Mark Streit, Andrei Markov's Creation? Sorry, no.
What do Sheldon Souray, Mark Streit and Marc-Andre Bergeron have in common? All of them have made more money than they're worth thanks to Markov's powerplay wizardry.
>>Eric Engels, for CTV Montreal
I'm amazed people still think this, three years later -- but then Habs followers tend to have a Hab-centric orientation that makes mere mortal fans of 29 other NHL team blush.
We'll get to the production stats -- not just for Streit, but for Bergeron too -- in a second, but first share my bemusement at the paragraph that immediately followed the quoted one above:
Believe it or not, with a potent arsenal that included Alex Kovalev, Saku Koivu, Tomas Plekanec, Andrei Kostitsyn, Alex Tanguay, and eventually Mathieu Schneider, the Canadiens only finished with a 19.2% efficiency rating, which was good enough for 13th place in the league.
I thought you said Markov was a powerplay maestro who made inferior men rich with his wizardry!
Streit at least made bank on his next contract after leaving Montreal, but referencing Bergeron is particularly puzzling. Bergeron's entire career has been based on powerplay production. With six separate NHL teams (including five decidedly not-Markov ones). He has 43 powerplay goals in his career, only seven coming with the Canadiens.
Here's what Bergeron's recent career line looks like:
2006-07: 25 PP points in 78 games (EDM and NYI)
2007-08: 15 PP points in 55 games (NYI and ANA)
2008-09: 18 PP points in 78 games (MIN)
2009-10: 22 PP points in 69 games (MTL)
At least Bergeron cashed in on the mere fragrance of being near Markov though, right? Not exactly.
Bergeron actually made more money ($1.5 million) before going to Montreal, and his first contract after leaving the Canadiens was the first two-way deal of his career, one that paid him a pro-rated $1 million at the NHL level. After producing -- yet again -- on the powerplay for the Lightning last year, he earned a two-year deal ... at $1 million per.
Markov's reach inside the Tampa Bay front office apparently only goes so far.
Or the book on Bergeron has been clear long before, and after, his time with the Habs.
Mark Streit: Like Totally Made by Markov
But that's Bergeron, powerplay specialist. That one's easy. What about Streit, who was a powerplay specialist in Montreal but got paid -- and used -- like an all-around defenseman with the Islanders?
Oh, something about leading his team in scoring with 62 points as the only plus regular (+5) while logging 25 minutes per game for a 30th place team.
But what about 2007-08, when the Habs powerplay was amazing and Streit cashed in -- that was all Markov, right?
2007-08 MTL PP: 24.1% (1st) ... Streit 7-27-34 on the PP in 81 games; Markov with 10-22-32 in 82 games.
The pre-Streit Islanders powerplay ranked 29th in the league that year, at 14.1%
2008-09 Streit-less MTL PP: just 19.2% (13th) (what!?) while Markov's PP production increased to 7-32-39 in 78 games.
Meanwhile...
2008-09 Islanders PP: Improved to 16.9% (23rd), with Streit putting up 10-19-29 on the PP. Streit's powerplay goals increased, his assists dropped -- hey, I wonder if he didn't have the same weapons to pass to that he had in Montreal? -- and he put up 27 non-PP points just for good measure.
Andrei Markov is a lovely defenseman, but it seems in Montreal that's not enough -- he must be a maker of careers.
Mark Streit is also a lovely defenseman, and thankfully he escaped the canonized shadow of Markov and got a chance to prove it (and babysit a few lesser defensemen in the process).
Maybe a season on the shelf makes people forget, or maybe it all gets lost in the flood of No Habs No idolatry, but three years later, it's shocking the word hasn't gotten out.
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It’s a combination of Streit missing last season and his 08-09 year being the most underrated performance of a defenseman in a long time
"Maybe (Frans) should concentrate more on FO rather than the thugging aspect of his game." - AP77
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
Naw...
Markov’s just that good! He’s a Canadien!
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
You can't spell "Markov" without "Mark"
Just sayin’.
Screw Nassau.
by ICanSeeForIslesAndIsles on Aug 22, 2011 12:41 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Well
They are the only organization that can celebrate its centennial for three straight season.
Formerly a part time contributor and pittier of fools, now an Emeritus at Lighthouse Hockey.
by David Hanssen on Aug 22, 2011 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions 6 recs
In 2008, Engels also reported that Streit
had chosen to leave hockey and sign with some organization he had never heard of called the “Islanders,” who are probably based in some third-world Caribbean nation or in Madagascar.
