reply actions  

Probably

But that still leaves Isles 2-3 years away from a big defenseman prospect stepping on the ice for Isles. So #1 priority this summer will be acquiring a good, big defenseman so that Hamonic doesn’t have to do all the heavy lifting next season. My guess is trade rather than FA.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 1:54 AM EST up reply actions  

Something's gotta give

It would be such a dream if they could unearth the blueline version of a Moulson or Parenteau, but I guess that doesn’t happen.

Even when Snow stated the whole Top 4 goal last spring, I was a little dubious just based on the weak market. Just not a whole lot out there. This summer looks better, but then it always does before some of the juicy targets re-sign/extend. Hopefully they have enough maturing prospects and assets to make a call on a deal if possible.

Of course, when they can’t even cash in Comeau…

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:57 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Exactly.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 3:46 AM EST up reply actions  

We're in year 4

and we’re preparing for YEAR 10. I’m okay with that… but I would have liked to see some progress made with a focus on year 6 or 7.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 1:55 AM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, it seems like they had a shot or two to do that

So maybe Hamonic is one but to our probable misfortune de Haan is the other.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:58 AM EST up reply actions  

If this doesn't end up working out...

…Are the hockey historians going to look back and say Isles didn’t succeed because, “They weren’t bad enough” for the first few years of their rebuild, only ending up with one 1st overall pick?

Maybe Isles are just playing too well for their own good. Maybe aquisions of Moulson, PAP, and Grabner haven’t allowed Isles to be bad enough.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 2:02 AM EST up reply actions  

I don't think you need a historian...

I can write the obit right now.
2006 Circus. Bad ownership decisions (dipietro, committee)
2007 exodus. circus fall-out takes them out of UFA market for 4+ years.
2008 restart. No continuity. Rushed prospects.
2009 JT… wooo!
2010 Injuries point up lack of depth and UFA failures. Coaching change.
2011 Venue fail. UFA failures linger. CAP FLOOR management.
2012 Venue anxiety. Sale rumors. UFA failure. poor asset management.
2013 Venue HIGH ANXIETY. UFA FAILURE. New Coach.
2014 FRENCH LESSONS. New coach that speaks french. New owner that speaks french… new GM.. adeui

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 2:15 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Yeah, it is what it is though. I was made when we passed on Luke Schenn to trade down and draft Bailey.

We did get Hamonic out of that, but I think Hamonic falling into our laps is more of a coincidence then a “garth wants 2 d-men picked in the 2nd round” thing, it was more Bailey love than Hamonic=future shutdown d-man. For god’s sake we drafted Ness ahead of Hamonic there. It would take some frigging miracle for a player of Ness’s size to have a future in the NHL , but Garth took him in the early 2nd. lol

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 3:48 AM EST up reply actions  

How come

When youre talking about Snow trading down to pick, when its guys who disappoint you then you talk about it being the failure of his reasoning/etc. But when its guys you like like Hamonic then its that it just “fell in his lap” and there was no thought process there?

In general, it seems that Snow gets direct blame when its a move people dont like, and no credit when its ones that they do.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 10:52 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

this is true across the board

When looking at the 2008 draft:
1. Trading down for more picks…A
2. Philosophy in general… B
3. Philosphy on Forwards… B+
7 forwards, 2 FT NHLers, 2 PT NHLers, 3 in lower development stages… very good for one draft class. No TOP NHLer keeps this from being an A.
Bailey (NHL)
Trivino (?)
Toews (?)
Petrov (KHL+)
Ullstrom (NHL)
Martin (NHL)
Dibenedetto (NHL – )

4. Philosophy on Defenseman… C+
5 defenseman, 1 TOP NHLer, 1 NHLer(with MN), 2 potential NHLers, 1 in lower development. SIZE drags this class down to a C+. They passed on too many larger defensive defenseman and focused on mid size puck movers… they need more trucks, they drafted camry’s… Hamonic and Donovan could bring this up to a B+ or A next time we evaluate it.
Ness (AHL)
Hamonic (NHL )
Niemi (AHL-)
Donovan (AHL)
Spurgeon (NHL)

So to say that trading down was “bad” because of the picks is not valid. If you look across the NHL the 2008 draft has produced a lot of talent… it was the perfect draft to trade down becasue of depth. Unfortunately, in hindsight, their philosphy can be challenged rather easily. Ness is a gamble you take when you have 2 Hamonics in your system already.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 12:19 PM EST up reply actions  

Rec'd

Like CDH’s shoulders

by Dorfer on Jan 13, 2012 2:38 PM EST up reply actions  

I think people just rate Garth as a higher draft specialist then he really is.

He’s had his hits, and he’s had his misses(or questionable misses right now given how you rate prospects).

All I will say is this, Garth drafted Ness in earlier in the 2nd round than he drafted Hamonic. Garth thought Ness was a better draft choice then Hamonic, Garth thought Ness was gonna be a future NHLer more then he thought Hamonic was. Does that not make you think he’s a mad scientist that gambles as much as any other GM and get’s his wins and his losses? People act like he’s a draft God, I’d say he’s done a little better than average (although the DeHaan pick could blow up in his face as could the Bailey pick, although Bailey is looking better). We talk about these higher end prospects all the time: Kabanov/Lee/Nelson/Petrov, but who’s to say that more then half of them have a future in the NHL? On paper and in reality are 2 different things. There’s still a lot of question marks than wins with garth’s choices right now.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 8:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, not much evidence yet.

But based on the 2008 draft, I’d have to give Garth at least above-average marks for post-1st-round picks.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 14, 2012 2:56 PM EST up reply actions  

That's the point of trading down
but I think Hamonic falling into our laps is more of a coincidence then a "garth wants 2 d-men picked in the 2nd round" thing, it was more Bailey love than Hamonic=future shutdown d-man. For god’s sake we drafted Ness ahead of Hamonic there.

That’s precisely why you trade down though. It’s not because you have brilliant insight that 30 teams will pass on a guy twice that you just know is going to be there, it’s because you want more lottery tickets and hope that one of them is a gem that falls in your lap.

Just taking 2008 Rnd. 2 as an example: Both the Blues and Ducks had TWO picks in that round before the Isles took Ness, and the Panthers had two picks in that round before the Isles got to Hamonic. Names: Markstrom, Philip McRae, Jake Allen (the Blues’ version of Poulin), Eric O’Dell, Justin Schultz, Colby Robak.

The draft, that’s how it goes. Even the experts who know everything still don’t know shit, because there are too many stocks with unpredictable future value and uncertain info.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 14, 2012 3:57 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

The draft, that’s how it goes. Even the experts who know everything still don’t know shit

This is the Draft motto as far as Im concerned lol!

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 14, 2012 4:10 PM EST up reply actions  

Agreed. It's just that some people say trading down there was the "no-brainer", but that's only because how well hamonic panned out.

It could have blown up in our faces, epsecially because top 5 picks are usally higher talents then later overall picks(but it depends how deep the draft it). But it is a crapshoot.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 14, 2012 11:53 PM EST up reply actions  

Wow, I don't even see it as a bad choice now

I remember a Dougie contingent, but no consensus.

I mean, aside from need (which I think is dangerous at that level, but your point about the balance of assets does worry me), if Dougie is Hamonic-lite, and Strome is Skinner or something … whom do you choose? I honestly don’t know.

I tend to see that first pick as purely who you think will be an upper echelon piece, and not who fills needs. I suspect that’s why Gormley dropped some his year (no idea why Fowler dropped the same).

