Rangers 3 (EN), Islanders 0: Nobody score, nobody get wins
by Dominik on Dec 26, 2011 9:58 PM EST
in New York Islanders Game Recaps
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PrintAfter the New York Rangers squeaked out the first goal in a game where they'd mostly held the edge for the first 25 minutes, the New York Islanders mounted their first sustained series of offensive chances to carry across multiple lines (and one powerplay).
But Henrik Lundqvist, as he so often does, shut the door -- most notably on Frans Nielsen on that powerplay -- and the Rangers were free to kill the game with sustained forecheck and a timely insurance goal.
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Carl Hagelin scored both the opener and the insurance goal, though Michael Del Zotto should be credited with creating both. To finish it off, Marian Gaborik picked up the empty net goal -- though this time the Islanders did mount nominal pressure with the extra attacker after pulling Evgeni Nabokov with roughly three minutes left.
The Rangers now hold a 3-1 lead in the season series. They also now hold first place in the Eastern Conference with 48 points after 34 games.
Game Highlights
Notes
* Nino Niederreiter played a season-high 14:20 -- about three to five minutes more than his norm -- and much closer to what he saw in his nine-game trial in 2010-11. Struggling for secondary scoring (and any scoring, on this night), I thought he did a little better with the extra minutes. It's a balance for a young player like him to both learn the pro defensive game and tap into his creative side, and there were signs of both on this otherwise unremarkable night as Niederreiter skated and occasionally created some interesting looks with Josh Bailey.
* Micheal Haley fought and drew the instigator (Yeah, sure. Even the Rangers announcers were surprised.) for his first-period fight with Stu Bickel. Haley gives up about six inches on Bickel, but one thing Haley doesn't do is sucker-jump an opponent while said opponent is removing his helmet for the fight, as Bickel did to Tim Wallace in the last meeting.
Bickel was more than willing to fight after Haley threw the big hit in the corner, so the instigator was debatable, but it's clear why Haley was arriving two minutes into the game, and it had everything to do with Bickel's weasel move on the other side of the Christmas break. Arbitrary NHL policing state for the win.
* The Rangers were credited with 19 shot blocks (the Islanders: 10). Let there be no doubt, the Rangers know how to close down the game once they get a lead. The Isles top line with John Tavares generated its share of chances or at least semi-chances based on nice plays and pressure, but the Rangers play a percentages game to protect the lead, and Lundqvist provides the spine.
* Nabokov made 28 saves on 30 shots (the 31st shot was into the empty net). He gave them the Isles a chance to win, but Lundqvist did not.
From the Islanders' post-game twitter feed:
Capuano says that they aren't losing games because of systems, but because not everyone is doing what is needed to win.
Capuano Post-Game
"Some guys are giving us what they have ... other guys are passengers. ... We're making dumb decisions with the puck, 11 turnovers in the first period. ... We gotta re-evaluate our, uh, situation, and play the guys who are competing at the highest level we ask them to compete at."
Cappy was also happy with Nabokov's play:
Okposo Post-Game
Jurcina Post-Game
* * *
That's about it. The Islanders have lost six of their last eight games in regulation, and the only two outliers were shootout losses. In that span, they've managed 16 goals in the eight games, which is scarily close to their first quarter average of just two goals per game. At 2.21 per game, the only team who's scored less this season is the Los Angeles Kings.
Elsewhere
On the Farm: Bridgeport and Kevin Poulin withstood a 32-21 shot margin to hold on for the 3-2 win over the Whale, avenging the result of the parent clubs. I doubt that's much consolation.
In the Nursery: In WJC news, Ryan Strome logged a goal and three assists in Canada's 8-1 rout of Finland in the opening day of the WJC. Johan Sundstrom also appeared on the scoresheet in Sweden's 9-4 thump of Latvia.
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Their record can match last season's record by New Years.
So much for progress.
Yet another Moulson brother-in-law.
by ICanSeeForIslesAndIsles on Dec 26, 2011 10:13 PM EST reply actions
2010 V 2011
In 2010-11 OCT-DEC they had 27 PTs in 36 games. PATHETIC.
So far in 2011-12 in that period they have 28 PTS in 34 games… so.. yeah, it’s impossible to be as bad, but they’re doing their best to be as pathetic.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
Ah, yes, so technically they can do no worse than a one-point improvement.
And the injuries aren’t nearly as bad this year. I’m really scratching my head over this team.
Yet another Moulson brother-in-law.
by ICanSeeForIslesAndIsles on Dec 26, 2011 10:40 PM EST up reply actions
And the injuries aren’t nearly as bad this year.
Well- with over 150 mangames lost to injury so far, they are still a factor… I mean, you dont play 5 goalies in a season where the injuries are not bad.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 26, 2011 10:52 PM EST up reply actions
True. But Nabokov is supposedly much better than some of the guys used last year.
The number of times we’ve sent out goalies who are not ready for prime time has been much less this year.
Yet another Moulson brother-in-law.
by ICanSeeForIslesAndIsles on Dec 26, 2011 11:05 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, its true that goaltending hasnt been the problem this season… but the injuries piling up still suck.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 26, 2011 11:08 PM EST up reply actions
And the guys who are back from injury reserve simply haven’t bounced back 100%. Perhaps not even 80%. We’re just not allowed to have nice things.
Yet another Moulson brother-in-law.
by ICanSeeForIslesAndIsles on Dec 26, 2011 11:09 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The bulk of the 150 MGs lost are to their benefit...
Pandolfo… REALLY?
Rolston… Is an injured CAP MULE a loss?
Eaton… hurt depth, but his replacement (REESE) was better.
Dipietro… I don’t think I even have to say anything here.
Nino… he shold still be in Portland.
Montoya, Ullstrom and Macdonald are the only two players they’ve lost to injuries that have really hurt the team.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
Id add Nabokov to your “injuries that have hurt the team” list.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 26, 2011 11:50 PM EST up reply actions
True...
…and Streit and Mottau as well. Streit could be the recovery, or he might not be comfortable in Capuano’s system. Mottau seems to be improving as well… possibly due to recovery time…
The bottom line is that they just weren’t prepared for ANY INJURIES to the D, and could only play through bottom six injuries at F.
Could you imagine this team without (insert name here/too scared to put in an actual healthy player) was hurt?
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
Montoya, Ullstrom and Macdonald are the only two players they’ve lost to injuries that have really hurt the team.
Two players?
Understand and agree completely with your point
I threw Ullstrom in...
after the fact. I need a proofreader!
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
by JPinVA on Dec 27, 2011 9:38 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
They were only four points better than last year's pace as of just before tonight's game.
Yet another Moulson brother-in-law.
by ICanSeeForIslesAndIsles on Dec 26, 2011 10:38 PM EST up reply actions
to be fair isn't our qual comp this year harder?
the 4 other teams in the Atlantic this season all are in the playoffs if they started today. Philly and Pittsburgh both have more points than the southwest leader the Panthers.
You wouldn't believe how good the Corsi is for my NHL 12 Be A Pro player.
The problem with that
is that we are the ones GIVING them the damn points.
Its so frustrating.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 26, 2011 10:55 PM EST up reply actions
Southeast*
also Philly & Pitt both have more points in less games than the Panthers.
You wouldn't believe how good the Corsi is for my NHL 12 Be A Pro player.
all my fault
My hopeful little fan post was interpreted as a pr*j*cti*n by the Hockey Gods.
I am such an idiot.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
Huh?
Yet another Moulson brother-in-law.
by ICanSeeForIslesAndIsles on Dec 27, 2011 12:33 PM EST up reply actions
running joke
The idea is that if you predict the Isles as a group or any of them as individuals to do well, they get hurt…
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
Personnel Problems
The only line really producing is the Tavares line and as we continue to see teams just key in on that. The second line is too inconsistent to draw pressure off of the first. Nielsen hasn’t been on his A game this season for whatever reason, Okposo has been streaky, and teams have caught on to Grabner’s speed (not that he has a defense that can get him an outlet pass.) The third line is pretty much non existent outside of a resurgent Bailey. Nino isn’t NHL ready yet, Rolston has been terrible when healthy, Ullstrom is out. Then the 4th line just hasn’t been that great outside of Martin. Reasoner has been a major bust.
These are just a few of the problems without even discussing the lack of passing we’re getting from the defense. Until we get more line balance we aren’t going to see Tavares full potential and the team will continue to slide. We essentially are operating with 1.5 offensive lines right now.
You wouldn't believe how good the Corsi is for my NHL 12 Be A Pro player.
Yes indeed
To me, one of the biggest problems on this team is the precipitous drop-off between first line production and EVERYONE else. You say Bailey is a resurgent forward. In the last 5 games he has one point. One point. And that was an assist.
I would have said the only resurgent forward is KO. Know how many point he has in the last 5 games? One.
To be fair, leaving out the number one line, there are no resurgent forwards on this team, and therein lies the problem. After the top forward on the number one line, there is a 13 point drop-off to the number 4 forward on the team, and that is Nielsen, who we all think of as primarily a defensive forward.
The Rangers, on the other hand, have an injury, they bring up Hagelin, and he pops off 6 goals in 16 games.
werrd on nielsen...
another one of our ‘top’ guys playing below average, except in the shootout ofcourse. maybe he’s playing down to his salary….
Is this Cappy on Garth?
Capuano says that they aren’t losing games because of systems, but because not everyone is doing what is needed to win.
I’d like to think that David can beat Goliath 1 in every 100 fights. Well, they got their 1… if Snow doesn’t do something besides make excuses they are gonna be on this side of the results for anotther 96 or so.
IMHO the parts that are out there are doing a helluva job for the level of talent they have. Guys like Jurcina and Wallace have played way above their pay grade. There is not one guy [who is not recovering from injury] that I can point a finger at and say, he’s just floating. Maybe the worst guy, in that regard, is Nino… and that’s just lack of knowledge more than lack of effort.
I wonder if there is any chance in hell we could see Reese, Wishart or deHaan before tthey are mathmatically eliminated by Mid January.
Right now their avg home attendance is 12.6K. It will be under 10K by April. I can understand the fans that will want to see Capuano get fired, but this is all on Garth Snow, and his inability to put together an NHL defense. I’m not sure anybody could have done much better, but in that regard he has officially failed.
I just hope when they do a mid term sit down with the media he takes the hit like a man.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
There was also this
“We gotta re-evaluate our, uh, situation, and play the guys who are playing at the level we ask them to compete at.”
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
I'd like to see that... in context.
Because those were the jackass coments that gordon used to make when he had no answers.
I can’t see them getting any more out of that $20M payroll. You have a top line that consists of a first overall 21 year old, and two 27 year-olds that have less than 200 NHL games under their belts.
The defense is led by a 21 year old who looks like he needs ID to get into R rated movies.
How can you throw those guys under the bus?
I guess that could be read exactly like that… but I think he needs to word it a little better.
“Those guys played a tough game out there tonight. That’s a good team in the other locker room… and they just out-talented us tonight… especially Lundquist”
or
“I’m training a twenty thousand dollar claimer to run in the Breeders Cup… If you want a f***ing Disney movie the theater is across the street.”
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
Cappy's statements
are Crappy
this team is playing hard (or at least they did last night) – they hit a few posts – the game could have easily been tied – they weren’t outplayed, the Rangers have excellent defensive structure (they blocked a million shots) and Henrik is at his peak – they will be a force in the playoffs and we’ve played them fairly evenly all year
he should be talking up his players after a game like this
or shuffling the lines when they don’t work anymore (FNGO stopped working long ago but he keeps trotting them out there – simliar Rolston earlier)
Cappy is the one who is apparently Crappy
I just got to see the video link...
In the context of the full interview I can understand where he is coming from. But not in the context of the whole team.
They are really close, but the most important link, is their weakest link. I didn’t see any of the forward lines, except for maybe Bailey’s that wasn’t “competing”… and that may just be because they are lost. When Ullstrom comes back he has to be on that line. I’d like somebody to tell me that Martin doesn’t “compete”.
Bailey is like a drunk in a revolving door. Every time he finds his footing they start rotating the door again. Last year it was on RW… now it’s on BOTH wings. That kid never seems to have consistent linemates… and some people here think they should shuffle lines MORE. I’d say plug him in between Grabner and Okpos and be done with it. Nielsen is the better defensive center, and will be able to adapt better with defensive responsibilities and an ever changing supporting cast.
As far as “passengers” I’d disagree on most of the defense as well… MacHamonic obviously are engaged. Jurcina is playing the best hockey of his career, and the other three are playing like three guys just out fo the hospital…
The only guy really making poor decisions in respect to his pay grade… unfortunately is Mark Streit… and who here wants to throw HIM under the bus.
Eaton and Mottau are 5-6 defenders. So it will be no surprise when they see the pressbox (because they can’t waive Eaton’s $2.5M Mule Hit) in favor of Reese and deHaan.
I wonder if when he says ’THEY’RE’ not playing physically he is talking about WISHART whom he’d like to have on the roster, but refuses to play the game that way.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
Line shuffling
or shuffling the lines when they don’t work anymore
We have a winner: http://www.lighthousehockey.com/2011/12/27/2663886/new-york-islanders-shuffle-lines-nhl-stat-sheets.