"He's depriving some small village of a pretty good idiot" - Mike Milbury on Ziggy Palffy's agent Paul Kraus.
There’s a Peurto Rico soccer team called the Islanders, so when you check Google Trends for Islanders they are more popular in Peurto Rico then NY
"Maybe (Frans) should concentrate more on FO rather than the thugging aspect of his game." - AP77
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
Streit was an All-Star a couple years ago..
Why is it that the NHL media is constantly making me cringe???
This doesn’t happen in other sports…The NHL is a circus…
The Media
Sure never lets us forget that David Garrad was a pro bowl QB, despite the fact that 5 other QBs claimed injuries so they wouldn’t have to play in the game
"Maybe (Frans) should concentrate more on FO rather than the thugging aspect of his game." - AP77
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
hahahahaha
Is that like Major League Baseball’s new 50-man roster for All-Star games? Hell, I expected Julio Franco to go wandering by.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
Maybe if Markov "made Streit"
Streit kept Markov healthy.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
by Keith Quinn on Aug 22, 2011 1:14 PM EDT via mobile reply actions 4 recs
Winner
Now who made Major major? Or who made Streit unhealthy?
/looks sideways at Moulson
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
I like the idea of his mere fragrance lifting his teammates to new heights.
“When you need to enhance your performance…it’s time for Eau de Markov.”
In Dinglebarn We Trust -- JftC
by Niesy on Aug 22, 2011 1:58 PM EDT reply actions 5 recs
Stats off?
FYI – I think Streit had 62 points in his last year in MTL and then 56 and was plus six in his first with the Isles. He also went from minus with Habs to plus with Isles.
Thanks, but these are just PP stats I'm referencing
Since the Markov PP wizardry was the tonic that apparently made Streit rich.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
People still say they are Markov products now? Wow.
All 3 of those d-men have proved otherwise: Streit, Souray, and Bergeron. It’s extremely funny that they would say that. We’re lucky that Markov was hurt last season or Wiz would have joined that product of Markov list. This is hysterical.
I read the whole thing
I don’t see the part where Markov assembled Mark Streit in his basement and then brought him to life by harnessing a lightning storm. Was there a “read more” link that I missed?
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
by mikb on Aug 22, 2011 2:50 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs
Andrei Markov's opening dialogue (Transcribed from Engel's article)
Mark Streit, hockey player. A man barely alive. Gentlemen, we can rebuild him. We have the technology. We have the capability to make the world’s first Bionic Defenseman. Mark Streit will be that hockey player. Better than he was before. Better, stronger, faster. (Bah dah bah duh, bah dah dah dah dah duh dah dah)
Formerly a part time contributor and pittier of fools, now an Emeritus at Lighthouse Hockey.
by David Hanssen on Aug 22, 2011 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
Dave's on Fire today
"Maybe (Frans) should concentrate more on FO rather than the thugging aspect of his game." - AP77
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
Well, I’ve got a lot of crazy stored up from not commenting in a while, so, yeah…
Formerly a part time contributor and pittier of fools, now an Emeritus at Lighthouse Hockey.
by David Hanssen on Aug 22, 2011 7:16 PM EDT up reply actions
oh yeah
Al Arbour DOES kinda look like Oscar Goldman, don’t he?
You know I’m going to be doing the slo-mo sound f/x whenever Streit takes a slapshot or throws a bodycheck.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
by mikb on Aug 23, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I guess Oscar Goldman got mad. Cause I got loose circuits (so loose)
"Human beings make life so interesting. Do you know, that in a universe so full of wonders, they have managed to invent boredom?" ~ Death
What made Streit...
was a perfect marriage between a team that was desperate for a top four defenseman with offensive upside, and a player that could deliver.
There is no doubt that the Islanders overpaid for the raw commodity that was offered them in 2008. But what Snow needed was a defenseman that could move the puck in an offence that was going to rely heavily on the forecheck and a quasi-four forward attack.
Great signing by Snow, even better performance by Streit.
Lighthouse Hockey: Home of the "STROME-BOLI"!
Thanks for voting "YES" on Aug 1st... just not enough of you!!!
by JPinVA on Aug 22, 2011 3:11 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Now that you say that
I wonder if there will be any drop-off in Streit outside of Gordo’s system…interesting to keep an eye on, but with the injury variable there too, will be tough to tell.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
Many factors point to drop off...