Prospects may be different, but given the way Snow has evaluated D-men I’d prefer he stick to forwards.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:55 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I agree...

you need to go BPA in the top 5. I guess we’ll see how thin the line was when they develop, but if Strome is skinner and Hamilton is Hamonic-lite… I take Hamilton.
skinner is awesome… but he’s a fragile forward… we have a container full of them. More so than Snow has a track record of managing successfully (see Comeau). So I’d rather start to build a surplus of 210+lb D that are mobile and have solid decision making skills, than continue to overstock my shelves with dudes that can dangle.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 2:03 AM EST up reply actions  

"JT and the Dangling Dudes"

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 2:06 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I wasn't big on Hamilton

but right now his PPG is higher than Strome’s. So that’s sobering.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 9:35 AM EST up reply actions  

and ness could beat the shit out of pronger...

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 2:16 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

lol. It could happen. It's not the norm, but weirder stuff has happened.

Just look at the Bailey/Hamonic draft. How many people you think thought Hamonic was gonna be a better d-man than a lot of the d-men chosen in the 1st round ahead of him? Hell, Garth even though Ness was gonna be better than Hamonic. Time will tell, but it wouldn’t be impossible. Look how much Erik Johnson’s been struggling since being a 1st overall pick? Who would have thought Hamonic would be better than him? Who would have thought 3rd overall pick Jack Johnson with impressive skating speed and o-instincts would not be able to grasp how to play in his own zone as a d-man? Do you know who Cam Barker is? Neither do I but he was a 3rd overall d-man bust. D-men have a high bust ratio usually when taken very early, they are more of a crapshoot then forwards. It’s not impossible or out of the question, and a number of scouts had their concerns about Dougie, time will tell though. Strome has high-end offensive hands, we just have to see if he’s capable of putting up pts with them in the NHL. Enough of my rabbling.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 4:20 AM EST up reply actions  

and here in lies the problem...
Hell, Garth even though Ness was gonna be better than Hamonic.

I believe this, along with the whole calvin deHancing with the stars scenario is why Jankowski no longer sips his coffe from an Islander mug.
Anybody in the NHL draft can have an epiphany, find a coach that clicks, benefit from a late growth spurt…whatever.
But when you say Mayfield might be better than Hamilton… that’s like betting on a 30-1 shot. He could win, but the general consensus is that the 2-1 shot is a better horse going into the gate. When the gate opens, you hope that YOUR INFO is better than everybody else’s… possible… not likely.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 10:55 AM EST up reply actions  

You get the feeling sometimes that they try to outsmart the draft

I think they know the only chance at high end talent is through the draft so they are trying to go with the high-risk high reward pick hoping they find a diamond in the rough that far exceeds the position they are drafting at. If they have endless scouting resources to be that much smarter than the field, I would say go for it, but for now it seems they over reach on each of their picks.

by Hockey1919 on Jan 13, 2012 12:11 PM EST up reply actions  

Strome...

must have really wowed them to pass up Hamilton. I think we can agree from what we’ve seen that Strome will probably be a higher profile player than hamilton… but I contend that Hamilto moves the franchise further, and faster than Strome.
Who knows really… it is a crap shoot afterall.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 12:22 PM EST up reply actions  

I do get that "outsmart" feeling

And I wonder if part of that is from internal pressure that this is their only route to get free talent over their peers.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 14, 2012 4:01 PM EST up reply actions  

To clarify, I wasn’t making a direct comparison between Bailey and Couturier.

It’s just that we’re seeing Couturier have a bit of success in his first year out of juniors and we’re still, three years later, waiting to see Bailey do a goddamn thing. It’s annoying to see the Flyers be able to cash in almost immediately while the Isles are, naturally, still flailing around with their first round (non-JT) picks as always.

=d

by AP77 on Jan 13, 2012 1:28 AM EST up reply actions  

I agree with the "annoying" part of it...

…especially after Couturier’s goal tonight.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 1:34 AM EST up reply actions  

on the flip side...

do you think fans stay awake at night wondering why one of their middle second rounders can’t play shut down D for 25minutes a night with a sixth round partner.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 1:48 AM EST up reply actions  

Also, don't discount the environment

One guy goes to a stable, Cup-credible team full of All-Stars and Hall of Famers with very good coaching and an expectation of a high level of excellence from a building full of fans.

Another guy goes to a team that has never, in his lifetime, been anything but a laughingstock and plays with journeymen and has-beens under the constantly looming specter of relocation or, at the very least, a ton more losing in front of thousands of empty seats.

Not that these are excuses. But I’m with Dom – it’s a lottery with teenagers. There are literally hundreds of variables deciding what kind of player they’re going to end up as. I wanted Couturier, too. I’m pissed that the Flyers, of all people, have him. But for all we know, Strome might score 500 goals in his career. Or I could win an Oscar. Anything’s possible.

"He's depriving some small village of a pretty good idiot" - Mike Milbury on Ziggy Palffy's agent. On Twitter: @Dan_of_Science

by PGI on Jan 13, 2012 9:50 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

The GM has to take some repsonsibility for who they draft
it’s a lottery with teenagers

It may be a lottery, but it isn’t a crap shoot. You can’t pretend scouting isn’t just as important as pure random luck either.

I’m not going to piss and moan about Strome vs Couturier either, since one hasn’t even played a game in the NHL and the other, although playing very well, doesn’t have HHOF writtern all over him just yet either.

In another post I was wondering why is it that Turris is a bargaining chip for Phoenix to get a defenseman and Bailey is being considered a bust? Bailey has outplayed him in all facets in one less season and yet some GMs can extract value for a malcontent that won’t even sign before camp.

by Hockey1919 on Jan 13, 2012 10:12 AM EST up reply actions  

Sorry for the double header, but the attached post didn’t appear, so I blame SBN gremlins.

it’s a lottery with teenagers

It may bea lottery, but it isn’t a crap shoot. It isn’t just pure luck and scouting has to be considered part of the equation. I don’t even have a problem with Strome vs Couturier either. One hasn’t played and NHL game and the other, while playing very well, isn’t a sure fire HHOF either.

I had this discussion on another thread on how we value our own players. Bailey is a “disappointment”, but Turris was valuable enough to get a high end defensive prospect. Bailey in one less season since his draft class and has out produced Turris in every category. Add on that Turris was a malcontent that wouldn’t sign and I see Bailey as having far more upside, but in Islander circles he’s considered a bust. I am curious how some GMs can find value when other can’t?

by Hockey1919 on Jan 13, 2012 10:17 AM EST up reply actions  

Oh, I agree that it's important to try to draft the best players

But, at the same time, there’s a lot that can change from the time he’s a pimply-faced kid in an ill-fitting hat on a podium and the put-up-or-shut-up time on the ice. Alexandre Daigle will always be that example. But so will Henrik Lundqvist.

I don’t think Bailey is a bust at all. But I’m also of the mind that he’s only 22. We’ve all seen young talent shipped out before they had time to find out what kind of player they’re ultimately gonna be best at.

"He's depriving some small village of a pretty good idiot" - Mike Milbury on Ziggy Palffy's agent. On Twitter: @Dan_of_Science

by PGI on Jan 13, 2012 10:30 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

And I designated you...

THE CONSENSUS.

There… problem solved. :-)

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 11:58 AM EST up reply actions  

I was mad that we passed on Couturier, but after seeing Strome's hands, I have to think at worst he turns out to another Parenteau.

But Couturier is looking pretty good right now, as expected.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 1:41 AM EST up reply actions  

Strome already has a better shot than PAP

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 1:44 AM EST up reply actions  

Ehhh, not till he scores some NHL goals will I say that.

Visually, Nino has an excellent heavy and accurate shot, but he ain’t scoring yet. lol. I’ll wait to see him produce in the NHL before I say that, but I think 40pts/yr PAP is a good basement for Strome, or you could say his basement is schremp, but he is bigger and should have more defense then that, so 40pts 3rd liner “should” be Strome’s basement. I’m just tyring to put a perspective on it.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 3:45 AM EST up reply actions  

Fair enough.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 2:14 PM EST up reply actions  

Would have loved having Hamilton

My draft order was (if I’m not mistaken) Couturier/hamilton/Zibanejad/Strome.