Agree, they’ve played the Rangers pretty closely this year. Not a lot of “not competing high enough” in my book.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
Every game- all 4 of them so far- have ended with an ENG
They have all been close.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 1:25 PM EST up reply actions
FTFY
Every gameall 4 of them so farthat the Isles have played all year have ended with an ENG.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
HA!
Every game is an ENG or a SO… or, as in the morst recent case, both!!!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 1:35 PM EST up reply actions
that was telling.
Cappy mentioning more than once that some skaters are either passengers or not competing, reminds me of the moment just before the first call up of Haley. The team’s mood strikes me as similar, too, with losses in their last six and no Montoya in net.
As usual...
I’m gonna be the one to call the king naked. I saw a team that was competing to the best of their ability. There were times in that game that the Rangers couldn’t get out of their own zone. No team is going to hold down the rangers for 60 minutes, and the Islanders kept them to 2 goals… with their $20M payroll.
This reminded me of a scenario in 2006 after the Giants lost a close game to the Eagles. While walking off the field a reporter caught Antonio Pierce and asked him what he thought of the game…“That was two good teams in a battle, they got the better of us today… a helluva game… we’ll do it again”.
Later in the locker room, when asked why he wasn’t able to break any big runs, Tiki said that some of the guys just aren’t pulling their weight.
2007.. Tiki gone… 2010 Tiki holed up in an apartment with his girlfriend while his wife gave birth to their twins…
2011… Tiki doing personal appearences for Dick’s (still the most appropriate engagement of the year)
2007… Antonio Pierce was the signal caller on defense in one of the greatest super bowl games ever.
The guys on the ice need to do exactly what they have been doing. The guy behind the bench needs to keep looking for ways to get a $20M team to compete in a $60M league, and the GM had better find some ways to help both team and coach SUCCEED!
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
by JPinVA on Dec 27, 2011 9:59 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I second that......
been saying it since last season
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 10:16 AM EST up reply actions
You're so fickle Cary
When they’re winning you like Cappy, when they’re losing you wanna send him to the guillotine.
by sayvillelax94 on Dec 27, 2011 10:29 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
it becomes clearer with time
that he is simply out of his depth
this team has some talent – but effort they don’t lack – aside from perhaps Mottau & Grabner they all tried hard last night – and Grabner wasn’t that bad per se
Yeah, what's up with Grabner?
Maybe he needs a rest – there is something very unenergetic (for him) about his play lately. Could it still be the groin? Something mental? Mabye give him 2 games rest for his own sake.
It is Diduck.
he's been this eay all year
since that opening night shoutout vs Florida
the team hasn’t progressed or regressed – stuck on neutral
I agree
Not that he’s terrible or the sole problem but he has no experience. HE also doesn’t know how to help an NHL superstar on his way (JT). Look at how JT played in the World Championships, best player on Canada’s roster!
UVa Student. Twitter: @ericdavidmorris
by edavidmorris on Dec 27, 2011 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
he's the best player on the Isles roster too
Dominating a World Juniors full of teenagers is not the same degree of difficulty as dominating a league of the best 500 or so hockey players on earth. Just sayin’ is all.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
hes not talking about juniors...
He led Canada in goal scoring at the worlds. Not the world juniors. Which is why we are completely short changing Tavares and the team by not giving him a real talent to play with.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 1:12 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
my mistake
Still, the Worlds are held during the NHL playoffs, and many of the other countries lose their best players to NHL playoff teams. Look at the US roster for 2010, for crying out loud. Are there more than three guys on that club that would make the National Team for the Olympics?
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
AGREE: I wanted Hitchcock
Look what he is doing in STL.
We are all Islanders, even if we’re from Jersey!
by Russel Ginart on Dec 27, 2011 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
Competing....
Maybe, its just me, but i rarely see an Isles team that competes. Theres a clear difference when the team competes and when it doesnt. They looked great against Minnesota and Winnipeg. I did not see the same effort in the last 3 games. Maybe it’s a result of another team taking the play away and making the Isles look lost, but too often this team appears to go through the motions. I see way too much cat and mouse and not nearly enough engaging, aggressive forechecks and getting pucks and bodies to the net when the perimeter game isnt working. Whether you want to call it effort or whatever, this team is WAY too passive for my liking and when you are in the position they are in there is no excuse for passive play.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 10:15 AM EST up reply actions
Disagree
In the Ranger game last week, they were competing in every facet of the game with the Rags: skating, hitting, passing, etc. Just not pucks in the net.
Even last night, to me the Rangers were not better by leaps and bounds. The only area I thought the Rangers were CLEARLY better was in goal.
I certainly do not think they have been passive the last few weeks.
by JackandAce on Dec 27, 2011 10:21 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Apparently we see games much differently then.......
So you are disagreeing with Capuano on the players compete level? You feel all players are giving it their all and there is nothing this team can possibly do to be better with the talent level it has? More power to ya…
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
he's gonna say that
He pretty much has to say that. He’s trying to keep his team working hard without results to show for it.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
by mikb on Dec 27, 2011 1:01 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
he was just the opposite earlier in the season....
Earlier this season every Capuano post game was the same…..“the guys battled”, “we had our chances”, " a couple of bounces"….etc… Why in the world would you tell a team who is competing hard that some of the guys arent competing when in actuality they are?? Sorry, poor excuse. You tell the team to keep competing the way they are, forge their identity and eventually things will start going your way. You dont use reverse pyschology on the team. Unfortunately, the team isnt competing enough so i agree with his “passengers” assesment, but he does nothing to rectify it which is why hes a terrible coach.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 1:09 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe his voodoo dolls were delayed in shipping due to the Christmas rush
He doesn’t have a player editor. He can’t rewind Rolston to 1998 and inspire Mottau and Staios to Persson and Jonsson performance. You seem to think he has as much control over the Islanders as you have over your NHL12 franchise.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
Ok alteast you revealed what im dealing with here....
No he cant give players more talent but he can demand that they play a certain way in a certain system.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 3:04 PM EST up reply actions
"demand" it how, exactly?
He makes the demand, and some of them just cant do it. So what do you want him to DO? Specifically? Take it all the way through in your mind and spell it out.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 3:06 PM EST up reply actions
24/7 Episode 2: how Tortorella demands it
and don’t know how Capuano does or doesn’t do it but this is how the coach of the 1st place East Conf team does it:
In the locker room during the 1st Period Intermission, down 2 goals to the St. Louis Blues
I asked you to [expletive] defend. I’ve seen you [expletive] defend before! And you’re gonna do it here. If that’s how we’re gonna battle, we’re not going to have a chance TO WIN! Jesus Christ, how much time do we have to talk about it? If that’s all the juice we have, as far as competing against that team, WE WILL GET KILLED TONIGHT. And we have two periods here. So I’ve asked you all to buy into how we have to play. If that’s it, we’re [expletive] done. PACK IT UP! And I know that this [expletive] team isn’t that way. I’VE SEEN YA!
"We’ve got 40 [expletive] minutes to go. Take each shift at a time and chip away. They’re not that good in their end zone. And we know our club. That’s the biggest [expletive] positive of our team is how hard we play. So [expletive] screw it on right here. Screw it on and let’s be ready to go each shift at a time. Stiffen up here! And if you’re not going to be stiff you’re not going to play!
Didn't they lose this game?
May not be the best quote to pull…
Success was survival and, kid, it still is
by IslesFanInNJ on Dec 27, 2011 4:05 PM EST up reply actions
Stiffen up here! And if you’re not going to be stiff you’re not going to play!
Uh huh. I dont seem to recall Torts keeping his word there and benching all the players the next game, maybe someone could correct me on that?
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 4:11 PM EST up reply actions
Having a big mouth does not make you a successful coach.
It doesnt even ensure you win a frickin game.
Tortorello has had MANY losing games and many seasons of not making the playoffs, often working with far more established talent and playoff experience and cup winners than most coaches. Before the Rangers he was fired and was doing TV commentary. Doesnt anyone remember this stuff? And he was just as much of a big mouth then.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 4:08 PM EST up reply actions
a bunch of coaches/GMs get fired and end up doing TV commentary… Melrose, Hitchcock, Goring, MM, Neil Smith, etc. it’s not indicative of anything – other than they know some things about hockey.
Sure, Torts takes it to the extreme but he seems to demand the attention & accountability of all his players whether or not he benches them.
Yeah, Tortorella has “many losing games” but he has a winning record with .532 points in 760 games as a coach. Not bad compared to, say, Al Arbour who has a .564 pts in 1607 GP.
Or vs Laviolette’s .576 in 662 games.
Capuano .465 in 101
Scott Gordon .417 in 181
Ted Nolan .511 in 327
Steve Sterling .520 in 124
Lorne Henning .446 in 223
Goring .410 in 240
wait until you see episode three...
“you can’t score against that piece of shit team? They have a [explitive] kid who should be parking cars at the marriot as their number one defenseman… and you shitheads can’t score. You should be ashamed of yourselves.”
cut to Bickel… his face looks like it just wen through a cheese grater.
“and then we have Bicks… he is getting the shit knocked out of himself for YOU!!! So you can play piddily [explitive] pat… is that all you got… because this team will run you over…”
cut to Lunquist on the phone with his tailor, “yes, sergio, I said two of the Italian cuts and one french… and I didn’t like the shoes you sent… the leather makes my feet sweat… and you know Sean hates a sweaty toe”
“and another thing… if you guys lose to this mickey mouse team… I’m putting Avery back in the lineup”
That’s the magic in the black box!
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
by JPinVA on Dec 27, 2011 4:18 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
LOL!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 4:23 PM EST up reply actions
Yes
I think we are seeing the games much differently. I think it would have been hard to look at last weeks Ranger game and say the Rangers outplayed, outhustled, outhit, and outskated the Isles.
Alas, they did outscore them, the only category that matters.
But compete level was there for the Isles.
We just don’t have the horses.
We don't have the horses BUT we have a Cap Mule! Does that count?
We are all Islanders, even if we’re from Jersey!
by Russel Ginart on Dec 27, 2011 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
Disagree
“Intensity,” “Urgency,” “compete level” etc is there. “Talent” isn’t.
Lighthouse Hockey. Where Islanders fans come to panic with punctuation.
by DP'sknee(andhipandflubugandotherknee) on Dec 27, 2011 11:14 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Obviously disagree
They played a team that is going to the conference championships this year. They have everything you want. They are young, they can play physical and they have GEMS on their first line and in goal…. and the Isalnders were in that game until the EMPTY NET GOAL. At least there was hope until then… that’s 57 minutes of engaging hockey.
SO $20M v $60M and you want to say that they weren’t competing to their talent level. That’s a pretty tough argument to make.
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@JPinVA
by JPinVA on Dec 27, 2011 12:52 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Well, you just said the Rangers are going to the conf championship......
this year. The Rangers are one of the biggest surprises in the league with their place in the standings. So why would you say they are doing so good? Because they have a high payroll? The Rangers have always had a high payroll. They are young, ok so are we. They “can” play physical? Any team “can” play physical. Its the fact that they “do” play physical because their coach demands it. Richards and Gaborik dont even play on the same line and Martin Biron is 7-1 on the season.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 1:02 PM EST up reply actions
Are YOU surprised?
Because I’m not. They have been missing a few pieces for a while, but now they have them. Richards is HUGE. Their defense is carried by young, but not in diapers, defenders who have been raised and culled to play at a very high level. And they have the QUEEN… and I don’t mean that in the usual derogatory sense. Lundquist is like the QUEEN on a chessboard. He can win them 10-15 games, just by not making mistakes.
Add to that a coach who has the confidence that a stanley cup brings, and you have a team that is going to the conf championships.
We don’t have any defense… not a bad one, not a mediocre one… we do not have ONE veteran NHL 20+ minute defender who is not injured or still LEARNING ON THE JOB.
Tavares is an awesome hockey player, where is his peer on the team? They needed to bring a vet forward in 2009 to be not only a mentor (Weight), but to actually play with him… somebody like Tanguay. But what did they do… they went to the scrap heap and got Moulson… who is terrific, but they are LEARNING TOGETHER. Add Parentau… same dynamic.
There is no doubt that I’d have rather had Torts than Gordon in 2008. I’d have rather had Nolan work through the rebuild with Snow… but the real problem is that NOBODY is going to join the circus until they clean up the circus… and by that time who will need them.
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@JPinVA
How can you say the Rangers have defense????
Their #1 do it all dman has been out all year. Ryan McDonagh is a 2nd year dman. Del Zotto didtn even play a full season in the NHL last year. Stralman, Woywitka and Bickell are journeymen. Tim Erixon a rookie. What dmen have been “raised and culled to play at a very high level”? What does that even mean?
I agree on Lundqvist. I think he’s the best goalie in the league, but Biron is also 7-1 on the season.
You already stated in your rebuddle what a good coach can bring so that point is moot.
And i completely agree with the John Tavares comment as i have stated numerous times in the past and multiple times on this thread.
Also 100% agree on the Ted Nolan comment as well. If hiring the right people for the job doesnt help “clean up the circus” then what will?