… but a relative drop off would be acceptable.
Injury: We don’t really expect him to be 100%, do we?
Improved partner: I really liked Bruno when he outperformed his station (under Nolan), but since that point he was basically a floatation device. A better partner will probably mean that they will perform better together, but most likely his numbers will go down slightly.
Improved defensive corp: He may not play 25 minutes a night with MacHamonic and whatever comination is made with the leftovers of Eaton, Wishart, Jurcina and Mottau. He’ll benefit from a rested body on the PP, and a better point partner in Rolston… but his 5-on-5 and PK time should drop.
New coach: I don’t really see this as a negative at all. Once again it is the dueling philosophies of “do your best my way” vs “my way is to help you do your best”. I think Cappy has seen enough of Streit to understand the situations where he will thrive, and just how to get the best out of him in an economical fashion. Think Blake under Nolan.
Lighthouse Hockey: Home of the "STROME-BOLI"!
Thanks for voting "YES" on Aug 1st... just not enough of you!!!
I don't think that
most people expected Streit to transform into a top pairing defenseman when the Islanders signed. In fact, I have a well worn copy of THN from 2008, a summer issue detailing their predictions for the upcoming season, that warned islander fans not to get too excited about Streit, as he wasn’t much more than a PP specialist. I also have a copy from a year later conceding they were wrong and that he was a legit top pairing d-man. (ironically in that issue they warn isle fans that this guy Matt Moulson they just signed was nothing more than an AHL depth signing) Given the contract that Snow gave Streit, its possible that he was so desperate for scoring from the blueline that he offered Streit more than he was worth at the time just to get somebody to LI who could run a PP and move the puck from the D-zone, but its also possible that Snow recognized something that Montreal and most of the league had missed- that Streit was more than a per game third pairing guy and was in fact someone you could build a blueline around. If the latter is the case than he was right, and Streit has been worth what he has been paid (when he’s been healthy) Snow isn’t taken seriously around the league and even by some Islander fans and everytime he has signed someone who has overexceeded expectations (Streit, Moulson, PAP, Grabner etc.) he has been called lucky, not shrewd. Luck only gets you so far and at a certain point the league is going to realize that no one is that lucky, and that Snow is very good at recognizing potential in guys not given the chance to thrive before coming to the Island
by MatthewM11 on Aug 22, 2011 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
I think a little of it is luck..
He’s lucky that some of the overpayments that he was willing to make turned him down. It’s funny how NHLers have refused the Islanders’ sack of gold. But if there were a few more takers we’d probably be mired in mediocrity still. Gionta, anyone? Do you think anybody would have saved us from that amazingly horrible contract?
But most of it has been having a finished product in sight, listening to the input of others, and getting pieces to that puzzle when and where they were available.
If this team competes for a playoff spot through March you’d have to say it was an amazing job by Snow. Considering he had one failed coach, and almost zero access to the upper tier of the UFA market. Those who think Snow has been “lucky” just haven’t been paying attention.
Lighthouse Hockey: Home of the "STROME-BOLI"!
Thanks for voting "YES" on Aug 1st... just not enough of you!!!
by JPinVA on Aug 22, 2011 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah that is a good point
Gionta is a good example that we were lucky to have him turn us down. And it’s also worth pointing out that not all of Snow’s free agency experiments have worked out, Schremp being an example of that. What I like about Snow’s approach is that it has been a low risk/high reward approach, which rarely exists in sports. You usually have to take a big chance to get a big pay-off, it’s just not that common to sign a depth guy like Moulson to a relativley cheap two-way contract and have him score 30 goals in consecutive seasons. Luck has played a role, its impossible for it not to, but Snow’s overall approach- build through the draft and augment that with low risk signings, has been shrewd and the fact that so many of his low risk signings have turned into pots of gold suggests to me that he has (or has someone working for him) an incredable eye for spotting underappreciated, undervalued talent. Whether that’s a system a la Billy Bean or just great instinct I don’t know but I hope he keeps doing what he has been doing.
Schremp was a waivers guy. I still think he had a good first season, he just didn’t have a place on the Islanders with Bailey-Nielsen-Tavares as Centers already.