Every time I see Couturier collecting points as a 4th line center it makes me wonder why GS didn’t select a player who was supposed to be the no.1 pick.

Then you have Hamilton who really fits a need. Big, puck-moving d-man with smarts. Playing exceptionally well at the WJC.

But I’m not sure I’m disappointed with the Ryan Strome pick. I have yet to figure out what kind of drafting strategy GS use (if he has one that is) but I’m thinking he picked Strome as a back-up for Josh Bailey. If Bailey doesn’t develop to a 2nd- line center, Strome could potentially fill that role. If Bailey does become that kind of center, Strome could easily be moved to wing together with JT (who could also move to wing and having RS playing center. Unlikely scenario though).

And maybe they see Brock Nelson as their future big, puck protecting, 2-way minded centerman? Remember, Brock was also a first rounder (although a late one) and therefore GS and his staff felt it wasn’t necessary to draft a player like Couturier. As I said, we really don’t know their strategy when drafting. It seems though like they are not using the BPA strategy.

Another point worth considering is that Ryan Strome is right- handed which I feel is much more important than having a right handed defenseman. Because he is right handed he can potentially be used in the same PP as JT which, if Strome develops nicely, could be a really scary one.

by DavidSweden on Jan 13, 2012 1:49 PM EST up reply actions  

I was frustrated last night when...

…Nielsen received the puck at the half-boards and defense had time to re-set because Frans is a lefty.

Even more than Strome becoming a good top-6 forward, I have faith in Strome becoming the threat from the left side that Isles haven’t had in a while.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 2:18 PM EST up reply actions  

It happens soo often

even at even strength during cycles…you almost wonder if that turn and pivot hesitation is what gets our guys “crushed” so often. Probably doesn’t help any.

NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey

by Keith Quinn on Jan 13, 2012 2:46 PM EST up reply actions  

Bring back Comeau!

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 14, 2012 4:04 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't watch the Flyers often, so maybe I'm missing something

But why did they need to sign Bryzgalov? Bobrovsky looks pretty good to me.

"He's depriving some small village of a pretty good idiot" - Mike Milbury on Ziggy Palffy's agent. On Twitter: @Dan_of_Science

by PGI on Jan 12, 2012 10:14 PM EST via mobile reply actions  

Look at Bob’s split stats to end the season, he faltered down the stretch. He’s not going to keep at this level through the rest of the season, too young and not enough games played.

"Line brawl på Long Island!? Matt Moulson i huvudrollen!!!?! Wot!?" SwedishIslander
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.

by Mark D on Jan 12, 2012 10:15 PM EST up reply actions  

Couldnt that be simply because he was used to KHL scheduling?

I mean I doubt hed ever played more than 40 games a season before, so theoretically couldnt they have just signed a good backup (ie not Brian Boucher) and let him develop for another season or 2 and adapt to the NHL schedule instead of trading the farm away for Bryz, who so far has been significantly worse than Bobrovsky?

"Mario Lemiuex… I used to respect you."- Turgeon1992

by Zhora on Jan 12, 2012 10:23 PM EST up reply actions  

yea, but who knows how long it would take him to get acclimated to a longer season. They needed someone to split games with him at the very least.

But I do agree that it was an awful deal, they should have gotten someone short term (2-3 years) that could help bring Bob along and split starts, instead of breaking the farm on Ilya.

But when Bob was off, he looked really, really bad. Remember when the Isles lit him up in the final game last year?

"Line brawl på Long Island!? Matt Moulson i huvudrollen!!!?! Wot!?" SwedishIslander
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.

by Mark D on Jan 12, 2012 10:28 PM EST up reply actions  

true

And in Philly’s defense, they’ve had goalie problems since Hextall left town. They’ve tried everything and the pressure was enormous to finally “fix it for good”. So they reached a bit on Bryz’ deal when it would have been much smarter to take on Vokoun at a discount the way Washington did.

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Jan 12, 2012 10:44 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah by "good backup" i meant like a goalie that could handle 30-40 starts

More along the lines of having a 1A-1B goalie rotation instead of started backup. Brian Elliot wouldve been perfect for them this year (if he can keep this up)

"Mario Lemiuex… I used to respect you."- Turgeon1992

by Zhora on Jan 12, 2012 10:51 PM EST up reply actions  

*Starter/backup

"Mario Lemiuex… I used to respect you."- Turgeon1992

by Zhora on Jan 12, 2012 10:51 PM EST up reply actions  

Could be. Teams were picking him high as last season wore on. (Isles maybe needed to do that tonight.)

But regardless, the Bryz move was wrong if they were going to make that kind of commitment, which is the only kind of commitment Bryz was going to take, apparently.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 12, 2012 10:40 PM EST up reply actions  

Instant rec.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 12, 2012 10:40 PM EST up reply actions  

T Gillies sighting

…I saw Trevor Gillies in a Stop-and-Shop up here in CT a few days ago. I didn’t say anything to him because he had that crazy look in his eyes…. He looks taller than 6’3" in person.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 12:08 AM EST up reply actions  

Crazy?

Like this?

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 12:19 AM EST up reply actions  

That's the one!

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 12:26 AM EST up reply actions  

I do miss Trevor.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 12:41 AM EST up reply actions  

Me too

"We owe him a lot more than he owes us at this point. He's been stellar all year. He still gave us a chance to win this one, and we've got to find a way."

—C Josh Bailey, on G Al Montoya after a 5-3 loss Tuesday in Montreal.

by BobbyNystromOwnsYou on Jan 13, 2012 4:00 PM EST up reply actions  

Did he have the mohawk? lol

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 3:43 AM EST up reply actions  

After the Horn Talbot Continued to Pester the Refs

Very animated out near center ice, whining like the douchebag he is.

I know there are no “good” losses, but the Islanders dominated big chunks of this game, and if some of our prospects are as advertised, Isles will have better talent than the Flyers up and down the line-up in another year or so. The Richards and Carter deals put Philly back.

by rmblifn on Jan 13, 2012 12:11 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Funny how he can do that and its PERFECTLY FINE.

But if Frans just says “come on give us a chance” (after an UNfair call, no less!) then BOOM its punishment time.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 12:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Look at this stupidity.

Look at it. {link}

Fully expecting a suspension… clear check to the head… holy SHIT are people stupid.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 12:35 AM EST up reply actions  

If you pause it right at 20 seconds

it may be shoulder to the head…doesn’t look targeted. Definitely not elbow, that comes up on the follow through from that angle. I think really it is a hard hit that whiplashes Talbot’s head forward into Staios’ shoulder.

Could see it going either way though…none of the angles are real good.

NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
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by Keith Quinn on Jan 13, 2012 12:42 AM EST up reply actions  

I saw what youre referring to

And I think its his head going down and hitting his arm, not his arm hitting his head. Thats kind of like what you said.
It was not a head “shot” though- not at all.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 12:44 AM EST up reply actions  

This is the Pronger clip I was speaking of

Granted, this is from last year’s Rule 48 video (which I found stupid at the time: “an example of a legal shoulder check to the head”) but it was interesting how similar the plays are. Video at 2:55.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 12:57 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Travis also has a post up

Complete with indignation…but honestly, I can’t see how anyone can see crap from any of the replays…nothing is up close enough.

NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey

by Keith Quinn on Jan 13, 2012 1:00 AM EST up reply actions  

Also

I think this is more Weight on Sutter than the Pronger one…that one was all head from the side. In the Weight one, the bigger difference was that Sutter leaned way more forward…Talbot doesn’t lean at all.

NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey

by Keith Quinn on Jan 13, 2012 1:02 AM EST up reply actions  

Wait

Talbot didn’t lean at all, Sutter did … I’m confused. You’re saying it is more like Weight/Sutter than Pronger because of the angle or…?

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:05 AM EST up reply actions  

Yes, the angle is more Weight/Sutter than pronger

but the difference between tonight’s hit and Weight/Sutter is that Sutter lunged forward a lot and dropped his head…this is more straight up.

You don’t think?

NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey

by Keith Quinn on Jan 13, 2012 1:08 AM EST up reply actions  

I guess I'm not focused on the angle

So much as the situation. To me Weight/Sutter is completely blameless and above questioning: Open ice hit, and Sutter lunged at the last second at his own peril. Even in today’s standard Shanny would absolve it under the “movement/change of direction just before contact.”

This one just seemed more like Pronger to me because the winger who receives an outlet is a sitting duck, and a pinching defenseman can Phaneuf him as much as he wants to. So personally I think the burden is on the D-man to be careful. But I can’t tell on the replays here … Staios looked careful and might have been shoulder to chest or head … the incriminating part comes from the extension afterward, which isn’t real evidence.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:11 AM EST up reply actions  

Yeah that's my point too

I guess the closest you can come lately is Phaneuf/Sauer.

That arm extension is really just a natural physics reaction to impact a lot of times thought isn’t it?

Puck Daddy has one up now too (where you’re quoted)

It certainly isn’t comparable to the Subban one as far as elbowing goes (caveat that the replay sucks).

NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey

by Keith Quinn on Jan 13, 2012 1:22 AM EST up reply actions  

Agreed

Those arm follow throughs (like Gillies-Clusterbuck) are always misleading.

Why must there always be a “c” in “Dominick”? Do I look f$%^ing Italian?

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:30 AM EST up reply actions  

No 'k' in the Italian alphabet

So not Italian either. Picking nits, Domenico is the proper Italian version, and is most often modified to Dominic for Italian-Americans.

Just keeping it real for my peoples…

Clusterbuck is completely accurate though.

Success was survival and, kid, it still is

by IslesFanInNJ on Jan 13, 2012 8:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Yeah I know

But normally they just go straight with “Dominic” when messing mine up.

I pictured this version as some teeth-pulling begrudging compromise.

It’s better than French and Africans pronouncing it “Dominique” to me though.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 14, 2012 4:06 PM EST up reply actions  

And

to boot, either he should have been sent to the room (as Travis notes) or they should re-write the rule as a dive or he should be given a delay of game or unsportsmanlike or something.

There really shouldn’t be any black or white about it. If you stay down, and claim headshot, and the other guy has the potential to be tossed from the game or suspended, they should be adhering to the concussion protocol or the guy gets a diving penalty.

I thought there was no “no, I’m good” anymore…again, another reason I don’t care much about player concussions.

NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey

by Keith Quinn on Jan 13, 2012 1:06 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Yeah, it's ridiculous that he could stay on the bench.

And use his Lavi Platinum Card on top of it.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:12 AM EST up reply actions  

And get the assist on the Couturier goal

NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey

by Keith Quinn on Jan 13, 2012 1:23 AM EST up reply actions  

Ah, didn't catch that

I love it. Plenty of us are practically begging for a reason* for Staios to be out of the lineup, and we still can’t see the clear case.

Oh well. Fans.

*unless it cures Mottau’s concussion

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:31 AM EST up reply actions  

the key to that video...

for me are two things.
1. for this not to be penalized you must be a flyer, a penguin or have a former employee of your organization running the show… or a show. That is a clear predatory hit to me… Pronger-esque.
2. “you must be aware of who is on the ice” REALLY? “Okay guys, Pronger’s out there tonight, so don’t bend at the knees at all, because that puts your head right in his wheelhouse”… and it applies to Talbot as well. “Matt martin is out there tonight, max… so if you feel any contact at all, go down and turtle…”, “will do, coach!”

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 1:08 AM EST up reply actions  

#2

Yeah, wasn’t that awesome? “Be aware of who is on the ice: If it’s a dirty superstar, we’ll look the other way and put it on the nightly highlights at nhl.com.”

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:13 AM EST up reply actions  

I didn't see a hit to the head...

same way i didn’t see the hit to the head on clutterbuck. The damage is done when he hits the ice.
Like Gillies on Clutterbuck, the mistake (possibly suspendable?) is that it appears that staios makes contact with his hands at chest level.
The thing with Gillies was the review was in a closed room and the term “elbow” was being thrown around. It was clear that any contact above the chest was made after the initial contact with the chest. It’s not that clear in this case.
We’ve seen THE PErfECT HIT by gillies in pre-season, and even the LET UP by Martin. If Staios gets days for this, I’d be surprised… but not shocked.
What was your opinion of the hit?

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 12:44 AM EST up reply actions  

That is awesome. :)

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 10:35 AM EST up reply actions  

Grabner breakaway problems

I get the feeling Grabner’s breakaway problems are because he doesn’t seem to pay attention to what the goalie is doing before he makes his shot. I think he has his move made up in his mind beforehand, and thus doesn’t react (quickly enough if at all) to adjust to the goalie’s position/weakness. Any thoughts?

by Uwe43 on Jan 12, 2012 10:19 PM EST reply actions  

to me..

it seems like he’s always a one deke kind of guy… his breakaways always seem to come in wide from an angle…. and then either cut it back to either the forehand or backhand (based on what side he’s coming down) and I think the goalies can just read that easily.. not a lot of dramatic moves

he also likes to shoot the puck right at the goalie, which makes scoring tough.

by BaltimoreIslander on Jan 12, 2012 10:22 PM EST up reply actions  

I think Grabs stick is to long

It’s great for the pokecheck on the PK but bad for dekes.

by deeco on Jan 12, 2012 10:37 PM EST via Android app up reply actions   1 recs

good point

I also think he tries to keep it simple to make sure he gets a shot. He’s not a “seven moves and bend the shot like Blyleven’s curve” kind of guy.

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Jan 12, 2012 10:45 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Blylevin's curve...

Sweet reference. That dude could spin it.

by CloseCallJiggs on Jan 13, 2012 11:11 AM EST up reply actions  

I could buy that: Decides his move first and sticks with it.

If on breakaways you have two general options — pick a spot, or make a move — then you still need to be flexible enough to react if 1) the spots aren’t open, or 2) the goalie is not biting to make your move possible.

I really think if he wants to try the move he did tonight, he needs to not position his body so open that way; he needs to open his blade up for the forehand possibility while keeping his body more straightforward to sell the possibility of a backhand deke.

Of course on the second one, even if Bob was able to read where he was going, that was still just a fantastic save. Backhand high from that distance is a good bet.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 12, 2012 10:43 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Agreed. And I don't see much confidence when he does it.

But the “3rd” faceoff where Bob robbed him looked exactly like how he should take every “breakaway” shot: full speed and skating “across” the crease instead of taking a shot in front.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 3:40 AM EST up reply actions  

He isn't much better when he thinks about it than when he doesn't, with Grabner breakway goals are about quantity.

You would think on Penalty shot situations he would be “worse” since he has time to decide what he wants to do and in-game breakaways are all about deciding in the moment, but I’ve seen no evidence.

Let’s face it, he scores often on the breakways, because he creates so many. The thing that creates the space (speed) is what takes away his time to decide what to do. I think our best bet is to hope he enjoys the benefit of volume and keeps the opposing team on its heels.

by Hockey1919 on Jan 13, 2012 10:27 AM EST up reply actions  

Indeed.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 14, 2012 4:08 PM EST up reply actions  

And the hit didn't cost Isles anything

…except a rush up ice.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 12, 2012 10:50 PM EST up reply actions  

He's been one of the better of the new guys

Seems to care, stuck up for the team once or twice.