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 1:27 PM EST up reply actions
you are simply wrong
last night, the Rangers played a GREAT defensive game – they blocked many shots, Henrik was a rock
the Islanders competed hard – hit a few posts, but nothing to show for it
watch the end of the Second Period if you don’t believe me – multiple blocked shots by the Rangers as we swarmed – multiple hobbling Rangers all night – that’s what beat us as much as anything
their team defense was excellent – and that’s exactly what the Bruins did to win last year
kudos to us for playing this Rangers team relatively close all year – shows you how tantalizingly close we are in some ways
you just said i am wrong....
and then proved my point with your comment. No Sh!t their team d-fense was excellent. Their team has excellent discipline and structure and that starts up top with the coach.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 1:38 PM EST up reply actions
You keep telling youself that.
But he was the same fucking coach last year. And the year before.
How about giving the credit to the ones who are actually causing their success- the players!!!!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 1:40 PM EST up reply actions
As I've said before....
The players need to buy into what the coaching staff is preaching in order for it to work. Obviously, the players have bought into it. The whole team is doing what THE COACHING STAFF is asking of them. Therefore, success. What happens to a Ranger player when he doesnt do what the coaching staff asks of him? He sits. Wow, what a concept!
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 3:01 PM EST up reply actions
In your world
A good coach can just magically make players who have bought into his system successful by doing so. But that just isnt reality.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 3:04 PM EST up reply actions
Havent we heard that before from Capuano?
Has anyone seen him do anything to change or rectify this?
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
Well what's he supposed to do?
I’m sure he’s done as much as he can, but no one can get fucking Rolston to move his ass and make Mottau a top (or even good) defenseman. If anything, it falls on the GM, but I don’t blame Garth for this… while I think that it’s possible to acquire a good defenseman, it’s certainly not easy.
by sayvillelax94 on Dec 27, 2011 10:56 PM EST up reply actions
I agree this is on Garth as well.
But, while the Isles sport an untalented defense, their coach doesn’t have to make boneheaded in-game decisions. Garth needs to do more to bring in quality defensemen. With 1 top-4 d-man, this defense may not look as outmatched.
I think it is also clear that FnGO needs some time apart. Okposo is a -14 and Grabner -13 with Nielsen -4. The most defensively responsible line from last year is not so this year.
Can one be an atheist toward a hockey team? That means I have NO faith anymore.
I agree with this
Capuano also did everything he could not to play Eaton-Mottau,
Streit-Jurcina, and Amac-Hamonic played over 16 minutes of the first period
Cappy has to play Eaton-Mottau only becuase he has to, and they were on the ice for goal 2 – sending down Reese was obviously not his call
Cappy also pulled the goalie too early – again – it never works – but it is a statement of his disgust with the team’s inability to score, again a statement about Garth in many ways
line 2 is killing this team now – they are ineffective – that’s on Cappy
he should have mixed these guys up long ago – he isn’t helping matters
would a coach make a drastic inprovement
I think it would have to help having a veteran coach, an experienced look. Is next year the year they spend a lot because of all the contracts gone. Can petrov dehaan kabanov
strome make the team and a difference. Maybe? I mean does Wang love this team doesn’t his head hurt with this poopy play. He could make a difference? I don’t understand and they give the fans absolutely no answers.
by Madchef on Dec 26, 2011 10:41 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Petrov
at camp last year they said that he was good enough to have made the team. I think he’s a solid bottom 6 guy to start with.
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by Mark D on Dec 26, 2011 10:44 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
We can only hope.
I am beyond frustrated with this team.
Shut out- AGAIN.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 26, 2011 10:54 PM EST up reply actions
All they'll be adding are inexperienced forwards...
their better plan would be to take a hard look at tradeable deadline assets like parentau and Nielsen and BULK UP ON DEFENSE.
Next year they will have Kabanov, Strome, Petrov and most likely Nino in the AHL.
They will have tavares, moulson, grabner, okposo, bailey, Ullstrom, martin and reasoner SIGNED.
I kind of like what Wallace brings, and will probably start my GET WALLACE EXtENDED campaign pretty soon. This team does not NEED forwards.All of that inventory and they’ll still have Lee and Nelson cooking in the NCAA.
But let’s say either deHaan or Donovan progresses to the point of NHL responsiblity… the inventory looks like this:
Hamonic, Macdonald, Streit (SIGNED).
They’d better get paper and pen in front of Jurcina pretty soon!
reese is a UFA at the end of the year as well. How pathetic has Snow let this situation get. If he fails to bring in at least one top 4 defenseman next year his starting six could be:
Hamonic, MacDonald, Streit, dehaan, Katic and Wishart (who is an RFA).
PATHETIC
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@JPinVA
PA isn't what I would consider a tradeable asset
unless he absolutely wouldn’t sign with the Isles and I don’t think that’s the case. He’s been very consistent all season and proved he can continue to get points even without Tavares.
You wouldn't believe how good the Corsi is for my NHL 12 Be A Pro player.
He has been one of their best forwards...
for 110+ games. That’s why he’s tradable. Who do you want to trade, Rolston?
He can resign with the Islanders, but I don’t see it happening. especially if he prices himself in the $2.5-3M range. No way… not with the in house forwards they have.
Believe me, I’d like to see them resign him for 3 years… but he doesn’t have the TROJAN CAP HORSE effect. If they ELC Petrov or Kabanov for $2M+ they only really have to spend $700K for them, and if they are buried in the AHL it’s more like $70K.
They need to spend real dollars on REAL DEFENSEMEN.
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@JPinVA
They need to spend real dollars on REAL DEFENSEMEN.
You are right.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 26, 2011 11:52 PM EST up reply actions
But the Isles are losing so many games because their forwards have taken such a step backwards. If they were only doing what they have already done, the Isles would have won so many more games this season its crazy.
The Isles have given up a million ENGs because they ahve been so damn close so many times, and they need that one fucking goal that practically none of their forwards are scoring anymore.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 26, 2011 11:54 PM EST up reply actions
Or alternatively
Are the forwards not scoring, because the defence can’t get the puck to them to create quality scoring chances?
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by since70too on Dec 27, 2011 7:03 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
That's what I think is the issue...
A-Mac isnt making that crisp 1st pass or skating with the puck the way he did last year…Streit doesnt shoot the puck very much…This doesnt help the offense…
When they do shoot the puck, it seems to be into the other teams' feet.
Can one be an atheist toward a hockey team? That means I have NO faith anymore.
creativity in the O zone
I see a lack of offensive creativity in the offensive zone. Even when they controlled play, too many perimeter shots that were blocked by Rags’ D or Henrik (e.g. the long O shift at the end of the 2d).
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by DP'sknee(andhipandflubugandotherknee) on Dec 27, 2011 9:25 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I agree here as well
They forwards have come back all year to help a weak defense. You rarely see a defender carrying the puck through the nuetral zone (Hillen) or defenders causing turnovers (Martinek) at the blue line. Instead you have 5 skaters being used to clear their D zone, and spending 80% of their shifts chasing pucks around because the D (except Hamonic and Jurcina) aren’t taking players out of their cycle.
Offensively, it would be nice to see deHaan, Donovan, Katic, Ness or even Wishart give them a third puck carrying D… but thanks to Jankowski’s SIZE FILTER being 170 lbs none of them are really capable of being NHL defenders or staying healthy… well.. except for Wishart(not a Jankowski pick)… and Bossy only knows what his problem is.
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One point worth noting
The defense has NOT chipped in with any offense! THAT in itself has hurt the overall scoring!
We are all Islanders, even if we’re from Jersey!
by Russel Ginart on Dec 27, 2011 12:23 PM EST up reply actions
As much as I'd hate to see one or both go
You’re right, you have to give to get. They need defense, plain and simple.
And really, outside of Streit, this current crop not only isn’t defending, they aren’t scoring worth crap either…or starting rushes for the offense to score. You’re not gonna get any “secondary scoring” when the lower lines are matched with Eaton/Mottau anyway…so the best you’re looking at is goal prevention…and we’ve seen the snow angels to know how that’s going.
You take away the goals against from empty nets, shootout losses and the DP experiment and replace it with Monty/Nabby numbers and it’s not so bad. With a tweak on the D, that could put things right. Bottom line, we know not much is gonna change with the forwards…we have too many of them in the pipeline with too much promise. Focus on the D.
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by Keith Quinn on Dec 27, 2011 12:52 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
what I'm saying is I'd rather dump Nielsen than PaP
keep the points over the checking forward
You wouldn't believe how good the Corsi is for my NHL 12 Be A Pro player.
I believe Nielsen will be resigned...
Although he has a very good reputation around the league so he could yield a good return..
Strome cannot play in the AHL next season (too young).
I do not see Parenteau as something to dish away, I like the guy and would prefer to keep him.
And as far as it being pathetic to let things be in this D position, I am actually GLAD all those guys arent locked up for years!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 26, 2011 11:07 PM EST up reply actions
You are correct...
for some reason I thought he was a Jully 92 baby. Oh well… that’s another guy who’ll be in the Bailey/Nino position next year. Hopefully they won’t rush him too.
Parentau is an expiring asset. I’d love for them to sign him, but if he doesn’t sign with two weeks before left before the deadline… FOR SALE.
If he wants to be an Islander, then he can be an Islander on July 1 again. The same goes for Nielsen.
Those are the only two assets I could see bringing in a top four defenseman with some time left on his indentured servitude.
I am actually GLAD all those guys arent locked up for years!
The problem is (see July 2007), when you have no safety net you wind digging through the garbage for scraps. Snow has gotten lucky a few times… but there are more Eatons, Mottaus, Wizniewski’s than there were Moulsons, Grabners and Parentau’s. I’m pretty sure Moulson signed with four other guys… all headed to the AHL… none of the others are with the organization anymore.
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@JPinVA
If he fails to bring in at least one top 4 defenseman next year his starting six could be:
Hamonic, MacDonald, Streit, dehaan, Katic and Wishart (who is an RFA).
I think Reese and Jurcina are pretty likely to stay around.
What the Isles need to do is try another Ehrhoff and hope it works. They also need to scout the shit out of the NHL and pick up a Dman who is not getting a lot of time on his team but could handle far more than he is getting (like Streit on Montreal) and then either trade for him or, if applicable, sign him. I can only hope they are doing exactly that.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 26, 2011 11:49 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Thats what i think
They need find that Mark Streit Type in the next UFA class.
A player that is deserving of more responsibility where he is but is not getting it.
I would think that you start on some of the better teams (or teams with better defense) to find that. NAS? DET?
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Twitter: @mikeryaninc
"Past performance Is Not A Guarantee For Future Results"
"Listening is a Skill" -Jack Capuano
I would think that you start on some of the better teams (or teams with better defense) to find that. NAS? DET?
Not necessarily. There are good underrated players under the radar on all different teams. The Isles should leave no stone unturned.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 9:02 AM EST up reply actions
On the bright side
At least Haley beat the shit out of Bickel.
=d
by AP77 on Dec 26, 2011 11:19 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
And yet
We still lost. And he’s out with Islander hand.
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by Keith Quinn on Dec 27, 2011 12:43 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Thats besides the point...
Maybe Bickel will think twice before acting like a dirt bag…
When the D gets healthy, Bickel will be back in the AHL. In the meantime, I’m sure he’ll continue to do everything in his power to stay up here, including acting like a dirt bag.
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by George E. Ays on Dec 27, 2011 8:40 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Heard Staals coming back now- you guys must be frickin giddy.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 11:06 PM EST up reply actions
discouraged
There is nothing this team does well. Goaltending has been the best asset for us. At least Jurcina has been getting some pucks on net, which is more than most of the forwards can say for themselves. I suppose lack of talent is less bad than lack of effort.
It’s been a rough few weeks with the Jets debacles vs. the Giants and Eagles and the Isles dropping two to the Rags.
by isles16 on Dec 26, 2011 11:31 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I beg to differ
JT has been our best player and he tries harder, which I can tell you Pap doesn’t show.
Pap wants the puck and is often caught in situations where he is forced to cough it up because of indecision.
Get out of the sticks, Charles, move to Queens!! Come, Get some respect a Professional team deserves!!
Well for me
JT is a constant #1 so when I mean best player I mean second best haha
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by edavidmorris on Dec 27, 2011 9:43 AM EST up reply actions
Strome and Persson
At least two Isles scored today (Also whoever scored for BPT, didn’t watch it)
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by edavidmorris on Dec 27, 2011 12:20 AM EST via iPhone app reply actions
Reasoner, Nielsen and Streit
Why is Reasoner on this team? ZERO goals in 31 games. He doesn’t even take defensive draws. Waive.
This was discussed in a separate thread, but I’d start putting feelers out on Nielsen. Yes, he’s strong defensively. But for a guy who’s not a big, banging center, he just doesn’t score enough to re-sign, especially with what we have coming at center.
I’d also put out feelers on Streit. I don’t know whether it’s the shoulder, or the constant losing, or maybe both, but he’s not the same player. An offensive defenseman (even maybe diminished) with one more year at $4 million might bring a pretty good return from a contender looking for a PP defenseman.