"Maybe (Frans) should concentrate more on FO rather than the thugging aspect of his game." - AP77
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
Well, my issue with Schremp was that I didn't think he was offensively productively enough for a top 6 role, but not defensively capable enough for a bottom 6 role. And he was also undersized.
Sure, all valid points
But I think the point web is trying to make (and I thought in my head) was that Schremp almost wouldn’t be considered a free agent bust. He was a waiver pickup (probably for BPT) and had a very reasonable contract. It wasn’t Holik-ish or anything.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
by Keith Quinn on Aug 22, 2011 7:16 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Yeah, the Isles gave up nothing to get RSH and his highest salary as an Isle was $750,00 last year (h/t CapGeek), or roughly 200,000 more than the minimum salary for an NHLer. He was a low risk, high reward pick-up and just didn’t work out. Considering his salary, cost to pick up and overall production, I wouldn’t call him a bust. Its not like we spent the first round pick on him (hehehehe, Oilers…).
Formerly a part time contributor and pittier of fools, now an Emeritus at Lighthouse Hockey.
by David Hanssen on Aug 22, 2011 7:24 PM EDT up reply actions
I have a well worn copy of THN from 2008, a summer issue detailing their predictions for the upcoming season, that warned islander fans not to get too excited about Streit, as he wasn’t much more than a PP specialist. I also have a copy from a year later conceding they were wrong and that he was a legit top pairing d-man. (ironically in that issue they warn isle fans that this guy Matt Moulson they just signed was nothing more than an AHL depth signing)
(giggle)
Proof positive that even the respected Hockey media is sometimes just taking stabs when it comes to predictions.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Aug 22, 2011 7:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while.
I was on the sign mark Streit bandwagon from the start. In full disclosure mode, I also thought Michael Ryder would have been a good fit.
Nassau Coliseum lost a veteran and an original Islander fan. ACC 1918-2011
Me, too.
Its easy to say that now, but I really was.
I was defending him when all the Rags fans were HAW-HAW ing at us because they got the REAL dman- Wade Redden!!!!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Aug 23, 2011 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Real asspensive, real useless, real... we almost HAD that guy.
"Human beings make life so interesting. Do you know, that in a universe so full of wonders, they have managed to invent boredom?" ~ Death
Obviously players are all influenced by their teammates
to one degree or another. It’s likely impossible to play a full season with someone and not be influenced by how they play game. That being said, I don’t buy for a minute that Markov ‘made’ Streit the player he is. I’d imagine that their relationship was a little synergistic- both learning from and being influenced by each other. Markov was getting much more playing time and had more faith from the org. and was the veteren player, so he likely influenced Streit more than Streit influenced Markov, but I still think that stating that Markov made Streit or anyone else the player that they are is grossly overstating the issue.
Thanks!
Hooray for the Canadian hockey media!
by kfallon2 on Aug 22, 2011 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
@Yep, Fair and balanced hockey reporting@
Seriously, how can they call Mark Streit overpaid; in 08-09 he lead his team in scoring, was the only plus player on the worst team in hockey, played over 25 minutes a game and was a legit norris candidate? To me what was most impressive from his performance that year was his plus 6 (Im not a huge fan overall of +/- but in this case his plus/minus was very impressive) despite logging so many minutes. His scoring dipped a little the following season but everything else in his game remained steady. he was injured last season but that happens, nothing you can do about that and not something you can hold against Garth Snow. Markov himself has only played 52 games the past two seasons, less than Streit. I don’t doubt that Streit learned some things from Markov but in no way can you 1) Say Streit hasn’t lived up to his contract or 2) Streit’s value was inflated by playing with Markov. Streit has been better since leaving Montreal!
So they were half-right
but failing to indicate Garth was all-right.
by kfallon2 on Aug 22, 2011 7:12 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Off Topic
Halifax’s ATV Evening News reporting that Sidney Crosby has cancelled all his scheduled ice time at BMO PLace and will not be available for the start of training camp. Concussion symptoms apparently returned with a vengeance last week.
A significant loss to the NHL, if true.
STOP effin' messin' with my FnGO!!
by Nova Scotia Isles Fan on Aug 22, 2011 5:41 PM EDT reply actions
Yeah. There has been a report or 2 about Crosby not going to be ready for training camp or the season's start.