If we had a better D-crew he would make a good 6th guy.

"We owe him a lot more than he owes us at this point. He's been stellar all year. He still gave us a chance to win this one, and we've got to find a way."

—C Josh Bailey, on G Al Montoya after a 5-3 loss Tuesday in Montreal.

by BobbyNystromOwnsYou on Jan 13, 2012 8:54 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Yeah, you don't notice him that much.

Which for a Defensive – defenseman is not a bad thing. Same with Eaton, i don’t notice him much either, so in my mind that makes them “not horrible” which translates to “pretty good” in Islanders terms.

by Les Beaver on Jan 13, 2012 9:50 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

He's like Pandolfo

he’s good in spurts, but you better change the oil (nights off) pretty frequently or he’ll sieze up.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 10:02 AM EST up reply actions  

But those penalties

are a real bitch. Given how fiew the Isles are taking lately, he has to have about 1/3 of them. If he could cut that down, we’d be in great shape because the PK is humming almost as nicely as the PP.

NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey

by Keith Quinn on Jan 13, 2012 10:12 AM EST up reply actions  

Oh

I don’t like him at all. I don’t like any of our bottom three. But given what we have he seems serviceable until he’s on fumes, which doesn’t seem to take too long to reach.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 10:22 AM EST up reply actions  

Those penalties are a killer, especially since he is a veteran defenseman that should either know better or get the benefit of the doubt.

He seems to get be neither. I wouldn’t mind him being a sixth guy for PK duty in our own end, but the penalties worry me even in those situations. You can’t go down 5 on 3 very often.

by Hockey1919 on Jan 13, 2012 10:29 AM EST up reply actions  

Good question

It will probably be added once they realize the oversight.

Then again, it's just an Islanders goal.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 12, 2012 10:46 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Why didn't Talbot have to go to the quite room?

I thought when a player is too dazed to get up for several seconds (this seemed like 30-40), he automatically has to go to the quite room for at least a few minutes.

I couldn’t tell from any of the angles they showed whether Staios hit Talbot in the head.

Is it possible Talbot was embellishing?

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 12, 2012 10:52 PM EST reply actions  

Sweet, kindly Maxime Talbot?

I have no idea what you're insinuating.

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Jan 12, 2012 10:58 PM EST up reply actions  

They must've thought he was still a Penguin

Different rules.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 12, 2012 11:06 PM EST up reply actions  

That's a low blow (to the head)

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 12:10 AM EST up reply actions  

Talbot is such a douche.

Seriously… an annoying, pansy-ass, wolf-crying, full-of-shit actress.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 12:37 AM EST up reply actions  

I thought Talbot looked like he was trying to audition for a lifetime movie after that hit. The angle looked clean enough, not predatory, and I think Talbot wanted to see how far he could push it.

Tick-tock, tick-tock, tick-tock...

by Turgeon1992 on Jan 13, 2012 6:56 AM EST via mobile up reply actions   1 recs

i would like to hear one just one islander

Could be coach, player, ice girl just express that they are f’n sick of losing to the flyers. I despise the lack of passion on this vanilla team.

by randyboyd on Jan 12, 2012 11:15 PM EST via mobile reply actions  

You actually believe that you saw a "lack of passion" tonight?

Wow.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 12:50 AM EST up reply actions  

Seriously

We outshot and outhit the FLYERS. We lost because the refs f*cked us and because Bobrovsky stood on his head. Nothing to do with lack of passion

"Mario Lemiuex… I used to respect you."- Turgeon1992

by Zhora on Jan 13, 2012 12:54 AM EST up reply actions  

I agree that...

…Isles outplayed Flyers.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 12:57 AM EST up reply actions  

there's a lot to complain about...

but not passion… not tonight… not for a while.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 12:56 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

i saw a team which played well

But still lost their 26th of 28 vs a divisional rival, but seemed content to have played a good game. Saw a coach go 5 under NHL .500 tell us how many things his ream did right. Saw a group which controlled a large part of the play and outshot their opponent, but showed little interest in getting in front and getting a dirty one. The “we wuz robbed” by the ref, by the goalie, etc doesn’t cut it. Bob was great but there was little traffic in front of him and the isles got to very few of his rebounds. The grit that it takes to win a game like this was absent and the excuse making is unacceptable in their situation.

by randyboyd on Jan 13, 2012 3:40 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

I don't think grit would've won them this game

This was one of those games where the team played well enough to win but didn’t. Winning teams look at these games and say “hey, these games happen once in a while”.

The problem is the Isles aren’t a winning team and these games happen more often than not. You’re right, the team seems to be complacent with moral victories when games like these come around. They should be more mad they don’t win these games.

I’d like to see Capuano say “we played well enough to win, but the bottom line is we didn’t, and this team needs to start winning.” Moral victories was for last season. Be ok with the way you played but be angry you didn’t get that victory. If this team ever wants to be an above-.500 team again, they need to start winning, period.

The New York Islanders: saving their best for the wrong conference since '05

by Chris McNally on Jan 13, 2012 4:02 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

You got my point

I call it passion or grit, but what I am talking about is the attitiude of a team that does not accept “good” losses or moral victories. I see that creeping in here and I don’t like it.

by randyboyd on Jan 13, 2012 9:19 AM EST up reply actions  

I think the problem is this:

Philadelphia is a much better team than the Islanders. If the Flyers show up to play, even if the Islanders play at 110%, the Flyers are going to win. Same with the Bruins, Penguins and even the Red Wings. It’s not a lack of passion or grit, some times it just comes down to talent. The Islanders are not the most talented team, but they can pull off wins when those better teams underestimate them. That’s why they do so well against the West, those teams don’t always show up. The Flyers, Pens, Bruins, etc know the Islanders can play, so they generally come to play.

by Les Beaver on Jan 13, 2012 9:55 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

There is no question

that we do not match well against Philly the last few years. They have fast, physical forwards and their power play seems to baffle our PK, even when it’s good. To me, that still doesn’t expalin losing 26 of 28. for example, last night was lost because of a terrible touch by Nabby excacerbated by him looking off the puckholder to the guy coming in front at the wrong second and cheating off of his post ever so slightly. We all seem to agree that, on balance, the isles controlled more of the play last night. It was clear to me, however, that they were not driving hard to the net and not taking the extra effort to get in for the rebounds. While they played well, that extra drive to finally beat a rival who is all out embarassing you with a ridiculous streak was not there.

This attitude reappeared in the post game comments where I was waiting for someone to express utter disgust about the fact that they have been dominated by the Flyers for so long. Hearing excuses about goalies and refs and talk of a great effort, to me , is part of the underlying psychological problem which has the team where it is, both in the standings and against Philly. I always remember Wayne Gretzky describing the moment that the isles taught him and the Oilers how to win. After the deciding game in the 83 cup that the isles won, he looked into the Isles dressing room. The 4 time champs were battered, bruised, visibly exhausted and, to Gretzky, strangely quiet for a team which had just won a championship. In contrast, the Oilers were relatively energetic and unscathed. it was at that point that perhaps histories’ greatest player learned that it takes more than talent to win. The isles left it all on the ice and the Oilers didn’t. You don’t get to that point by accepting “good” losses and moral victories. It’s these small steps that I don’t see this team taking with it’s present leadership.

by randyboyd on Jan 13, 2012 10:55 AM EST up reply actions  

That's all true, but the Oilers were also a great team that got the finals by being energetic and unscathed.