And Grabner’s gotta pick it up. Floats a lot this year. Disappointing.
Why the hating on Nino?
I was at Friday night’s game and actually thought he was one of the stronger, more mobile guys on the ice. Yeah, he looks confused out there at times, but so do guys on the team who are a decade his veteran. He’s confident for someone his age and shows the desire to prove himself.
When you’ve got a kid – and one of the future pillars of your franchise, no less – who has that confidence as well as the size, strength, and speed to play in the NHL, and you have a team that’s clearly not going to be contending for the playoffs, there’s nothing to lose by playing that kid 15:00 a night. Let him get all the rookie mistakes out of his system and adjust to the speed of the NHL game, and you’ll be reaping the awards one or two years from now when we actually have a playoff team.
The worst thing for this kid is not being held away from Portland or the AHL (the WJC would have been okay, though), but not having the support of the fans, press, and organization. A 19 year-old who has only 20-some games under his belt should not be the guy people are pointing their fingers at as long as he’s demonstrating the desire to establish himself night in and night out.
Agreed.
At this point I’ll take “floating”, “learning” young’ins over daydreaming vets. And I thought Nino looked at least determined with the puck each time he had it.
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by CharlieIsles on Dec 27, 2011 9:31 AM EST up reply actions
Count me in...
I agree Nino has made some mistakes on the ice, but I also believe he hasnt been put into position to succeed…4th line minutes, Come on Man ;)
Just for thought, maybe Nino makes mistakes on the ice because he isnt being coached properly? Lack of structure starts at the top.
Nino makes mistakes on the ice because he isnt being coached properly? Lack of structure starts at the top.
BattFist; were you on old Newsday blog site? Or maybe IPB with Chris Botta? Regardless, I tend to agree with you with the “lack of structure” part. Defensive structure need to be improved.
We are all Islanders, even if we’re from Jersey!
by Russel Ginart on Dec 27, 2011 12:28 PM EST up reply actions
didnt the isles say last year that they wouldnt keep nino here unless.......
he was capable of being a top 6 forward? Guess that comment was quickly thrown out the window……
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 12:49 PM EST up reply actions
That was before they read mikb's post about the penalties for being below the cap floor.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 12:52 PM EST up reply actions
if they're taking MY advice we're all completely hosed.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
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by mikb on Dec 27, 2011 1:02 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
LOL! :D
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 1:23 PM EST up reply actions
There is another side to this...
Nino had a great run in Portland, but they aren’t teaching how to deal with NHL talent in the WHL. If they sent him back to Portland he’d have gotten the 15+ minutes, which would have maintained his offensive talents. Then next year he would have started in the AHL… where he would have learned, in stages, how to deal with professional hockey.
It’s killing me to watch him now. I think Nino is going to be a really good, if not exceptional, top six NHL forward… but somebody is going to have to give him some more one-on-one time. I’d have liked to have seen Guerin stick around to do what Weight did for JT. There is nobody on this team to learn from.
I want to see Nino grow into what Kyle is becoming… but Kyle hasn’t even gotten there yet. He needs a Nystrom, Tonelli or Gillies model to learn from if he is going to be at the NHL level. Otherwise his bad WHL habits are just gonna have his head spinning… and that’s where the frustration sets in.
It’s what we’ve been seeing with Bailey for three years. What would an extra year of juniors and a year in the AHL done for Josh Bailey…. who knows?
Nino is here, and he’s here to stay… but he’s not even playing at the level of David Ullstrom, and Nino (possibly) is far more talented than David…. but David was properly staged into the NHL. Nino, like Bailey, is going from kindergarten to high school. The difference between Josh and Nino is that the Islanders don’t need a fourth line Nino.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
For arguments sake...
What do the Islanders have to lose putting Nino on a line with JT, for 12 games?
Maybe even give Nino some powerplay time?
What you saying could very well be true. But he is playing 4th line minutes….
My guess
is that they wouldn’t even do that until the Isles are officially eliminated from the playoffs.
by barry_hal_oliver_24 on Dec 27, 2011 11:19 AM EST up reply actions
Nino Argument
You have one line that works… no doubt this would make Nino better, but it would definitely take away from what Moulson-Tavares-Parentau brings.
Nino needs to play in a reduced role with either Nielsen or Reasoner. Why?
Nino-Nielsen-Martin(eventually Ullstrom) gives him more of a defensively responsible role. This is what he needs to learn, without great expense. Nielsen is priceless as a defensive center… he not only makes the team better in that role, but he makes his linemates better. The perfect case in point is Grabner, and to a lesser degree Okposo. He basically shed their defensive responsibilities last year to make them PLUS players.
Okposo was a negative infinity until he started playing with Frans. It’s time for him and Grabs to get their training wheels off… and for Nino to put them on.
If he was to play with Reasoner he’d just get a reduced role with physiucal protection from Martin, Haley or Wallace. This is safer for the team, but he’d have the governor on… his abilities as an offensive player would be reduced considerably by the level of his linemates… but his TOI would be reduced to counter his stature as a defensive liability.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
I agree...This team lacks guys in their primes who can show these guys what can be done and how to do it in the NHL...
Its the blind leading the blind, otherwise…
Who is hating on Nino?
I can’t tell where that one is directed. Who is pointing fingers at him?
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I hate Nino!
It’s hard to add him as a preferred passenger on the scapewagon given that he has no business being in the NHL this season at all, but . . . really? He has looked terrible out there.
=d
I don't hate Nino...
but I will argue that he doesn’t belong in the NHL this year… and probably next eyar either.
I don’t know why they feel compelled to have kids in the NHL when they can’t play at the level… especially when they’ve used the AHL to prepare guys like Ullstrom(INJ), Dibenedetto(INJ) and Rakhshani… and have very capable guys like Haley, Wallace and Colltion(INJ).
Nino should have been sent to Portland with note on his ass… “TEACH THIS KID HOW TO PLAY IN HIS OWN END…NO PUN INTENDED”
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
Comparisons
The thing is, Nino is not Ullstrom or Dibenedetto or Rakhshani. We’re talking about a top-five draft pick who may have more raw hockey talent than anyone on this roster outside of JT. It’s way too early to be passing “not ready for the NHL” judgments on him. I personally think he’ll establish himself as a top-six forward on this team by season end. I could be wrong on this, but let’s at least give him the chance and cut him the slack that a player his age and inexperience deserves. So what if he makes his share of rookie mistakes. This team ain’t heading for the playoffs, right?
Nino is one of the reasons...
“This team ain’t heading for the playoffs, right?”
…this quote is correct.
Instead of Pandolfo, they might have been better off with Rakhshani… but he got hurt in camp.
Instead of tying up a roster spot with Nino they could have gone with Ullstrom from day one.
Wallace has been more NHL ready than Nino… that is a FACT. Dibo played beter last year than Nino…. not because he has more talent, but because he is more prepared. Nino is 19, and yes, he may have more talent than all of them combined, but like most NHL top five picks that aren’t top 2 picks, we probably won’t see a good portion of his talent until he is 21 or 22. Right now he’s a fourth line winger burning the first year of his ELC so they can put his full ELC on the books to get to the cap floor… while only paying him about half.
It’s the inability to manage assets with veteran players that has kept this team in the hole this year… and rushing them isn’t going to get to their potential any faster… (see Josh Bailey).
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
Rushing/Development
“Rushing them isn’t going to get to their potential any faster… (see Josh Bailey).” But what about Hamonic? Granted, he wasn’t rushed quite as fast, but I still think it provides a legimate counter-argument. And there are other counter-arguments in the league that aren’t top-two draft picks. Every player develops at a different pace and you just don’t know until you’ve thrown them into that “sink or swim” position.
The argument for taking the chance or rushing Nino is that he has the size, strength, and lack of timidity that you often don’t see from players his age and that we certainly haven’t seen from Bailey. If their approach to him backfires, it won’t be because he was rushed, but because he didn’t get the support of the organization during this vital stage of his development. That will be the shot to his confidence, i.e. not getting the respect that a top-five pick with his potential deserves.
BTW, I totally agree that he needs a Weight-like figure like JT had. It is too bad that a guy like Guerin isn’t still around.
the question here is more about the team
Do you want to make the playoffs, or not?
If they had a margin to use a roster spot to develop somebody who is NOT READY NOW, then ok
This team does not have a margin for development with the ability to improve enough to make the playoffs. They shouldn’t give up on the playoffs until they are completely out of it, and that will be soon enough with the other roster decisions that have been made.
There’s no way they succeed this year with Rolston, Pandolfo, Mottai and Nino eating up roster spots.
But, if they want to prepare for next year, this is a better place for Nino than Portland, and they will need to move 1 or 2 players to get at least one top 4 defenseman to move on with.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
I cant believe there wont be playoffs again!
Its not even new years and the playoffs are highly unlikely. This is rediculous. Where’s the improvment?
Best typo ever
Re-diculous…. as in, diculous all over again. Repeat diculous. Endless diculous.
The Grinch stole our hockey team and dumped it off the top of Mount Crumpet.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
by mikb on Dec 27, 2011 9:37 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Not much to add. The rest of the NHL and Islanders are on two different planes right now.
The funny thing is, everyone has their theory on what’s wrong with the team and I think every one of them is 100% legit. No D, no O, no bite, coach mistakes, management mistakes, young guys not playing like older guys, older guys playing like shit and injuries – it’s all part of the equation.
Personally, the only thing that keeps me going is the fact that the team’s best players are (for the most part) 25 or younger.
"He's depriving some small village of a pretty good idiot" - Mike Milbury on Ziggy Palffy's agent. On Twitter: @Dan_of_Science
by PGI on Dec 27, 2011 1:17 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Agreed on the under 25 bit...
I actually get pleasantly surprised when I am reminded how young our better players are… That being said, this season has just been so bizarre to me. We had it all in place, the team was playing unbelievable at the end of last season… what changed? We got the goaltending we needed with Montoya and even Nabby, but now the D has fallen flat, and so has most of the O, I don’t get it, I really don’t
Garth revamped the heart of the team...
Thats what changed
At 6 below... (6 more reg losses than wins)
Isles are 4th-to-last by a healthy margin right now. I want Isles to win games, but I’d rather they finish 14th or 15th in East than 10th or 11th.
Trying to look at it objectively, if Osles can acquire a top-4 defenseman and a top-5 draft pick before the start of next season, those could be two big pieces for the rebuild.
"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."
by North Dakota Red Eagle on Dec 27, 2011 2:20 AM EST reply actions
Another top-5 might be necessary...
but it is hard to watch. We all know the clock is ticking on the lease, so watching another losing season of a top-5 pick is in essence the first failure of the rebuild. It keeps feeling as if Garth is building a contender for another city, and that is most aggravating. We get all the shitty hockey, while someone else reaps the rewards (Quebec-Colorado…).
Can one be an atheist toward a hockey team? That means I have NO faith anymore.
On the other hand...
If your like me and sorry to be seeing all these bad losses, would it be a change for the good if we traded our first round pick for someone that will make an impact right away?
Get out of the sticks, Charles, move to Queens!! Come, Get some respect a Professional team deserves!!
Well
It’s a move that rarely works out well in the long run.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
Ducks/Sharks
OT: I went to Ducks at Sharks game tonight. Terrific sight lines from near the last row up, above a blue line. Very steep. Sharks fans hate Perry. The “Ducks Suck” chant sounded even more juvenile than the typical hockey “sucks” chants because of the rhyme, and quick repetition. Niemi let in two very soft goals. (If Rick let in these, he probably would have been pelted with something.) Guy next to me was talkative. Mostly just babbling, but had pretty good hockey knowledge. Said Demers is going to turn into a high-scoring defenseman in a few years. (We’ll see.) About 5 minutes left, a fan throws something on the ice. I though it was a squid. (I was high up.) Turned out to be a duck. Not sure if it was artificial, but it definitely wasn’t alive.
"The reader of this sentence exists only while reading me."
by North Dakota Red Eagle on Dec 27, 2011 2:32 AM EST reply actions
Seems that arena was built at the right time
New enough to not be too old, but old enough to not be a shrine to luxury boxes.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
This teams defense is so bad
I don’t even know what to think of a third line pairing in the NHL. It’d be nice if we have Hillen or Martinek to fill in and give Streit some time off.
Constantly building for the future.
Considering Cap’s post game comments, I think he needs to be shown the door. It is easier to change coaches than players (since you need to find trading partners). He consistently blames “passengers,” but absolves himself of the blame for the losses. Who pulls the goalie with no plan for the sixth man? Who pulls the goalie with 3+ minutes left in the game? Who pulls the goalie before the team even gets possession IN the zone? I think it’s a mix of Cap phoning it in AND the players phoning it in. Their record is nearly identical to last season, so clearly Cap isn’t improving anything. Let’s also remember that they have lost plenty of games without Rolston and Pandolfo and Ricky in the lineup, so we can’t blame those guys for these recent losses.
Can one be an atheist toward a hockey team? That means I have NO faith anymore.
Does changing the coach just make a tenuous situation even more dicey?
Two coaching changes in two years? Woof.