He has still experienced mild-moderate concussion symptoms 8 months removed. Apparently it’s stopped him from skating at least this once. I think he’s either done now or an inevtiable head/other injury away from retiring because of this. He seemed way to fragile to get a 2nd concussion from that Hedman hit 8.5months ago. That sucks for the NHL, but Crosby’s future in the NHL is looking really dim right now.
I still argue
That the Pens played far, far over their heads last season for the hope that Crosby could return to help lift them to another Cup. With the depth guys they lost and starting the season without Crosby and with Malkin coming off an injury I just don’t see them repeating last years performance.
"Maybe (Frans) should concentrate more on FO rather than the thugging aspect of his game." - AP77
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
thirded.
Also- this year, Malkin and Sid will be getting plenty of ice time handed to them as they get back to form. Its unrealistic to expect them to be 100%. Maybe they get there soon, but theres no guarantee of that.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Aug 22, 2011 7:14 PM EDT up reply actions
And if Crosby was just shut down again sans contact
He’s not back before Christmas (I think). Any other injuries to Neal or Letang in particular, and they will have massive problems. Even with Malkin back 100%, I don’t think he’s a difference maker.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
by Keith Quinn on Aug 22, 2011 7:19 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I'm never one to wish ill on anyone, save for maybe Milbury...
But this is all the Penguins fault. They employ Cooke who is solely responsible for ending Savard’s career and karma just bit them in the ass like a pitbull that won’t let go. The team rushed him back from Steckel’s hit way to soon, regardless of how innocent it may or may not have looked. This is what happens when the NHL and the Pens put all their eggs in one basket. I hope Sid recovers and plays in the NHL again, but I must say it sure was nice having the NHL focus on it’s other stars for a change.
by 54_Fighting on Aug 22, 2011 10:03 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Crosby news sucks
I’m getting flashbacks to when Mario’s career was derailed.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
I don't have anything particularly against Crosby so I hope he recovers soon
but I am reveling in the Penguins pain right now.
Pr*j*ct**ns lead to long term injuries, just ask the asian guy from Inception
Update
Apparently, Cosby’s Agent denies all of this.
Crosby hasn’t said a word. As pointed out on our local radio station this a.m., he could be the poster boy for NHL concussions if he wanted to, but remains eerily silent.
STOP effin' messin' with my FnGO!!
by Nova Scotia Isles Fan on Aug 23, 2011 8:51 AM EDT up reply actions
it sucks either way
Nobody wanted Crosby to be the poster child for concussions. Hell, Savard already is – and we didn’t want that either.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
by mikb on Aug 23, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Poster boy-ism
The stickler is … neither of his hits were really “poster boy” shots. I mean the Steckel hit was a flight pattern mix-up, two guys trying to get up ice where the puck was, taking overlapping routes. The Hedman hit was maybe too far in rubbing a guy out but also wasn’t one of those typical sneaky head-targeting or charging incidents.
He’s almost a poster boy for how nearly benign events can turn out horribly wrong.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
by Dominik on Aug 23, 2011 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
He's a poster boy for teams that don't perform due diligence when they think a player may be concussed.
He was clearly “not right” after the Steckel collision. The Pens then put him in the line-up against Tampa “assuming” all would be okay. It reminds me of the first shuttle disaster, NASA knew not to launch below certain temps, but nothing ever went wrong in the past and there was pressure to put their star out there to perform. It ended tragically wrong.
Nassau Coliseum lost a veteran and an original Islander fan. ACC 1918-2011
by Hockey1919 on Aug 23, 2011 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yes and yes
Well put.
Pretty shocked he even returned in the Winter Classic. I was in a bar, drinking quite a bit, for that game — but I remember thinking he’d be shut down for the game after that end-of-period collision.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
Some advanced stats to dispute Eager
As if we did not need anymore.
Streit’s CORSI
07-08 – 3.5
08-09 – 17.4
Markov’s CORSI
07-08 – -2.0
08-09 – 1.7
In Markov’s defense, his CORSI in 07-08 is lower but he played against higher competition (0.084 compared to Streit’s -0.009). The next year though with the Isles Streit faced a higher quality opponent yet blasted Markov’s CORSI out of the water. It’s true in 07-08 Streit had 20% of his ice time with Markov on the PP and 27% total but he saw just as much time paired with Roman Hamrlik (25%, mostly Even Strength) and almost as much time paired with Francis Bouillon (~20%, mostly ES as well). Translation – Eager needs to check himself before he wrecks himself.