The Islanders are no where near that point. There’s no point in being miserable and down after every loss, especially when it’s obvious you held your own against a better team. If this were Columbus, that’s one thing. But it’s not. It’s a bigger, faster, stronger, wiser team – it’s a team the Islanders have to become more like. It’s more a “we have a long way to go…” then, “we should be where they are now.” That’s not realistic.

by Les Beaver on Jan 13, 2012 11:52 AM EST up reply actions  

I think these Islanders do leave it all on the ice

The problem is, there isn’t as much to leave as the great dynasty teams… or even the current Flyers. They did show passion, they owned much of the play, and I’m not sure what tossing around a bunch of sticks and stuff afterward will do for them. They even drove to the net a bunch of times – notably MacDonald and Martin – but didn’t get goals out of it.

Difference of opinion is what makes a horse race. You have every right to snarl about a loss and wish the Isles did too. I suspect that the Isles have plenty of guys who don’t take this sort of thing lightly, but who also don’t mouth off to the press about it – different approach. Doug Allen does the growling, and Doug Weight works the refs, and guys like Tavares and Parenteau definitely hate losing. You could see how frustrated Tavares was after the game when the Isles couldn’t get back into the zone after the second goal.

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Jan 13, 2012 2:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Alternatively
I was waiting for someone to express utter disgust about the fact that they have been dominated by the Flyers for so long.

The other option is that such disgust is already a given among people who discuss this team day after day, and rather than repeat the same frustrations, you observe what might’ve been different in that night’s game.

The Islanders simply aren’t in the position of the 1983 Oilers, so while that was a great turning point (one I’ve quoted often), I just don’t think it applies to their situation here. It’s not like they have the talent to say, “we just need to sacrifice more and we’ll win” that the Oilers did.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 14, 2012 4:15 PM EST up reply actions  

In all honesty, sometimes things just don't go your way even though you outplay the other team.

You can blame whatever you want, refs important bad call, lack of finishers on our team, Nabokov brain fart on the Simmonds goal, Nabokov stupid penalty on Briere(questionable or not), Grabner not finishing his 1 on nones, etc. Point is, we outplayed them and lost the game for one reason or another. This happens, especially to teams who are less skilled then their opponents. When the margin of error is so thin, things like this happen. Bob also played awesome, but it was more then that lost us this game.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 4:25 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Agreed, I think this is overdone

They’ve had plenty of “that isn’t good enough” comments. This is one of those games where they frankly shouldn’t get too down on themselves.

As far as getting to the net, that was one of the few good things the Flyers did last night: Focus on protecting that area and boxing out well. There were Islanders there, they just found competitors willing to match them in the battle.

What was the quote a GM gave Gabe Desjardins? Something about, “The hardest thing in hockey is to convince your team they played poorly after a win and convince them they played well after a loss.” This is the reality of this sport.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 14, 2012 4:12 PM EST up reply actions  

Hear, Hear

No offense to the always classy Streit. But this needs to happen.

"He's depriving some small village of a pretty good idiot" - Mike Milbury on Ziggy Palffy's agent. On Twitter: @Dan_of_Science

by PGI on Jan 13, 2012 9:59 AM EST up reply actions  

Its not happening.

The team is not stripping the C of a player who is signed & playing here to give it to someone else.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 11:12 AM EST up reply actions  

Never say never

Islanders example-they took it from Gillies. Worked out in that case.

Who knows, Streit might want to step aside. Not impossible to imagine it happening.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 11:15 AM EST up reply actions  

Who knows the real story behind that.....

I don’t remember them taking from Gillies. I remember him asking not to be the captain anymore.

by NHL fan on Jan 13, 2012 11:35 AM EST up reply actions  

Sorry

I should have wrote they switched it from Gillies. Didn’t mean to imply he was stripped. Poor word choice.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 11:36 AM EST up reply actions  

I didn't say they needed to strip Streit of the captaincy

Maybe he gives it up willingly a ‘la Clark Gillies or Patrik Elias. Or they decide as a team to choose a new one next year. Again, I love Streit. But the sooner JT’s given the keys full time, the better.

"He's depriving some small village of a pretty good idiot" - Mike Milbury on Ziggy Palffy's agent. On Twitter: @Dan_of_Science

by PGI on Jan 13, 2012 11:15 AM EST up reply actions  

I wouldn't go so far as to strip it from Streit

He is far too classy a guy to treat that way. But if he were to see the writing on the wall and step aside, that would be ok with me. It doesn’t really matter though, in a way, JT is already taking on the role despite the lack of a C on his sweater.

by CloseCallJiggs on Jan 13, 2012 12:53 PM EST up reply actions  

It ain't broke, I don't think

…so why try to fix it? Streit has been a leader this season, but JT is the go-to guy. Why put more pressure on JT by making him Captain when he is playing so well?

Unless Streit is traded, I don’t see any big advantage of making JT Captain this season.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 2:26 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

My guess is Streit took the C in order to free up Tavares to concentrate on his game

He doesn’t have to be any more of a media guy and PR sort than he already is as the team’s cornerstone.

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Jan 13, 2012 2:32 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

TO ME...WIN WIN WIN

Hey, let’s face it, once again the season is just about over. But when you get efforts like this it illustrates just how entertaining hockey can be when your team is ENGAGED.
+ JT line extending its string of awesomeness.
+ Nabby putting on a bit of a circus act… some good.. 8 second of bad.
+ Kyle scoring…
+ Grabs back(?)… maybe making a better connection with Bailey… and on the PK. Is the gremlin sleeping better since he proposed?
+ excellent night from matt martin
+ Maybe the best night of the season from Rolston… yeah, I said it.
+ Amac… back(?)… we can hope so.
+ PP moved the puck and got opportunities… just got BOBBED!
+ One silly turn of events away from making this go the other way. Instead of the Isles being on a 4 minute PP to end the first (high stick drawn by AMAC), they are called on a penalty you don’t see too often. While continuing motion from playing the puck EN hits somebody SKATING THROUGH THE CREASE with his glove… and gets called for TRIPPING… I THINK THAT’S CALLED BUZZING… and how the whole flightless fowl incident started.

Maybe it’s time for Haley and Olson against divisional foes. Hey… what can it hurt.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 12, 2012 11:49 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

I may be alone on this...

…but I thought Nabby intentionally stuck his glove out to interfere. I’d give him a lot of blame for each of the 1st two goals. But before that he was stellar—saved a goal or two.

Yeah, no call on AMac’s bloody mouth. And that other high stick (on Wallace?) appeared to be an intentional high stick. (Didn’t look like Flyer was trying to lift his stick in the replay.) Could have easily been 8 minutes right there instead of 2.

Also, the referee on the right side of the ice (camera facing benches right) wasn’t calling cross-checking at all in the 2nd period. Isles could have cross-checked a lot more in the 3rd so long as the ref was consistent.

+Two big checks for Jurcina. That’s part of the reason Isles were winning most of the battles throughout the game. (If teams don’t play physically against Flyers, there’s typically no chance of winning.)

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 12:22 AM EST up reply actions  

100% agree, JP.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 12:38 AM EST up reply actions  

Briere

What a fucking surprise.

Official choice of Lighthouse Dog #1.

by Fabtraption on Jan 13, 2012 10:54 AM EST up reply actions  

I think

it was Carle, not Briere, which is odd.

I think they were fine to call a trip, but they needed to call a dive too, because that one was blatant.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 11:07 AM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, that's true in this instance

Player’s response: “If I don’t dive, ref doesn’t call interference.”

Not in reference to this example, but: In some instances, it is a catch-22. If player doesn’t dive, interference is not called. If player does dive, matching minors are called.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 2:30 PM EST up reply actions  

It was more of the same

Like the Montoya-Winnik “interference” from the Colorado game. There used to be a presumption that the goalie had the right-of-way within his crease to be where he wanted, and there was a little leeway in calling things. Nabokov can’t just grab or trip the guy, but tapping him with the glove as he goes by? That’s nothing. It looked like he was just applying the tag to a runner on the baseline. It’s needlessly ticky-tack.