I know that change makes a difference, but how many times can Garth Snow pull that trigger? I doubt that Cappy is coming back next year unless, regardless. Would waiting until the end of the year and having a thorough coaching search make more sense?
There was an interesting article in THN’s Jan 2nd issue concerning canning a coach during the season. There is a little graph highlighting the Points Percentage Trends.
“GMs make in-season coaching changes hoping for quick upticks in wins. The stats from 2000-1 to 2010-11, however, indicate it doesn’t take long before the new face becomes old hat once again.
1st 10 games w/ new coach: .505 winning %
11-20: .502
21-30: .514
31-40: .514
41-50: .521
51-60: .497
61-70: .381
71-82: .483
Cappy is at 99 games and counting, the graph doesn’t that far, but I think one can extrapolate the data to see that its trending downward. Though there would be an uptick for the rest of the season under a new coach (considering the law of averages), I would rather see a well thought out approach to the next head coach and I think waiting until the off-season is the best route for sustained success, not just a quick glimmer of fleeting hope.
or just dont hire guys who arent qualified in the 1st place...
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 12:05 PM EST up reply actions
Yes, this.
We’ve experienced two AHL coaches who are cutting their teeth in the NHL with the Isles, and what success have we witnessed? Some moments of positive play, some moments of OMG this team is for real, but too many moments of eyeing our roster holes and wishing for a miracle. Let’s get a real NHL coach at the helm. If the team doesn’t improve, then you find ways to move the players.
Tick-tock, tick-tock, tick-tock...
Nothing wrong with an AHL coach...
if they have something to work with.
Lavy was a first year coach from Providence… playoffs… twice.
Sterling… bridgeport… playoffs…
Shaw cut his teeth on the Isles and did an okay job with kids… no expectations.
Nolan… out of coaching for ten years except at the Junior level. Playoffs… and then gone because he couldn’t work with kids(?)
Gordon… crap in, crap out. How could you possibly tell if he was a good coach with the roster he was given for three years. But he really didn’t get them anywhere. Gone.
Capuano got results last year with an even worse roster than Gordon started with. Now he’s feeling the pressure of taking the next step, with the worst defenive roster than any Islander coach has had to deal with since Butch Goring…but he’s asked to base results on a group of forwards that should be way better than they have been… well.. it just doesn’t work that way.
the problem is a little higher than the coaching ranks… but what options do we have there?
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
by JPinVA on Dec 28, 2011 1:48 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
20 + %
more than 1 in 5 games, we don’t score a goal ???
and this isn’t on the coaching staff and snow?
time to quadruple shift JT i guess
These comments crawl up from the depths of the deepest Chasm of Saar
The organization as a whole is lost....
I’ve given them the benefit of the doubt since the rebuild, but enough is enough. Im still chuckling about Garth Snow’s comment in the paper weeks ago about the “playoff push”. Jack Capuano is not an NHL caliber coach. I’ve never seen anyone look more lost as a coach and the Isles have had some pretty bad ones. The Isles have had the same line combinations for over a year now. Guess what, didnt work before and still isnt working now. Something as small as that really makes me shake my head as to the how and why of the situation. There are countless problems and i dont see anything being done to try to correct or help the situation. The Isles are doing themselves a huge disservice by not bringing in someone to play with John Tavares. Say what you want about MOulson and P.A., but 90% of the goals scored by the 1st line are a result of what John Tavares is doing, whether he touches the puck or not. There is no guidance, no structure and absolutely no identity and seemingly no repercussions for anyone. This team is going nowhere fast and unless something drastically changes the trend will continue. The organization (Garth) needs to bring in experienced, well respected players/personnel to get this team going in the right direction. Garth tried to do that with Smyth and Nolan. It worked for the time we had them. We need another move like that. Until then i’ll continue to pre-order my NHL draft magazines early.
Im losing patience too
Who would you hire to fix this mess?
It too late Hitchcock has been hired!
We are all Islanders, even if we’re from Jersey!
by Russel Ginart on Dec 27, 2011 12:33 PM EST up reply actions
self perpetuating circus
The Isles have had the same line combinations for over a year now. Guess what, didnt work before and still isnt working now
Moulson… AHL Lifer to 30 goal scorer. Possibly for three years.
Parentau… AHL lifer to 50 point NHLer.
Grabner… Waived in September… Calder trophy candidate in February.
Somebody shuffled lines for three years and got SQUADOOSH… but we have short memories, don’t we.
Unless they can get an NHL Coach to buy into the $20M payroll (not likely) they are going to have to deal with a guy who has limited abilities dealing with limited tools.
I’m not saying that Capuano is an Al Arbour in the making, but he has done pretty well to keep this pile of crap competetive.
Find an inexpensive coach that will bring 3 quality NHL defensemen with him and I’ll sign on. As a matter of fact, their coaching staff has been so good that they will probably lose a guy like Chynoweth next year. Think of what Cappy and Dean have done for guys like Hamonic, Macdonald, Hillen, Katic, Reese…
I agree, that sometimes it would be nice to have a Torts behind the bench… but after 10 years of milbury, and then the circus that Wang created in 2006 it’ll be a long time before any legit coach signs up for this disaster. By firing another one, it just perpetuates the perception. This is just not the time to point the finger at a coach who is DEFINITELY not the biggest reason this team is losing.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
by JPinVA on Dec 27, 2011 10:41 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
I agree...
Cappy doesnt have the personnel.
But the team he is in charge of is making too many mistakes.
-Shutout 7 times (next closes team is at 4).
-Powerplay is awful…beginning with the players put together on the top unit.
-Pulling the goalie is a nightmare.
-Besides Hamonic, the rest of the D plays below average.
There is lack of talent and injuries, but I wonder if Cappy is the right guy. I think its fair to ask if this team needs a veteran coach.
More than fair to ask...
But…
the coach doesn’t score goals. They are getting plenty of opportunities. This is more of a defensive talent issue, as discussed previously.
the PP isn’t AWFUL, they are actually in the middle of the NHL. They were AWFUL with Rolston on the PP point. Maybe cappy needed to lower the hammer before fate did… but again… GM v coach… I’m not sure why Weight is behind the bench, or why Rolston was on the team… but I don’t think either were Capuano choices.
Pulling the goalie… what else can you do when you’re down by two. I agree, they should havea better plan… but do you know what their plan is? I don’t… the question is, is that a coaching thing, or an execution thing.
Besides Hamonic the defense is coming off injury or just plain sucks. What more can you say? Were Eaton, Mottau, Jurcina or any of the other scrap heapers ever considered QUALITY 20+ minute NHL defenders? Why is Capuano charged with making that a capable NHL defense. Isn’t it more telling that Hamonic and Macdonald are so good having been shaped by Dean and Cappy. Even Streit has regressed, and I’m not sure if it’s because he’s hurt (very possible) or he just isn’t ready to be less than the 4th forward that he was in the Gordon system.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
by JPinVA on Dec 27, 2011 11:21 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Besides Hamonic the defense is coming off injury or just plain sucks. What more can you say? Were Eaton, Mottau, Jurcina or any of the other scrap heapers ever considered QUALITY 20+ minute NHL defenders? Why is Capuano charged with making that a capable NHL defense. Isn’t it more telling that Hamonic and Macdonald are so good having been shaped by Dean and Cappy.
Very valid point, IMO.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 2:16 PM EST up reply actions
disagree on all accounts.....
Are you saying that the Isles were able to pick up two 26 year olds from other teams because they were the result of too much line shuffling with their former clubs? Moulson and PA are nice players but they can not and should not be asked to carry a team. Grabner was a no brainer. Im sure 20+ teams would have put in a claim on him.
So you admit that Jack Capuano has “limited abilities”. I understand not every coach wants to coach the Isles, but there are 30 NHL coaching jobs in the world. We can find a good one. Capuano is doing almost as poorly as Gordon did last year and Cappy has a healthy Okposo and Streit in the lineup and is getting solid goaltending and has a much more rounded and mature John Tavares in the lineup. I dont think hes holding anything together and i absolutely point to him as the biggest reason.
The one point i will agree on is the hiring and firing of too many coach’s. This could have been avoided by not hiring him in the 1st place. He was labeled interim when he came in. The team continues to do everything ass backwards. I dont think hiring a well respected veteran NHL coach will perpetuate a circus perception. A lot more players will be willing to come to play for a Boudreau(already taken), Hitchcock (already taken), Carlyle, Maurice than to come play for Jack Capuano.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 11:31 AM EST up reply actions
No, what he's saying is
Gordon shuffled lines constantly with no results and many complaining that he needed to give them time to build chemistry. After Capuano did that, Moulson got his 60pt season, PAP was revealed as a 50+point performer, and Grabner scored 30+ goals.
While shuffling could give a “spark”, it’s usually better to allow the guys time to build chemistry…to know each other’s tendencies and where they will be on the ice. Realistically (again), Bailey hasn’t had very consistent linemates, and neither has the fourth line. The only two that have are the top two. One of which you’re not breaking up, and the other is the “shutdown” line with the “future captain”, “calder candidate” and “selke candidate”. Tough to break that up.
I don’t know if you’re going to “coach” 50 points out of Bailey by playing him with Wallace, Comeau, Nino, Ullstrom, Martin, Rolston, Gillies, Haley, etc. But naming the number of people I have, there’s already an almost infinitesimal amount of combinations there…and he’s certainly not going to coach youth or talent or health into Staios, ROlston, Eaton, Jurcina, DP, Mottau, Reasoner, Wallace or Haley.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
by Keith Quinn on Dec 27, 2011 11:43 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Sorry
Tavares got the 50pt season, Moulson the second 30 goal season. Basically, Capuano is responsible for the limited chemistry the team has now…which was far worse under Gordon in my opinion.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
by Keith Quinn on Dec 27, 2011 11:44 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
11-17-6, Dead last in Eastern Conference
Shutout 7 times…
Something has to change….
Maybe its time to spread out the talent.
Oh, agree it may
but honestly, if done, I’d like it to be some minor tweaks with some time to build the chemistry. I just hate when they try 12 different combos a game.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
by Keith Quinn on Dec 27, 2011 12:05 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe switch a few things...
MM-JT-DU (MM) or NN-JT-PAP
MG-FN-PAP MM-JB-KO
NN-JB-KO MG-FN-MM (DU)
BR-MR-JP
TH-AM
MS-MJ
SS-ME
I wouldnt mind shaking up the D….
Im not saying he should go Tom Gordon on the lines....
but the team finished 26th overall last year and is in dead last by 9 points so far this year. So something isnt working there. If you put Josh Bailey and Kyle Okposo on the 1st line with Tavares they would have similar numbers to Moulson and Parenteau. Moulson and PA are put in every single offensive situation. Play the 1st part of every single PP and get a huge majority of offensive zone faceoffs. Players who are put in those situations will put up points especially playing with John Tavares. I dont think Capuano is responsible for turning Moulson into a 30 goal scorer and PA into a 50 pt guy. He just gives them 1st line minutes and offensive opportunities. I’ve never witnessed a team having the same line combinations for over a year with such a poor team record.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 12:14 PM EST up reply actions
Here you go then
NYIslanders @NYIslanders 1m
Team is taking the ice for practice. Lines are looking different. #isles
12:15 PM – 27 Dec 11 via Twitter for iPhone · Details
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
by Keith Quinn on Dec 27, 2011 12:17 PM EST up reply actions
28th overall
Only last in the East. Yay Columbus and Anaheim!
We are, however, the lowest-ranked club among all teams without a U in their name.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
my mistake there....
glanced at the wrong column
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 1:30 PM EST up reply actions
Defense, forward, goal..........
All affect each other. Sounds simplistic but this what I mean. Our forwards on paper and on ice are play- off caliber but are not scoring. Well its partly the weak D, which has trouble advancing the puck and also playing D, against scoring by the opposition. Result the forwards are not getting enough time in the offensive zone, therefore in effect playing too much defensive hockey. The Goalies which I think are not play-off quality are having to make too many quality stops, and not succeeding which spells out our lousy GAs to goals ratio and our loses. I agree with many, especially JP when he says that it starts with Defense. But I am less positive that Montoya/Poulin are either #1s on a play-off team next season. So I call for help in both the D and G., or we will be having the same conversation next season.
Keep your fingers crossed...
That DP finds enlightenment and retires (becasue no legit #1 can be signed with him wrapped in duct tape in a closet) or Poulin, Nilsson or Koskinen turn into uber-goalies.
The latter is more likely than the former for more than 40 million reasons.
Montoya is a legit goaltender, it seems, but he’ll need a strong backup (stronger than DP) to get through a full season. Think Smitty and Chico… Chico was actually the #1 until Smitty went balls to the wall in the 80 playoffs.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
But if I'm DP...
….why would I retire?
Big deal, so I can’t play any more. I’m not walking away from over $40 still coming to me. Nope, you want me gone you’re going to have to buy me out. Then instead of that laughing stock of a 15 year deal I signed you’re going to have a laughing stock buyout of over 15 years starting………….now!
by barry_hal_oliver_24 on Dec 27, 2011 10:36 AM EST up reply actions
Ridicule, Mockery and Eternal Infamy < $67.5 million.
by ChryWheatGod on Dec 27, 2011 11:08 AM EST up reply actions
I'm sorry...