Formerly a part time contributor and pittier of fools, now an Emeritus at Lighthouse Hockey.
Sorry about the Habs biased writing. As a Habs fan, I’m embarrassed at times by some people’s narrowness when it comes to things like that. That being said, let’s be honest in saying that Leafs fans are far worse at having an “orientation that makes mere mortal fans of 29 other NHL team blush”. It’s not even close. I grew up in Southern Ontario, and I can assure you of that.
by Taves on Aug 22, 2011 8:33 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
We Know
Believe me, every single time one of them assumes Tavares will sign there the minute he can escape the Islanders, we know.
by Nick (LetThereBeLighthouse) on Aug 22, 2011 8:39 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
The fact that they even can fathom that
is absolutely retarded (sorry for those I offended). But in all serious, being a hockey player in Canada is like being a movie star in America, and they make up tabloids like its nobody’s business.
by sayvillelax94 on Aug 22, 2011 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions
and therein lies the mystery we Canadians and Americans can never figure out about each other?
Why do you guys down there street movie stars like hockey players? (scratching my head?) One gets their first hockey stick before their first bible…one shoots their first puck well before their first lesson is scriptures…and come-on, hockey is real…airbrushed, half-starved plastic looking movie stars are just actors, pretending to be real…
by CanadianIsleslifer on Aug 23, 2011 5:45 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Not gonna lie, I was really drunk
And reading back what I said is pretty evident of that haha I’m sorry CIL
by sayvillelax94 on Aug 23, 2011 9:28 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I feel like we need a "btw I'm drunk" tag
Like the sarcasm font, we need some sort of flag that tells others “I’m drunk so give this comment some leash here.”
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
by Dominik on Aug 23, 2011 12:25 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I have theories on that
But it only leads me to ranting about lowest common denominator culture.
Someone was forwarding pics of Kurt Cobain’s daughter yesterday, posing all cool with a cigarette for a fashion shoot at 19. WTF do we care?! I shouldn’t even care about her father — he was a musician, which is great, but it’s not like he made any great advances nor brilliant insights. He was a musician, he took his life early, he had a daughter, she’s older now. Move on then…
But that’s not half as bad as our reality-TV factory…
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
Haha
I like your comment.
“As a Habs fan, here’s what I think. Now here’s a reason why Toronto is soooooo much worse.”
Official choice of Lighthouse Dog #1.
by Fabtraption on Aug 22, 2011 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
LOL!!!!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Aug 23, 2011 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions
Ha, too true
And of course I’m just picking on one at random (I know every fanbase has their Aunt Ednas they’d rather keep from view of company).
Thanks for dropping in, Taves.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
Wow...
Habs writers make some of the more…“enthusiastic” Red Sox beat writers look like objective journalists by comparison.
Believe me, that’s a TALL order.
In the late 90’s beginning of the last decade, those guys were convinced Pedro Martinez crapped gold and peed Cristal…
Habs beat writers sound like they believe every Habs player keeps a genie in his “bottle”…and would give anything to try and get it out!
They’re Francophone analogs of Laffs writers!
Jeff Carter to Columbus? Wait, I've seen this one before, it was called Shanahan to Hartford. Advice? Don't buy a Carter jersey.
well, to be perfectly fair...
….from 1994-2005, Pedro DID crap gold and piss Cristal. Dig this 12-year stretch. From ‘97-’03 in particular, they could have made him pitch from second base and it wouldn’t have helped. He’s 23rd all time for wins above replacement for pitchers (if you like the newfangled stats), 14th for pitchers after WW2.* He’s 13th all-time in strikeouts (about 10 per nine innings), and first in the entirety of baseball for ERA+ for starters.**
*WAR is cumulative, so old-time guys who were in three-man rotations with no relievers, and threw a million innings a year, have an unfair edge.
**ERA+ of 154, which means his ERA was about 65% of the league average in a typical season.
BTW – it’d be nice if hockey-reference.com was as on-the-ball with advanced stats as baseball-reference.com… I’d love to see sv% and GAA broken down by even-strength, PP/60, and PK/60, with the league averages overall and by component; and a sv%+ and GAA+ to break down the numbers relative to league average; shots per 60 min to show who was getting lighter or heavier workloads… granted that hockey sabermetrics is behind baseball by at least 35 years, and that a lot of stats are proprietary, but the goalie stuff is just math – anyone with the raw data could compile it.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
Hey, I didn't say he wasn't the best pitcher in baseball during that time...