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Jan 13, 2012 2:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Since Haley over Pandolfo will likely never happen. Might as well go Haley over Wallace eventually.

Haley isn’t as smart of a hockey player, but he does bring bigger hits and fisticuffs.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 3:42 AM EST up reply actions  

We can only dream, bro. Only dream.

"We owe him a lot more than he owes us at this point. He's been stellar all year. He still gave us a chance to win this one, and we've got to find a way."

—C Josh Bailey, on G Al Montoya after a 5-3 loss Tuesday in Montreal.

by BobbyNystromOwnsYou on Jan 13, 2012 3:19 PM EST up reply actions  

The Islanders played great. I honestly have no problem with the skaters.

The 2nd goal was entirely Nabokovs fault.

And the refs missed so many calls for the Isles its ridiculous. Isles players can be literally bleeding, crosschecked and smashed to the ice, interfered with, its fine. Its all fine.

The NHL refs are still working under the Winter Classic Memo and giving the Flyers all the breaks, with an occasional penalty shot thrown in to make things seem legit.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 12:48 AM EST reply actions  

That penalty shot call was pretty obvious

Fans would have went berserk if Refs didn’t call the shoulder-hook…. Could have easily been a 2nd penalty shot for Grabner when he was high-sticked (right before he went high back-hand and goalie Robbed [Robrovskied?] him.)

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 1:03 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Keithy Jones... you better... watch your speed

I can’t believe I forgot that in my anti-mother-jones rant. Wasn’t that incredible… and they referred to it a couple of times.
“he didn’t get the embellishment, but hartnell is letting him know…”
Yeah, Scotty is saying, “Hey, mike… f***in’ slow down man, you’re sucking the oxygen out of the rink”
Then later on they blamed grabner for a call against the flyers not being made. Like it was an even-it-up for not calling the embellishment that was so obvious.

Again… I understand the homer stuff… but to be totally ignorant of the world outside your own is borderline psychotic. I wonder what it sounds like when the flyers play pittsburg… it would be awesome to hear both sides of contreversial plays.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 1:23 AM EST up reply actions  

It's old age
I can’t believe I forgot that in my anti-mother-jones rant.

You’re slipping. Sometimes we gotta pick you up and fill in the holes for you, remind you which cafeteria you ate at yesterday.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 1:33 AM EST up reply actions  

It's tough when you're my age...

you’re lucky to get a one year contract as the number one goalie for a team that was a goal or two from going to the stanley cup finals last year.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 1:39 AM EST up reply actions  

Keith Jones has never … skated with speed,

That’s actually true.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 9:47 AM EST up reply actions  

Hartnell... all-star whining? Really?

Whoever got the Philly feed, can you believe the amount of whining about Scott Hartnell not being on the all-star team?
Hartnell is one of those guys you hate, unless he’s on your team. I get it. He’s better than 90% of those guys…. but can you really whine about him not being on the all-star team… when you’re playing a team that has a guy who’s posted 30 his first two full NHL seasons, and is on pace for 40 in his third… on a lottery team. Really? It may have been worth a note… “Too bad Scotty’s not on the team this year… he deserves it”… The End…. they must have mentioned it 10 times.
Do Philadelphians even realize that they live in PHILADELPHIA?

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 13, 2012 12:55 AM EST reply actions  

Hartnell? Really? The guy who's averaged around 20goals/yr in his career?

And all of a sudden has 18goals in 41gms playing with jagr and giroux? You put rolston on a line with Jagr and giroux and he’ll pot 15goals in half a season. lol. Screw those complainers.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 1:36 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Honestly

I could see giving him a spot over Kane or Koivu this year, both who have numbers that look more like All-Star d-men than forwards, but its not like its a slam dunk snub over either. Plus, and this is not the homer in me at all, I would have taken Matt Moulson over Hartnell.

If Marty Reasoner and Ruslan Fedotenko had made the team over Hartnell then I can see the excessive complaining during the game. But we’re talking Scotty Hartnell, the perennial above-average player vs. Kane and Koivu, perennial all-stars.

Pipe down Philadelphia.

The New York Islanders: saving their best for the wrong conference since '05

by Chris McNally on Jan 13, 2012 2:50 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Meh, Kane and Koivu are on the road to their annual 70pts seasons, Hartnell is on the verge of his 1st 35goal and 61pts+ season in his whole career playing with 2 of the top 40 offensive ppg players in the nhl this year.

Flyer fans complaining about Hartnell not being in the all-star game should put things into perspective. This would be similar to, but not even close to in perspective given how good Hartnell actually is, as Duck fans complaining Ryan isn’t in the all-star game when he is the weakest player on his line. It’s like saying Burrows belongs in the NHL because he’s playing great with the Sedin’s. Flyers fans saying Hartnell belongs in the all-star game are clearly homers and not seeing the big picture.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 3:34 AM EST up reply actions  

The only thing I have to say about this is that Hartnell wears number 19, so he has that going for him.

For every player that Hartnell could have replaced, another team could have named two that could have replaced Hartnell. Again, we’re talking about the All-Ontario game that really is just a dog and pony show or children and corporate sponsors.

by Hockey1919 on Jan 13, 2012 10:38 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Also, the Flyers have four other guys going, right?

One guy’s gotta sit. Sorry. There are 29 other teams that might have some good players, too.

"He's depriving some small village of a pretty good idiot" - Mike Milbury on Ziggy Palffy's agent. On Twitter: @Dan_of_Science

by PGI on Jan 13, 2012 10:02 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

oh yeah, this

There are 29 other teams that might have some good players, too.

There are also 29 other teams whose good players aren’t also among the lead leaders in penalty minutes every season… since arriving in Philly, Hartnell has finished sixth, first, second, and seventh in minor penalties; and 12, 24, 12, and 17 in overall PIM. So far this season he’s at 13th and 22nd, respectively. Nobody above him on either list is on the All-Star roster this season.

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Jan 13, 2012 2:53 PM EST up reply actions  

aaaaahhhh blockquote fail

Sorry PGI – first sentence is yours.

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Jan 13, 2012 2:53 PM EST up reply actions  

Coliseum

Was at the game tonight and there was some really good energy from the crowd…I’m 0-2 this yr at islander games lol but it was really nice to see them play great tonight

by LETS GO ISLANDERS!!! on Jan 13, 2012 2:22 AM EST reply actions  

Getting over the hump

I Really think the islanders are starting to get over the hump, as far as overall team confidence and belief that they can really ply and stick with most teams …I Think JT playing the way he has makes the team feel more like an up and coming team them the old star-less islanders.. Lol it was just a thought…
And to the pep who think drafting strome was a bad move think again… He’s got talent! And lots of it… Give him time to develop, he’s a play maker with the balls to shoot the puck..

El niño – give him the amount of mins evander Kane had gotten in his rookie season and I think u would see that type of production.. Wasn’t great but not bad for an 18 yr old…he’s just has to find his nitch

by LETS GO ISLANDERS!!! on Jan 13, 2012 2:57 AM EST reply actions  

HEY TALBOT, KARMA IS A FUC*ING BITCH!!!!!!!!!!!!

I’ve watched the replay about 100 times, no joke, and I’ve come up with the primary contact point being a forearm shiver to Talbot’s chest. “Maybe” there is elbow contact to Talbot’s head, but it’s in no way conclusive. I looked for the head contact over and over and none of the angles show direct conclusive head contact. And apparently Talbot had no concussion since he finished the game playing and never went for a concussion test off ice. Expect no suspension. Possibly a borderline hit, given inconclusiveness, but in no way suspension worthy. Thank you steve staios for giving Talbot what he deserves. This is what the cry baby gets for his concussion hits to our players and acting on “other legal hits” throughout his nhl career. KARMA MOTHER FUGGER!