…I meant 18 years of a buyout, not 15.
by barry_hal_oliver_24 on Dec 27, 2011 10:50 AM EST up reply actions
Something to consider
eliminating the 9 (!!!) empty netters and the goals from the shootout losses has the Isles at 100 goals. If they got Nabokovian goaltending out of DP over his six starts, they’re at about 94 Goals against…it’s about top half of the conference at 100. Eliminating DPs stats, the team is in the better part of the league in GA/Sv%. The ugly part is that goals for column, but I do believe that has to do with the defense and not being able to generate or sustain rushes and pressure.
I’m not sure if I have 100% faith in that duo either long term, but they still are less of the problem than other things.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
by Keith Quinn on Dec 27, 2011 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
Nine?
I count TWELVE.
Team GA: 111
minus Cubano (39) = 72
minus Dipitty Dawg (27) = 45
minus Nabokov (22) = 23
minus Nilsson Shmilsson (8) = 15
minus Poulin (3) = 12
Basically, pulling the goalie turns Isles’ opponents into last year’s Grabner-Nielsen shorthanded offense.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
Not time to panick.
I think it should be noted that the Isles just lost to the team with the second best record in hockey. Regrettable the Rangers are a good team. I’d like to follow up on a Fan Post I made the other day (26-32).
Look at the Rangers and you will see that the roster that played in last night’s game had NO players over 32 and only 4 forwards under 26. While the Isles had 7 forwards under 25 and 1 over 32. But what is very interesting is that the Rangers did not have one Defenseman over 27 and the Isles had 4. Plus the Rangers were without Staal (24), Sauer (24) and Eminger (28). Actually the Rangers do not have one defenseman over 28 on their roster and Biron is the only one on the team over 32.
The Rangers are good and young. Something I think the Isles may be in two or three years. The major difference is that the Rangers have been able to add their two best offensive players via Free agency, Gaborik (29) and Richards (31). Both still in their prime.
Regarding the Isles overall. First Garth Snow did not have a good summer of 2010. Basically, he should get a grade of F. For not bring in a top 4 Dman and only bringing in age (Pandolfo, Staois) and money for the cap (Rolston, Reasoner).
The Isles lack a second line for secondary scoring. The FnGO line would be a nice third line. Neilsen, while a good player is not a #2 center.
Hopefully, Snow can resign Jurcina, Neilsen and Parenteau for next year. Because the Isles need more 26-32 y/o and not less. But, remember contract negotiations are a two way street. Who knows what these players will be looking for (years/money) to resign.
Snow should start discussions to resign them as soon as possible. I believe he can do this after Jan. 1, 2012. He needs to determine if they can be resigned and then do it. If they can’t be then he should look to trade them.
by John from ATL on Dec 27, 2011 10:54 AM EST reply actions 4 recs
Resign them, fine.
But, here’s what I expect to happen next year:
Rolston, Pandalfo, Eaton, Staios, Mottau Nabakov and maybe Montoya will not be on this team. Right there that’s about a Cap hit of almost $16 million. Track record sees that they Isles are not going to go out and sign Parise or Suter or any high priced UFA next year.
So where do you get the players AND reach the Cap Floor??
Strome, de Haan, Cizikas, Kabanov, Poulin, Ness, and Donovan. Their Cap hit is about $7 million and change. Resign PAP, FN, Big Al and Juice and I could argue that the Cap hit equals about $11 million and change. Add another $1.5+ for Haley and Martin. If you want, throw some at Wishart as well.
With the $16 million coming off the Cap, the Islanders will replace that with those rookies I mentioned above plus the resigning of PAP, FN, Big Al and Juice. Give a Staios or Rolston a small incentive laden deal and there’s your cap floor.
So as you mentioned that the Isles had almost no one above 32, next year I think it will be more of the same.
by barry_hal_oliver_24 on Dec 27, 2011 11:07 AM EST up reply actions
Totally agree!
It might be time for a TEAM VP. I don’t think that Charles is engaged in the hockey operations the way he SHOULD BE. He has limited his knowledge to whatever his GM tells him, and dealing with areener issues.
I think Garth has a plan, and he has done a pretty good job getting there… but he doesn’t have the chops, nor the access to get this ship right.
If Wang could get somebody to oversee ALL HOCKEY OPERATIONS and take some responsibilities away from Snow, while keeping the plan in motion, they might be able to keep this thing from hitting another iceberg.
Possibly somebody like Pat Quinn of the Oilers. Wouldn’t it be funny if they could get Nolan back to head up scouting and Hockey Ops.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
The Rangers are a good team because of their coach......
Outside of Richards and Gaborik who do the Rangers have that scare you offensively? Look at the Rangers defense. Dan Girardi has been their anchor. They have Del Zotto and McDonough who are virtually 2nd year players. Woywitka and Eminger who are 3rd paring dmen at best are hurt. Marc Staal, their best Dman has been out all year. They are playing with Anton Stralman, Stu Bickel, and Tim Erixon (rookie) on defense. Of course there is Henrik Lundqvist, but Biron is also 7-1 on the season. Compare the Isles and Rangers on paper and there are a lot of players who can be interchangeable. Now how in the world can one team be 22-12 (OT loss counted) and the other be 11-23? I would point directly to the coach, systems and accountability.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
Why are the Rangers a good tem "because of their coach"?
They looked far shittier for years before this. Even with all their talent they missed the playoffs, or did nothing when they did get there. And they had the same friggin coach.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 12:08 PM EST up reply actions
Tortorella was hired mid season in 2009.....
what talented players are you referring to that the Rangers were stacked with that Tortorella couldnt get the team by the Washington Capitals who were one of the leagues top teams with arguably the leagues best player at the time. Scott Gomez and Chris Drury?
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 12:44 PM EST up reply actions
So with the Rangers their competition being good is somehow an excuse for failure in your opinion?
Interesting.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 12:50 PM EST up reply actions
excuse for what??
they were in the playoffs with mediocre teams. I dont think anyone was expecting them to be playing for the Stanley cup. So what failure do you speak of? Failure is not meeting expectations. If the expectations for those Ranger teams were to go much deeper in the playoffs then maybe you should shed some light on it for me….
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 1:35 PM EST up reply actions
The Rangers have been expected to be very good for years.
Look- you can imagine its all their coach and he deserves all the credit, but even the rangers fans stopping by know who to give the credit to. The Rangers success is not because their coach has a big mough, their success is because of someone whose name starts with Henrik and ends with Lundqvist.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 1:38 PM EST up reply actions
I dont disagree about the Lundqvist statement......
but I will say it one more time. Martin Biron is 7-1. I dont think its “all” the coach. The players have to buy in. Obviously they have, so it all works well. The Rangers have a clear identity to their team and you know what to expect from them every night. Can you answer any of those questions about the Islanders? What is Capuano trying to get this team to buy into? What kind of team are we? You can shake a magic 8 ball and get a better read on what to expect from this team on a nightly basis.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 1:42 PM EST up reply actions
Marty is a starter playing as a backup because there arent enough spots for goalies anymore.
Between the two of them, they have one of the two best goaltending tandems in the entire NHL (along with Boston).
You give the coach credit for having immense talent to work with, and blame when he doesnt? That just seems ridiculous to me. But hey, I remember people clammoring for Boston to dump their coach for a few years, too- but they didnt. And look where it got them- the Stanley Cup.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
I seem to remember that Tom Renney got much worse Ranger clubs into the playoffs
Even advanced a couple of times (thanks Atlanta!). Then he got scapewagoned.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
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Sure did.
And he sure was.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 1:51 PM EST up reply actions
How were his teams worse??
Jagr, Nylander, Straka, Shanny……even further your just stating what a good coach is capable of. The fact that the Rangers fired him means absolutely nothing to this argument
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 2:09 PM EST up reply actions
Holy crap are you looking to argue or what!
Are you REALLY trying to make the case that the rangers years ago, a patchwork of older overpaid FA, were as good of a team as they are now??? I find it unfathomable that anyone would believe that but whatever.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 2:12 PM EST up reply actions
People are replying to my comments so i reply back.....
Nobody is making valid points against what i am suggesting. Yea i guess thats exactly what im saying there. That patchwork of older overpaid FA put up a combined 311 points and 114 goals in a combined 305 games. So when you tell me that Tom Renney brought teams who were much worse further im telling you that you are wrong and proving it to you.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 2:18 PM EST up reply actions
You can keep dreaming up what I supposedly told you if you want.
But in doing so my points remain standing.
If you want to refute one of my points, please refer to it specifically.
Better yet, ask Rangers fans for their opinions, comparing the team they have right now to what they have had for a number of years prior. Go for it!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 2:21 PM EST up reply actions
What you supposedly told me....
is right in front of you in the comments. Im not sure where you are confused as to what exactly i am referring to based on your responses. I can care less about reminiscing about old Ranger teams. Unfortunately, i wasnt the one who brought it up. If it werent brought up in the first place i wouldnt have to explain that your assessment was incorrect.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 2:28 PM EST up reply actions
You need to look at names, friend.
You are telling me I said things I didnt frickin say.
“when you tell me that Tom Renney brought teams who were much worse further”
Yeah and regardless of whether I agree with that or now, where are the posts where I am allegedly the one telling you that- Imaginationland?
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
Is this not you agreeing below? Or did i see this in imaginationland?
I seem to remember that Tom Renney got much worse Ranger clubs into the playoffs
by mikb on Dec 27, 2011 10:46 AM PST up reply actions
Sure did.
And he sure was.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 10:51 AM PST up reply actions
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 2:33 PM EST up reply actions
I repeat:
regardless of whether I agree with that or now, where are the posts where I am allegedly the one telling you that- Imaginationland?
This is annoying. If you dont like something someone said (as ridiculous as that might be) try arguing with the one who said it.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 2:39 PM EST up reply actions
I just put it right in front of your face and you still deny it.....
priceless. Did you not say “Sure did” “And he sure was”?? Were you not referring to Tom Renney taking worse ranger teams further in the playoffs? Because if you answer yes then i dont see what you are arguing here
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 2:44 PM EST up reply actions
But no, youre not looking to argue. Of course not!
Rangers fans are telling you youre wrong, you still dont want to believe it.
You want to keep on dreaming that “The Rangers are a good team because of their coach……” when in REALITY they are a good team because they have good players who are playing well together. Thats the whole issue here.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 2:46 PM EST up reply actions
Wow, your unbelievable....
you must be one of those people who have trouble admitting when they are wrong. Im done with this conversation.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 2:50 PM EST up reply actions
Im not frickin "wrong"
I just quoted you- directly, mind you- not something someone ELSE said that you agreed with, I quoted YOU. And you have not convinced me- or anyone else I see around here- that Torts is the one who deserves all the credit for what the Rangers players are doing or that everything they are doing right now is because of him.
Seems to me that you are the one who cannot admit that what you were saying was a gross exaggeration. But, like I have told you numerous times here, believe whatever you want.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 3:01 PM EST up reply actions
what are you suggesting?
That a coach makes ALL the difference? Or that they can only help? Nobody’s saying they can’t help, just that replacing one with the other isn’t suddenly going to make a lottery team into a Cup contender. If the coach was the be-all end-all, then they wouldn’t be fired all the damned time.
The Rangers were an old slow team under Renney; he got blamed for that instead of Glen Sather (who built them) and was tossed overboard. (The media quotes then were that the Rangers had become stale and boring, IIRC. George Ays would know more on this count.) Their roster is more dynamic now. IOW Torts v. Renney probably is a wash.
Capuano isn’t going to make Mark Streit’s shoulder 100%; he’s not going to turn Mottau and Staios into Potvin and Orr; he can make perfect tactical decisions and still have them backfire, because NHL players are all fairly talented and even the NHL first-team will lose their share of battles against the rank and file. There’s no magic wand here. You can’t just point at a result and say with absolute certainty “If only X happened then Y would stop and we would be lavished with success!”
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
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by mikb on Dec 27, 2011 2:24 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
So well put.
Rec!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 2:27 PM EST up reply actions
Sorry now for the length
Eh..I’m not good with media quotes, I pay little attention to that stuff, let alone enough to remember quotes from 6 years ago.
You’re correct about the old slow thing though. That’s the biggest reason for the whole “W/L record with Avery in the lineup thing.” At the time, they injected a 25 year old Sean who had a lot of speed and energy on a team that had neither. It was the perfect injection not only to improve them, but to get the old guys motivated again.
It’s also why thy don’t miss Sean at all now. Hagelin brings all the speed and more hockey sense, Prust can handle all the shenanigans if need be (w/o causing his own), and they have plenty of (youthful) energy up and down the lineup.
As for the coaching (the whole point of this): Coaching is only as good it’s personnel. Constantly switching coaches doesn’t necessarily work. Look at ANA, look at WSH this year. ANA was a bad team with a good coach, now they’re a bad team with a different good coach. WSH was an underperforming team with a good coach, now they’re an underperforming team with a coach trying to instill a system he doesn’t have the personnel for.