…what I meant was, Sawks beat writers from Bangor to Greenwich wrote about him as though he LITERALLY crapped gold and peed Cristal…as in, they…well, you get the picture.
Now, my apologies for putting that picture in your head.
Jeff Carter to Columbus? Wait, I've seen this one before, it was called Shanahan to Hartford. Advice? Don't buy a Carter jersey.
by BrassBonanza10 on Aug 23, 2011 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions
LOL, it's all good
I’m guessing from your screen name that you have to put up with the NESN nonsense a lot more than we do down in Jersey, so I completely hear you on the over-adulation. It’s like Jeter for the YES network – another guy who’s actually very good at baseball, but whose hagiography makes me want to punch the whole earth in the neck. Or, say… Mar-TAN Bro-DUHR.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
NESN: The All @$$!#$%^ Sports Network.
Let’s not bring up the Satan Sports Network.
It’s a sore spot for anyone who’s a Yankee fan or former Whaler die hard. Especially since their parent corporation (Comcast) dropped MSG (and it’s subsidiary networks) from their cable packages, which kinda makes me wish the Isles could get a deal with YES to carry their games.
Why YES? Easy. Unless they want Comcast offices west of the Connecticut River to burn to the ground, they’ll never drop YES from the market.
And, even as a Yankee fan, yeah, I’ll cop to it: To hear Michael Kay tell it, Jeter’s farts can cure cancer.
Jeff Carter to Columbus? Wait, I've seen this one before, it was called Shanahan to Hartford. Advice? Don't buy a Carter jersey.
by BrassBonanza10 on Aug 23, 2011 9:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Slightly Off Topic for August, but talking injuries in context
Streit has missed the past season due to injury and we are all hoping for a full recovery. Crosby’s concussion has been the headline story for much of August, so it seems like August is the time to talk injuries. Somehow, these conversations (like so many others) got me thinking about our own Ricky D.
I don’t see Penguine fans complaining that Crosby has a $8.5 cap hit/year for 5 years and the Penguins are going from 3 top caliber centers (Crosby, Malkin, Staal) to barely one and a half due to injuries. Do the Penguins have uncertainty at Center? Can the Penguins organization make any move as long as Crosby’s health is in doubt? I don’t see Crosby being blamed for any of this. Instead there seems to be more concern about his health and welfare than any organizational goal.
Now DiPi has a much longer deal, but half the cap hit. No one could predict the injuries that would strike either player. So for all of the mocking the Islanders take for DiPi, it is less funny when it is your player that is injured and creates doubt. The Islanders have had a goalie-go-round for the past few seasons, but that was management’s problem not DiPi’s. Pittsburgh had Crosby, Staal and Malkin in the lineup together for only 3 games last season. Was Shero an idiot for stockpiling centers when it looked liked the Penguins needed wings (Wings on a penguin are generally useless anyway since they can’t fly)? The Islanders had 7 goaltenders last season and there is still uncertainty how the position will be filled. I don’t see anybody blaming Crosby for not just shutting it down so that the Penguins can move forward.
I’m just curious why there is such a discrepancy in perspective when it comes to injured players. At what point do fans expect a player to give up his rehab and just retire/quit and at what point does the organization have to make the critical decision on the players future? Some guys are treated as heroes for doing everything they can to come back and help the team, others are looked at as selfish pricks that put themselves before the team. I think in DiPietro’s case, it is just the perception that the team was putting his comeback before the good of the team,.
Nassau Coliseum lost a veteran and an original Islander fan. ACC 1918-2011
by Hockey1919 on Aug 23, 2011 10:20 AM EDT reply actions 3 recs
great post.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Aug 23, 2011 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions
I know this is a little late, but I'd like to offer a Habs fan perspective
1. Eric Engels has been well schooled in the importance and art of pageviews.
The Habs media, as a whole, tends to be overly critical and pessimistic, especially the French stuff you guys are lucky enough not to read. Montreal is full of people dying for pressbox access and a chance to make a name for themselves as Canadiens journalists.
So, how do you earn a loyal following among Habs fans who are sick of reading every single thing the Habs or execs do criticized and talked to death (there was once a COVER story in one of the local papers about how Pierre Gauthier hates Quebec because his primary residence is still in Vermont)? How do you make friends with the organization?