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 3:24 AM EST reply actions  

Yep, I agree

Alhough I don’t think he should be, he’ll probably get suspended. This was not the worst I’ve seen…not even this year. There have been far worse hits that have essentially gone without substantial punsihment that fit the crime. I saw a replay on MSG that made it look pretty clean and like it was a hit below the chin. Hopefully that angle makes its way up to Shanny. What I saw was a golden globe winning job of acting here, if anything. At least, he laid the wood on him.

All the chatter made me think about nasty hits in NYI history. The one last night paled in comparison to some others. It’s not like the shot Flatley laid on Beck back in the day. That was a HIT! Speaking of which, Flats get inducted to the NYI Hall of Fame tomorrow. A nice honor for a real lunchpail guy of the 90′s team.

Here’s a few videos I found celebrating his indcution. Congrats Flats!

Glenn Healy on the Kind of Player Pat Was: http://bit.ly/yuc96G

Healy on Flatley’s Contribution to the ’93 Isles Playoff Run: http://bit.ly/AuWPNE

Stan Fischler on Flatley’s style of play: http://bit.ly/zCnqyH

by GGMC on Jan 13, 2012 12:10 PM EST up reply actions  

Shanahan would have access to both feeds, I believe

The same as the Toronto office that monitors goal challenges and such.

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Jan 13, 2012 2:55 PM EST up reply actions  

DIDNT GET THE RESULT

the performance deserved, but we’vejust got to dust ourselves down & go again Saturday night against the Sabres, the confidence should be there just need that lucky bounce or the right call from the refs to go our way & we’ll win more than we lose going into the backend of the season.

F.A.O MAX TALBOT – Hows the ice taste???? HAHAHA

3 Teams 3 Different Sports Same Torture!!!

by Kung Fu Panda 48 on Jan 13, 2012 5:25 AM EST reply actions  

The goalie stole one.

Well, at least Howie Rose said so.
Too bad it was Bobrovsky, since we are still waiting for our first steal by a goalie this year.
AMac, who played great, said “When you play as well as we did you’d think you would come out on top.” Indeed.
And Nabby says “A bad mistake…but that’s hockey.”
No. An occasional steal by a goalie- that’s hockey. Even a pedestrian goalie like the Bobber does it once in a while.
I’d like one this year.

by JackandAce on Jan 13, 2012 7:46 AM EST reply actions  

LOL @ "the Bobber"

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 10:38 AM EST up reply actions  

The Isles are playing pretty good hockey...

If only they could keep this up against the lower teams…They wouldn’t lose to the bad teams if they put this kind of effort in…If that was the case, it wouldn’t hurt as much, if we lost a hard fought game against the better teams…

by KO21 on Jan 13, 2012 8:17 AM EST reply actions  

I love the SPHL rule where if a trainer has to come out on the ice for you, you are done for the period.

It would cure this lying around on the ice trying to get a call.

But Bettman would hate that, wouldn’t he? He likes divers and turtlers.

"We owe him a lot more than he owes us at this point. He's been stellar all year. He still gave us a chance to win this one, and we've got to find a way."

—C Josh Bailey, on G Al Montoya after a 5-3 loss Tuesday in Montreal.

by BobbyNystromOwnsYou on Jan 13, 2012 9:07 AM EST reply actions  

I do get why you'd say that

But they would never make it so that coming out on the ice to help an injured player is automatically a kind of disadvantage.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 11:59 AM EST up reply actions  

TMC<

You’d be amazed how the guys get to the bench. If they’re not seriously hurt, they will make it to the bench. If you are hurt, you won’t be back anyways.

Nobody lays around on the ice like Talbot, then plays his next shift. It’s refreshing.

"We owe him a lot more than he owes us at this point. He's been stellar all year. He still gave us a chance to win this one, and we've got to find a way."

—C Josh Bailey, on G Al Montoya after a 5-3 loss Tuesday in Montreal.

by BobbyNystromOwnsYou on Jan 13, 2012 3:17 PM EST up reply actions  

LOL< that < is supposed to be a comma.

"We owe him a lot more than he owes us at this point. He's been stellar all year. He still gave us a chance to win this one, and we've got to find a way."

—C Josh Bailey, on G Al Montoya after a 5-3 loss Tuesday in Montreal.

by BobbyNystromOwnsYou on Jan 13, 2012 3:18 PM EST up reply actions  

I thought you were saying that "none are greater than TMC"

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Jan 13, 2012 3:25 PM EST up reply actions  

Doesn't that mean "all are greater than TMC"?

No offense…

Official choice of Lighthouse Dog #1.

by Fabtraption on Jan 13, 2012 3:47 PM EST up reply actions  

I think mikb meant

“TMC is less than nothing.”

(So TMC is greater than or equal to everything.)

That’s one way to read it.

"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."

by North Dakota Red Eagle on Jan 13, 2012 4:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Your ideas are intriguing to me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.

Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Jan 13, 2012 5:29 PM EST up reply actions  

This makes a lot of sense...

I’d have to go back and look, but I think the Isles had possession when the whistle blew. He really needs to be suspended for EMBELLISHMENT.
That level of attention goes to guys who have been cut, and need immediate attention. He basically got his bell wrung… so they should have stopped play when the flyers got the puck.. if he’s not seriously hurt he should have gotten 2 for unsportsmanlike conduct.
What will probably happen is that the flyers will take a run at Parentau or, BOSSY FORBID, Tavares… so really… it might be time for Gillies to make his farewell tour starting in Philly on the 19th… because we’ll probably see Sestito making a cameo that night.

I've had enough! It's time to call out Garth Snow!
@JPinVA

by JPinVA on Jan 14, 2012 8:26 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs


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Islanders Schedule

1979-80


May 24, 1980: Tonelli to Nystrom. At long last, the steady build of the New York Islanders from expansion doormat to surprise semifinalist to annual contender reaches the promised land: Buoyed by a late season trade for Butch Goring that gave the team the depth up the middle GM Bill Torrey had been seeking, the Islanders knock off the Philadelphia Flyers in six games.

The victory justified the faith in coach Al Arbour who guided them from their second season to their first Stanley Cup seven seasons later. The Islanders would not be the first expansion team to win the Stanley Cup, but they would be the only one capable of a dynasty.

1980-81


May 21, 1981: This time it was much easier. After falling to "only" 91 points in the 1979-80 season, the Islanders returned to their division title tradition, piling up 110 points -- a whole 13 points over second-place Philadelphia.

Between the quarterfinals (where they beat the upstart Oilers in six games) and the finals, the Islanders reeled off eight consecutive wins -- with a four-game sweep of archrival Rangers in between. As they defeated the Minnesota North Stars in five games for their second Cup, their goal difference in the final was a combined +10.

1981-82


May 16, 1982: Another year, another landslide title. The Islanders won the Patrick Division by a whopping 26 points over the second-place Rangers, and were seven points clear of their nearest competition for the President's Trophy, the still-not-quite-ripe Edmonton Oilers.

A first-round scare against the Pittsburgh Penguins turned in the Isles' favor thanks to John Tonelli's heroics, and a true dynasty was on its way: Past the Rangers in six games, then an eight-game sweep of the Quebec Nordiques and Vancouver Canucks to run away with the Stanley Cup.

1982-83


May 17, 1983: Not so fast, whipper-snappers. The Edmonton Oilers' steadily rising challenge for league supremacy took them all the way to the finals for the first time, where the New York Islanders summarily dispatched them in a four-game sweep. For the Islanders, the Dynasty was secured. For the Oilers, it was a powerful lesson in where talent ends and the demands of playoff hockey begin.

Four years, four Cups, 16 consecutive playoff series wins (a record that would grow to 19 until the rematch with the Oilers the following year). Mike Bossy scored 60 goals yet again, and Wayne Gretzky became acquainted with Billy Smith's crease.


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