Renney had a defensive minded system that was built on line matching (something he’s gotten away from in EDM), and had the personnel to take advantage of that. Now Tortorella is here, and it’s taken this long to flip the personnel (while maintaining the core guys) to fit what he wants.
Flipping the Islanders coach (again) won’t do a thing if they don’t bring someone whose mindset and system fits the current personnel. That said, Capuano doesn’t seem to be taking proper advantage of his current personnel. Reasoner, Bailey, ex-Comeau, Nino, Grabner…all seem like guys that are being misused, at least to someone like me who doesn’t watch much but reads a bunch of the comments here.
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by George E. Ays on Dec 27, 2011 2:40 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Pretty good observation...
When they promoted Cappy i did a fan post about this very subject, and why the isles would succeed under capuano.
I think this team has been shaped to be a physical team with a four forward approach. But you can only really see it by looking into the draft history.
Until 2011 their focus since 2008(year one of Snow Autonomy) was puck moving defensemen and bigger smooth skating forwards.
The big fail has been the inability to obtain, or retain large “defense first” defensemen. Something you can’t cultivate through 3 years of drafting.
Not only that, the smallish, puck movers have either come up lame, or have not progressed as planned… except for Hamonic, who is the biggest, puckhandling defenseman in their system. If they had a more balanced approach going into the 2008 draft, 2009 might have been even better… especially with the 2 goalies in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.
gordon’s system needed speed, and lateral quickness… this team had none of that, and they spent a #1 overall on a guy who was none of that. gordon needed 3 mark streits and 3 jack hillens… capuano wants 6 travis hamonics. Mayfield, Pedan and krichton are the correction in draft philosophy… and hopefully they will have guys like capuano and Chynoweth to shape their careers.
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by JPinVA on Dec 28, 2011 2:08 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It takes a long time to cultivate a defense through the draft. Even the young Rangers D, none of them were drafted after 2008, and that was Del Zotto, who has been a roller coaster for 3 years.
And that expands the problem with flipping coaches like that. You draft for that coach, and then you’re left with assets that don’t fit the next guy you bring in, so you have to trade those guys or risk stunting their development and killing their value, and then you’re in an endless cycle.
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by George E. Ays on Dec 28, 2011 9:22 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
No im not suggesting that....did i say that?
All i was proving was the difference between a well coached team and a poorly coached team. I feel the Rangers at this moment are a huge benefactor of their systems and coaching. Meaning they benefit greatly from it, I didnt say John Tortorella is the end all be all.
I also feel the Isles are having the huge problems they are having because of the coaching staff. We have no structure, identity, organization, accountability. We are not this bad of a hockey team. Problem is Cappy doesnt make perfect tactical decisions. He makes very poor ones. Hence, proving my point.
All the other crap regarding comparing Torts & Renney was strictly me responding to other people bringing it up.
So without putting words in my mouth, there you have my opinion. Now if you want to disprove me i may respond with an opinion so dont get mad.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 2:40 PM EST up reply actions
not trying to disprove so much as understand
From earlier comments I got a different impression from what you’re stating here. Now I get what you’re trying to say. I think I still disagree as far as Capuano is concerned but there it is, the guy’s only coached 100 NHL games so far. To me that’s not a lot of time to prove anything one way or another, not yet, and not with a nascent hockey team such as this.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
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not trying to disprove so much as understand
From earlier comments I got a different impression from what you’re stating here.
Youre not the only one.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 3:03 PM EST up reply actions
I can see from that one post......
that said, “the Rangers are a good team because of their coach” why someone may question my opinion, but i’ve made it clear all over this board about how i feel Tortorella has effected the Rangers. Never once have i said the he deserves all the credit and he is solely responsible for taking a bad team to first place. Never once have i even hinted that the rangers arent a good team to begin with. i’ve simply been replying to posts where people are putting words in my mouth.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 3:12 PM EST up reply actions
Im glad you see where this started
Thats what Ive been talking about.
If you actually DONT think that Torts is the one who deserves the credit for that teams success, then there goes our main point of disagreement. Poof, gone.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 3:16 PM EST up reply actions
these guys have got to start winning again soon
Look at us with the knives out.
Peace on the blog, goodwill to fans…
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
by mikb on Dec 27, 2011 3:18 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Sigh.
Would be nice, wouldnt it?
Id rather us all be cheering and having playoff and trophy talk.
We all would.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
When things are going bad we begin to take it out on each other.
Too bad it happens allot which doesn’t say much good about this team…
Cmon.....
Biron’s no flake, but we also had him. Never heard anyone singing his praises.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 2:03 PM EST up reply actions
I said he is a starter
And he is- he was one everywhere he played EXCEPT the Rangers. I didnt say he is equal to Lundqvist did I?
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 2:06 PM EST up reply actions
Well,
actually hes not and he hasnt been for the last 2 seasons or else he would be starting somewhere.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 2:08 PM EST up reply actions
He is in a great situation right now.
Believe whatever you want. You want to imagine that the goalie market did not drastically change over the last half decade and that guys who would be starters are not starting, go ahead. Doesnt make you right- the changes in the goalie market are real and have been widely discussed.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 2:10 PM EST up reply actions
2 seasons ago he signed a 2 year deal with the Rangers. How would he be starting somewhere else in that time?
There is concern he’ll take another run at a starting gig after this season (he’s a UFA), but there’s no guarantee he’ll get one, especially one with a cup contender.
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by George E. Ays on Dec 27, 2011 2:10 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
That's not exactly true...
When he was here he was stuck in the goalie triangle. I don’t think anybody blamed HIM for that.
He is definitely in a better situation across the river. For one thing he less goalie coaches.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
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Biron’s playing out of his mind hockey right now, but the only current playoff team he’s beaten is San Jose. Biron didn’t wake up and become a .933 sv% goalie. He’s being managed well, but he’ll still come back to earth at some point.
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by George E. Ays on Dec 27, 2011 2:04 PM EST up reply actions
They are playing him smartly.
The Rangers dont have to prove anything with him, they have their starter.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 2:07 PM EST up reply actions
Thats good coaching right there
The Isle handling of the goalies the has not been that good over the years…Not earlier this year either…It takes injuries for the Isles to settle down with a starter…
Come on
You dont think if the Islanders had a Lundqvist that they wouldnt simply p-lay him? Please.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 29, 2011 10:03 AM EST up reply actions
NOPE.
Without Lundqvist, they would absolutely positively NOT be where they are.
Look at how the Rangers do and see if it correlates with Gabbys scoring totals!
They did somewhat better last year when he had a relatively BAD season then they did the season before when Gaborik had a GOOD season!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 29, 2011 10:08 AM EST up reply actions
You need a balance of scoring, good defense, and goaltending,....
It isn’t all just the Queen alone…The Rags are winning as a team…I’m not underestimating what a great goalie will do but again, you need balance….So I cant agree with you that the sole reason the Rags are winning is because of the goalie…
Gabby was hurt and they didnt have Richards....
So Torts did not have a great team for some of his time here…Good coaching is very important…Cappy has been making rookie mistakes with the goalie pulls and he keeps making the same mistakes…That’s inanity and that’s on him and not the players…Sometimes u need a coaching change to wake everyone up as well…I wasn’t for firing Gordan but I am growing tired of Cappys “relaxed demeanor” and his bad moves…I would be all for a top flight hockey person as coach and the leader of this team….
The first two years of Tortorella, they were an average/ok team playing well because of Lundqvist.
Now they’re a good team playing great because of Lundqvist.
The actual turn around started years earlier then they revamped their scouting/personnel staff, putting Gordie Clark at the helm. Now the profits of that overhaul is starting to come through (about 5 years later), and there is more help on the way. Tortorella is the right fit for getting the youth in position to succeed though, even if some of his decisions are baffling (Really, Mike Rupp in the defensive zone late in the 3rd protecting a 2 goal lead? Really?)
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by George E. Ays on Dec 27, 2011 1:01 PM EST up reply actions
The first two years of Tortorella, they were an average/ok team playing well because of Lundqvist.
Now they’re a good team playing great because of Lundqvist.
Completely agree.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 1:24 PM EST up reply actions
So the teams rediculous scoring % and the fact that they have the leagues highest goal scorer doesn't have anything to do with it?
The defense playing well and the team playing hard every night has nothing to do with it? Then why weren’t they that great in recent years if all you need is a great goalie? The queen has been there for years. The answer is, balance…You can have the best goalie in the world but if your team cant score or play defense then that team will not be good…I dont see how anyone could argue with this truth…“There is no I in team”…That’s a cliche but true…
"There is no I in team"…That’s a cliche but true…
Nope, but there are a few in Henrik Lundqvist. :)
Hey, you can give the credit to anyone you want. The Rangers fans all know who their MVP is.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 29, 2011 11:20 PM EST up reply actions
Not a fan of Cappy, but do not hate him,
If you want a relaxed demeanor go to a spa, you have no business behind the bench of an NHL team. I too would like a more knowledgeable, experienced coach for this team. Cappy has refered to this team as fragile, imagine that, the HC’s observation is that the team is fragile.
We are all Islanders, even if we’re from Jersey!
by Russel Ginart on Dec 27, 2011 1:08 PM EST up reply actions
Just because he doesn't yell and scream and whine and bitch with/at the media doesn't mean he's that relaxed.
Maybe he notices the giggling that goes on when Tortorella goes on a post-game rant, because quite frankly it’s hysterical, and he doesn’t wanna be a part of that. And can you blame him? In all honesty, with the younger and less experienced players on the team, a relaxed demeanor is probably better. If we had someone like Torts screaming at Tavares when he fanned on a shot don’t you think it might shatter some confidence? Or how about Bailey: the kid has so little confidence as is, and Tortorella would rip him apart.
Now I know you weren’t calling for a guy like Torts, and maybe an experienced coach would help. But I can bet it’s the lack of maturity and talent on the team, and if we were still floundering with a Hitchcock or a Boudreau, people would see that. Because as you can see, Boudreau hasn’t done much to help Anaheim, and Hitchcock has had success because he, in my opinion, inherited a very talented team that needed a kick in the ass, and a coaching change was what it came down to. We need a little more time for our guys to develop.
I think a lot of people (myself included) looked at the Penguins and that when their best prospects were hitting the 20-22 age they took off; we expected our guys to do the same thing. Truth is, while I love Tavares and I do think that one day he will be in or near the same class as Crosby or Malkin, he’s only one guy that’s reached that age. They have two, world-class talents and a first overall goalie that hasn’t had more surgeries than Lieutenant Dan, and they have surrounded themselves with much better talent. I stated this before, I don’t blame Garth so much because there are so many outside factors like the arena and the reputation around the league. I know the Pens dealt with the same thing, but the ’05 draft lottery was called the Crosby sweepstakes; the league and the players knew what was coming. Then the arena issues were settled and more players began signing as the reputation grew a little better.
On a side note, ever start writing a comment that you think is gonna be a line or two and then it turns into a novel? This is one of those times.
by sayvillelax94 on Dec 27, 2011 11:51 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I like your point about this team and how it might be better off without a high strung coach...
But maybe there needs to be a happy medium here…Too many times do I hear the players and the coach say “we lost the game but we battled hard”…I feel they are accepting losing to easily except JT…
Who knows? Maybe it's just media talk
We have no idea what goes on when they’re behind closed doors. Maybe they do accept it, maybe they don’t. Maybe Capuano realizes the lack of talent he has to work with and the rest of the team realizes this too. This isn’t acceptable, but it makes sense.
Trust me, I can’t stand hearing “we lost the game but we battled hard” anymore.
And while that’s an attitude issue (something a coach is responsible for), I can’t help but think that the attitude won’t improve until the talent does, which will take time. And I think replacing the coach for the second season in a row wouldn’t really help to improve the attitude, you know?
by sayvillelax94 on Dec 28, 2011 3:11 PM EST up reply actions
I think bringing in an NHL coach who has experience and has had success would be a good move.
I like Cappy but its kind of like the blind leading the blind…I know that sounds harsh…But the fact of the matter is these kids never experienced success in the NHL and they are being lead by a coach who’s never experienced success in the NHL…An NHL coach does not pull goalies like he does…I hope he can get it together but if he keeps making the same dumb mistakes I’d say he needs to go…The definition of Insanity is “doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result”…Enough of the insanity, CAPPY!!!
I will agree
That without any improvement he might end up taking the fall. But I don’t think anything will happen until after the season is over.
by sayvillelax94 on Dec 29, 2011 11:20 AM EST up reply actions
somebody give this guy a call, we're gonna need to borrow that soon...
These comments crawl up from the depths of the deepest Chasm of Saar
by bob l on Dec 27, 2011 11:01 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Got questions?
NYIslanders NYIslanders
#Isles GM Garth Snow will answer your questions live on iTV with Chris King tomorrow at 1:30. Submit your Qs. nyisl.es/8b4uM
My question: WTF???
Lighthouse Hockey. Where Islanders fans come to panic with punctuation.
by DP'sknee(andhipandflubugandotherknee) on Dec 27, 2011 11:19 AM EST reply actions
I just died a little on the inside
NYIslanders @NYIslanders 17m
RT @stapenewsday: Rolston, Pandolfo, DiPietro all on Coliseum ice prior to #Isles practice.
