Recap - Islanders 5 (EN), Capitals 3: A good night's shake
This is why single hockey games don't make sense, why it's sisyphean to make grand proclamations of certainty based on a few games, a few shifts, or a few lines: A team that had nine 5-on-5 goals in 10 games puts up four in one night (plus an empty-netter) against a 9-2 team that had conceded just 17 in that setting.
Despite a six-game winless streak, the Islanders had outchanced opponents in recent games, so the dramatic line shake-up Jack Capuano instituted may not have been necessary to tip the scales. But four goals later, it sure didn't hurt. In compiling an impressive come-from-behind 5-3 win, the Islanders outshot the Capitals 30-27 at even strength.
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The new combo of Frans Nielsen flanked by P.A. Parenteau and Brian Rolston led the way with three goals and nine shots. Matt Martin's go-ahead goal did not stand up as the winner, but it typified that to-the-net battle level that Islanders fans want to see from the rest of the forward corps.
Other Recaps: Post | Newsday | Japers' Rink | WaPo
Also: Tavares on getting to play with Grabner (posted before last night's game)
Game Highlights
Luck, you say?
Tonight the Islanders were hindered, then helped by hockey's bounces and flukes: Joel Ward's opening goal undermined an even start when it went in off Marty Reasoner's stick and up over Rick DiPietro. A joke of a five-minute boarding call on P.A. Parenteau ignited an exchange of penalties (even-up calls?) in a sequence that ended in an Alex Ovechkin blast from the blueline that found its way through Mark Eatons legs and clean past DiPietro.
That one brought down a burst of chants for Al Montoya, who hasn't played since the blowout in Tampa Bay but still retains the best stats of the three goalies thus far.
(By the way, the way Mark Streit, Nielsen, Milan Jurcina et al managed the puck on Ward's delayed penalty to eat away some of the Parenteau major was just nice, smart hockey.)
But for once, the second period swung the pendulum the other way, in no small thanks to the Islanders coming out like a two-goal deficit would not keep this scoring-deprived team down: In the opening minutes, Nielsen was allowed to waltz through the Capitals defense, get a shot from the slot that produced a fat rebound, and scoop said rebound by Tomas Vokoun on a low backhand.
At the other end of the second period, a Rolston slapshot actually hit the net -- and went in. Vokoun may have wanted both of those goals back, but he can take solace that he lacks DiPietro's fanbase.
It would've been too good to be true for Martin's goal to complete the comeback and hold up as the game-winner. Brooks Laich prevented that by placing a left wing-circle powerplay shot over DiPietro's shoulder (which came on the Caps' other powerplay, a head-scratching call on Steve Staios. Generally, the officials perplexed both teams equally on a night where they appeared to want to do just enough to make the game sheet look like they were indeed there.)
That only set the table for Parenteau's late heroics, and Tavares's late freebie to finish the Caps off.
Various Notes
- A second consecutive uneven game defensively from Travis Hamonic, who has done a bit too much playing the puck (and missing) instead of the body lately. His usual nice stuff on offense and moving the puck though.
- John Tavares tied ex-Cap Milan Jurcina for the team lead in shots on target; JT's fourth and final one was his easiest.
- Alex Ovechkin erased two minutes of the Parenteau major by retaliating well after the play to knock Parenteau down, which was either great frontier justice or straight-up foolishness depending on 1) your view of such things and 2) whether you think Roman Hamrlik, who played over 21 minutes, milked that sequence for all he could.
- It must be asked: Does Frans Nielsen just plain make all who accompany him better?
- ...and if so, yikes how much is he going to command as a pending UFA?
- DiPietro: The first high goal was a bad break off of Reasoner's stick. But the third one -- unless Brooks Laich had traffic (Hamonic was there) to shoot through, that looked like a specific decision to wait and shoot high, which could be exposing a flaw if DiPietro is consistently going down too early.
- Josh Bailey and Blake Comeau remain under the microscope, but it's true both have progressed in recent games. And what's this? Bailey got a point tonight. A point! (On a second assist, on Martin's goal.)
- Line matching: Speaking of Bailey, his and Reasoner's lines faced Alex Ovechkin most, but on the backline Hamonic and Andrew MacDonald drew the bulk of that assignment.