You sell your soul and write endless fellationary pieces about the players/organization. Worked for Eric, he went from Hockeybuzz to CTV (a national network, part of a huge media conglomerate). A number of English media types have found success this way.
2. I have, in my years of knowing of his existence, agreed with him exactly once. And even then, I wasn’t really agreeing. He had done some research on Plekanec’s encouraging stats that nobody had thought to do, and I applauded the idea/effort. It’s too easy to see through him.
3. I think the problem is that people often see how shitty the powerplay is without Markov and forget that a lot of people who helped it before are gone – Souray, Streit, Kovalev, even Sergei Kostitsyn. Markov’s LTIRs have coincided with Life After [insert above player name here]. I don’t know if you guys read that Leafs Nation piece on Cognitive Dissonance but I think it’s relevant here: we make excuses for why our team didn’t do well because we want to keep believing that our team is a winning team. Therefore, we think Markov is more of a PP wizard than he is.
4. He does quarterback the powerplay when in the lineup. That is his PP role. It’s not hard to convince your readers that he therefore makes everybody on the PP as good at their jobs as they are and have the readers keep coming back for more.
5. This all started when we got bitter about Komisarek leaving and then he turned out to suck waffles in Toronto. Somebody mentioned how good Markov made him look and it got nuts. I would argue that Komisarek needs to be partnered up with guy that plays a similar offensive style to Markov, and he just doesn’t have that option in Toronto, which is why his play has dropped so much. But the homers have decided Markov is magical, and you can’t argue with a homer.
6. I hope that, even though Markov didn’t “make” anybody or help them get gigantic contracts, you guys still objectively think he’s a great defenseman, because he is. No homer.
I'm just as ridiculous on Twitter
by theactivestick on Aug 24, 2011 9:50 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
excellent
Thanks for the insight. We can understand. We even have a name for the irrational hate we sometimes develop about players: The Scapewagon. (Alexei Yashin owns the dealership, and Rick DiPietro is his celebrity sales rep.) And any fanbase that can shlepp 3000 folks over 500 miles to a non-rival’s building, just because, gets some respect in my books.
Markov is absolutely key for you guys. He flies under the radar outside of Montreal, I think, especially lately because he’s played so little the last year or two. Honestly I didn’t realize how good he’s been either. I can see where you’d feel like he wasn’t getting his due, the way we do with Streit sometimes. Everything’s Weber-Keith-Lidstrom-Chara-Doughty-Pronger to the mainstream guys… and sure, that’s an amazing set of defenders, but it’s not a complete list. Markov’s a better player than some more-popular guys like Dion Phaneuf, for example.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
Speaking of
the Scapewagon. Think we could turn one into a Zamoboni?
by afrosupreme on Aug 24, 2011 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm still trying to keep the "scapebus" term alive for players that were on the scapewagon, but now are no longer Islanders
They went from being on the scapewagon to being thrown under the scapebus. We also need a term for players that are given far more credit or value than deserved. I hate to bring this up about Konopka, who I did like, but at times it seemed like he were the glue that held this team together even if it were just for a post-game quote.
Nassau Coliseum lost a veteran and an original Islander fan. ACC 1918-2011
by Hockey1919 on Aug 24, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
"a term for players that are given far more credit or value than deserved"
Now taking nominations!
I’m guessing that you are looking for something that goes beyond mere “fan favorite” to “Chico-level pedestal-building.”
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
Absolutely. It has to be no matter how bad that player may be that night, fans will defend his every action.
Nassau Coliseum lost a veteran and an original Islander fan. ACC 1918-2011
reaching here...
“Sham-theon”?
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
“a term for players that are given far more credit or value than deserved”
Now taking nominations!
Chico really is one of the best examples of this.
How about:
Scoring high on the Chico scale?
or
Chicosity?
(There is some real chicosity going on when it comes to that player.)
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Aug 26, 2011 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions
How about
Faccolades (as in, tonight, the faccolades go to DP for only giving up 2 goals [on 6 shots with one coming off a misplay] but whatevs, we won!)
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
Fake-o-lades
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
Thanks, activestick
Appreciate the insight. And yes, definitely respect Markov as a great defenseman.
(This was just an excuse to ding the media you’re obviously quite familiar with. It’s one of the shames of hockey-mad markets that the situation you describe develops as people try to get noticed.)
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

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