11:41 AM – 27 Dec 11 via HootSuite · Details
NYIslanders @NYIslanders 17m
RT @stapenewsday: Staios also on ice for #Isles.
11:41 AM – 27 Dec 11 via HootSuite · Details
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
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El. Oh. El.
Haley, Wallace, Polulin go back to BPT.
Awesome.
by barry_hal_oliver_24 on Dec 27, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe not
I’m not sure they’re using all of the “healthy scratch” slots anyway. Do those guys have to be off IR to be practicing?
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
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by Keith Quinn on Dec 27, 2011 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
Oh, my bad.
I meant eventually those 3 will go back down once those guys come back. That’s my guess.
by barry_hal_oliver_24 on Dec 27, 2011 12:08 PM EST up reply actions
They were out before practice, not during.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 12:09 PM EST up reply actions
My reading comp sucks today
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
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by Keith Quinn on Dec 27, 2011 12:15 PM EST up reply actions
Damn
Arthur Staple @StapeNewsday 47s
Rolston, Pandolfo on for full practice. Staios giving it a shot too. DiPietro, Ullstrom, Montoya, Haley out.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
by Keith Quinn on Dec 27, 2011 12:18 PM EST up reply actions
How about that?
Its not that your reading comp is bad, after all- youre just psychic!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 12:19 PM EST up reply actions
Christmas leftovers
Taste worse coming back up.
Success was survival and, kid, it still is
by IslesFanInNJ on Dec 27, 2011 12:20 PM EST up reply actions
I liked this team a lot more last year
- No passengers with a senior discount.
- Players who almost cared too much (Z!)
- A sense of moving in the right direction
- A sense of moving fast
Now we have:
- Sluggishness
- A sense of going nowhere (and not particularly fast)
- The impression that the team is half as together and half as fast as it was a few months ago.
It is Diduck.
by Paumanok on Dec 27, 2011 1:24 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Rolston
When you can’t fill the void that Rolston leaves when he’s injured, that shows just how deep your team’s talent pool is.
They had it covered...
this is where the injuries in the AHL have hurt more than the ones in the NHL.
Ullstrom, Dibenedetto, Colliton and Rhett… those injuries are more costly than Rolston’s…
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
by JPinVA on Dec 27, 2011 1:48 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
break up the first line
I keep hearing how they mesh and play well, but they benefit from first line time, pp time, end of the game time, and Tavares. They have played well but as i said before PA and Moulson are career NHlers who would be on a third line for any other team, again, not putting them down, they play hard every night but Tavares needs someone getting him the puck not vice versa, and whens the last time anyone saw MM or PA go around a defender or 2 and make a flashy play. Again, not putting them down because they do have good numbers, but mainly from the reasons i stated above, time to give Okposo and possibly Grabner or maybe, maybe Bailey that 1st line time and see what they do, i know Bailey is playing good at center he might open things up for Tavares, and once again not bashing PA and MM and dont want to see them gone but this isnt working
by vegz on Dec 27, 2011 12:14 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Everyone will bash you for that comment....
but i completely agree as i stated a very similar post above
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 12:23 PM EST up reply actions
you mistake LHH for IPB.
We are usually pretty civil…No bashing and no need to even moderate…Ironic isn’t it?
by KO21 on Dec 28, 2011 2:11 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I am with ya...JT needs another top winger who can get him the puck and KO can be that guy...
KO has also been finishing lately so I’m happy to see him get back on the top line where he was before the injury…
New Lines
Ugh: Like 1st and 3rd though
Lines: Moulson-Tavares-Okposo; Rolston-Nielsen-Parenteau; Grabner-Bailey-Niederreiter, Pandolfo; Martin-Reasoner-Wallace
UVa Student. Twitter: @ericdavidmorris
How about moving Bailey up with Grabner and Okposo? Nielsen just isn’t getting it done so far this season thus far. I can’t justify breaking up PAP, Moulson and JT, they’re the only real line the Isles have.
by ChryWheatGod on Dec 27, 2011 12:45 PM EST up reply actions
agreed
Like the first line. Prefer Grabs-Bails-PAP as a two and Cap Mule-Nielsen-Nino as a third… or maybe even Martin-Nielsen-Nino. Let the fourth line be Rolston-Reasoner-Wallace, 8-10 min of banging and maybe some surprise offense against the other team’s fourth line.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
Grabner on 3rd line
clearly he is one of the players Capuano was referring to on going through the motions
he belongs on the 3rd line now
Martin belongs on the 2nd line with Bailey & Parenteau
Intriguing
I could live with that.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
I feel Grabner can play a 3rd line role.....
and you will get the same exact production out of him still. Most of his goals are of the breakaway variety. Last year if he didnt score on a breakaway it was a Moulson type goal right aroudn the crease. So it may benefit him from being on a line that would generally go to the net on a more consistent basis.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 1:52 PM EST up reply actions
Grabner
am starting to think Dale Tallon was right about this guy – maybe trade him for some D if we can
I know it must seem like I'm trolling you Cary, but I promise I'm not
However, you’re getting a little extreme. Trading Grabner because he’s slumping? That will bite us in the ass. We can’t just dump everybody because they’re not playing as we expect. In fact, we honestly should’ve known better than to expect the same production from him as he had last season. Teams were bound to figure out his speed and with a better move on the breakaway, his production was bound to slip. I’m at fault on this one too, though. Until thinking about it more in-depth, Grabner’s production dip baffled me as well.
But let’s also not forget that his production came in the second half of last season. Maybe he’s a second half player… which doesn’t really help if we fall out of contention in the first half, but when we make the playoffs again he could be deadly.
by sayvillelax94 on Dec 28, 2011 12:01 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Why not sit Grabs like they did KO to wake his ass up?
I do wish that Bailey was switched w Frans. I do like KO with JT
I said the same thing earlier
Before being reminded that he is coming off a groin injury. In all likelihood, he is hampered by that. That said, maybe a stint on the 3rd line reduces his minutes a bit so that he recovers faster (as long as he stays on PK1).
Success was survival and, kid, it still is
by IslesFanInNJ on Dec 28, 2011 2:25 PM EST up reply actions
I like the idea of Bailey moving with a better combo, but we are at the bottom of the league once more, they may not be the problem but they arent the solution, its time to start developing players with higher ceilings like Okposo, Bailey and Nino otherwise this team will continue to slowly go no where
Vegz agree here as well.....
Bailey and Okposo were highly touted by the Islanders coming into the league. This is why i dont understand them being given the backseat by new players coming in such as Parenteau, Rolston, Schremp, etc…. Okposo should have been groomed to play with Tavares from day one. He showed loads of talent and potential when he first came here. Why he was given a backseat to two journeyman AHL’ers is beyond me. I understand he got hurt and the success of the FNGO line at 1st, but why in the world these two were never given a true chance to experiment together on a line is just plain stupid if you ask me. Josh Bailey has been jerked around more than anyone by far. He was drafted to potentially be a number one point producing centerman and he has never been put in a situation where he could thrive in that role. Things arent going well right now so why not give these guys a chance to step up into more important roles. I know Okposo still has an important role but hes been relegated to 2nd line minutes 2nd line PP and isnt even used on the PK anymore.
by LaFontaine16 on Dec 27, 2011 1:59 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Oh no Rolston and Pandolfo are back? this team is doomed, whose time are they gonna take up, Wallace’s I am really starting to think Capuano might not be the right guy for the job unless his hands are tied
If Wallace sits because of Pandolfo...
It would be the same guy calling the shots that had Tambellini showing up in the locker room under Nolan. These Chowdah Heads have got to go.
Wallace has given them EXACTLY what they’ve asked for. The same goes for Ullstrom vs Rolston. I say you have to show some balls and waive both of them. Rolston can miss the net in Bridgeport just as easy as he does in Uniondale… and his cap hit will still count.
The same goes for Pandolfo.
The best bet is to sign McCabe for $5M so you don’t have to worry about the Rangers claiming Rolston just to F*** with our FLOOR WAX.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
Tim Wallace
Wallace has looked really good in BPT. I didn’t personally think he had the chops to be in the NHL, but on the Islanders… HE SHOULD HAVE A SPOT FOR THE REST OF THE YEAR.
Wallace is EXACTLY what they need in a bottom six forward. He skates his whole shift, he has teh gritz, and he has offensive upside. He’s Haley with out the pummace.
I consider him the replacement for Pandolfo, so I never want to see Pandolfo on the Islanders again. I’d prefer him over Rolston as well. Ullstrom and Wallace need to be on the ice as much as possible. Unfortunately Nino being on the NHL roster is going to make this very difficult.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
Wallace, Pandolfo
they are about the same – as are Frischmon, Colliton
none of these guys will change the fact that we are last in Goals Scored
all of them can play some D
same is true of Reasoner – Cizikas arguably as well, though I’d like to see him get some time this year even if only to get some NHL game experience in advance of next year
When you say...
the team needs to “compete” and you replace a guy like Wallace who would give his left nut to stay for a guy like Pandolfo who has played away his nuts with the Devils… well… you’re starting to lose credibility… and when YOU say that Pandolfo = Wallace… I’m not sure you have the capacity to factor in trajectory…
2012, Pandolf home with kids. Wallace a good NHL depth forward.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
Pandolfo or Wallace
neither will move us off the bottom in terms of total goals scored
they both play some D
what Pandolfo brings is the fact that we signed a UFA who came to camp – perhaps that commitment will help attract other FAs in future – especially on D, that could prove useful
Wallace is a useful part – not more so than Reese
he is the only viable option i can see because of there love affair with Reasoner who i am still waiting to provide that offense or SOMETHING that Konopka wasnt already given us, knowing Cappy he will sit Nino over him as well while we should be looking at Dibo or Cizakis to provide the spark Wallace has already provided and what we r missing with Ulstrom out, F**k Pandalfo, guy is useless
TRY REPLY----------------------^
You’re making valid points, but I have a feeling they are losing some context because you have not mastered the “reply” button.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
by JPinVA on Dec 27, 2011 2:05 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
True...
he needs some structure… maybe we need to bring back the CaryKu.
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
LOL!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 2:17 PM EST up reply actions
But should be a rite of passage...
for noobs.
If you wanna join LHH we’re gonna need:
A FIG
A Plus/Minus
A list of things that are wrong with the club
A list of positives to look forward to
A Song Parody
A CaryKu
A Rick Dipietro rant
A we need more enforcers rant
An “our coach sucks” rant
A Wang is an idiot rant
A FIRE GARTH SNOW rant
Pass this 20 question multiple choice…
And sign this… you will need to check you “crazy” at the door, btu when you log off you can have it back so you can post at NYIPB/
LighthouseHockey: We saw this coming!
@JPinVA
I am replying to JP (using the reply button)
You can see who Im talking to.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 2:08 PM EST up reply actions
sorry, just poppin in and out from work with some comments, as for the song parody, that could take awhile
LOL!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Dec 27, 2011 4:23 PM EST up reply actions
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1979-80
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May 24, 1980: Tonelli to Nystrom. At long last, the steady build of the New York Islanders from expansion doormat to surprise semifinalist to annual contender reaches the promised land: Buoyed by a late season trade for Butch Goring that gave the team the depth up the middle GM Bill Torrey had been seeking, the Islanders knock off the Philadelphia Flyers in six games.
The victory justified the faith in coach Al Arbour who guided them from their second season to their first Stanley Cup seven seasons later. The Islanders would not be the first expansion team to win the Stanley Cup, but they would be the only one capable of a dynasty.
1980-81
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May 21, 1981: This time it was much easier. After falling to "only" 91 points in the 1979-80 season, the Islanders returned to their division title tradition, piling up 110 points -- a whole 13 points over second-place Philadelphia.
Between the quarterfinals (where they beat the upstart Oilers in six games) and the finals, the Islanders reeled off eight consecutive wins -- with a four-game sweep of archrival Rangers in between. As they defeated the Minnesota North Stars in five games for their second Cup, their goal difference in the final was a combined +10.
1981-82
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May 16, 1982: Another year, another landslide title. The Islanders won the Patrick Division by a whopping 26 points over the second-place Rangers, and were seven points clear of their nearest competition for the President's Trophy, the still-not-quite-ripe Edmonton Oilers.
A first-round scare against the Pittsburgh Penguins turned in the Isles' favor thanks to John Tonelli's heroics, and a true dynasty was on its way: Past the Rangers in six games, then an eight-game sweep of the Quebec Nordiques and Vancouver Canucks to run away with the Stanley Cup.
1982-83
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May 17, 1983: Not so fast, whipper-snappers. The Edmonton Oilers' steadily rising challenge for league supremacy took them all the way to the finals for the first time, where the New York Islanders summarily dispatched them in a four-game sweep. For the Islanders, the Dynasty was secured. For the Oilers, it was a powerful lesson in where talent ends and the demands of playoff hockey begin.
Four years, four Cups, 16 consecutive playoff series wins (a record that would grow to 19 until the rematch with the Oilers the following year). Mike Bossy scored 60 goals yet again, and Wayne Gretzky became acquainted with Billy Smith's crease.