- Lines overall: Generally, the new lines provided a few different looks, but as Capuano would probably say they were all still playing the same general style and system he's asked them to play all season. No single-game pronouncements about brilliance or idiocy from this corner of the room.
- Craziest sight: Old man Rolston sucking from the (oxygen?) can on the bench after his goal.
- Matt Martin: His goal was not only nice work, but a nice reward for a player who has done everything asked this season, one who has looked alive in every single game. Earned a chant of his name from the crowd for a guy embracing the energy role.
- Fun Small-Sample Stat: Parenteau is now second on the team with 11 points (2 g, 9 a). Three of those points came when he was nowhere near "true first line" center John Tavares...
- ...more PAP: Seriously though, how great was Parenteau on that goal? He created the whole sequence by taking the puck 1-on-4 into the Caps zone during an Isles line change ... then distributed the puck to the safe place and stuck around in the right area when Milan Jurcina blasted Nielen's pass from the point. PAP-PAP, hooray.
- The Goalie-Go-Round: So it was no superb game from DiPietro, but he is the night's declared winner with 25 saves. Not that wins or losses have determined starts so far this season, but does this mean Capuano gives him a fourth straight start like he gave the others?
What They Said
Boudreau: "We had them ... but we let them get back in the game. . . . You let a team in, especially a team that’s been losing, and they feel it and you’re in trouble."
Vokoun: "The first two and the fourth one, you can’t win when your goalie gives up three bad goals."
Source: WaPo
Money Quote: Jack Capuano
"I don't think it's a relief for me. Just for the guys, because I know they've worked extremely hard over the last couple games and I know they haven't gotten the goals or the results that they wanted. For our coaching staff we're happy that we won the game, but for the guys it's really important."
Given the players had been doing a lot of things well before tonight, getting pucks to the net ... why change the lines up then? Probably because players are people, not robots. Humans with brains, rather than widgets to process
I'm not sure these are lines Capuano will want to stick with for long, but if the players overall are doing the assignments he's laid out for them -- regardless of line assignment -- then the mental/psychological relief may be worth the temporary disruption in everyone's routine.
Call back from the game preview:
Nielsen and Parenteau are two of the better puck managers on the team, so if you can't do good things with them, there's no hope.
Heh, I guess Rolston bought himself a bit of hope.
For all the happy talk though, this game turns either direction if not for Parenteau scoring a Martin-like goal with just 1:46 left in the game. That's how thin the margin is in most NHL games. Which is probably worth remembering as this 82-game journey marches onward.
Next Up: The Milbury Experience
Versus is trolling you, Islanders Country: Mike Milbury will be in the booth for Monday's game in Boston. They actually did advance PR about this move (which means my mentioning it achieves exactly what they're after).
Television and the lowest common denominator are seldom far apart.
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Comments
Another Stellar Recap Dom
I think the only thing that perhaps was more stellar was the game that Mark Eaton played tonight.
Mark Eaton played so well I thought. Blocking Shots….He was a plus-3 on the night. Deflections, outlet passes, smart pinches to creat offensive chances. When the coaches look at the game video I would bet they note him.
A GREAT GAME ALL AROUND FOR THE GUYS. They faced adversity (very real adversity) after that first period and i first really serious adversity of the season….the Isles came together a played a fantastic 2 periods when they really, really needed to tonight.
Another Loss and the strories just start to get mind-numbing once again.
I have a comment on ALEX OVECHKIN that I will put in a Fanshot sometime tomorrow.
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Twitter: @mikeryaninc
"Past performance Is Not A Guarantee For Future Results"
"Listening is a Skill" -Jack Capuano
by FB4Real on Nov 6, 2011 3:36 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
FOR A MINUTE THERE....
I thought Rolston was doing WHIPITS on the bench….LOL
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Twitter: @mikeryaninc
"Past performance Is Not A Guarantee For Future Results"
"Listening is a Skill" -Jack Capuano
by FB4Real on Nov 6, 2011 3:37 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I said the same thing.....
and then the 10 year old said “whats a whip it”. ummmmm nothing.
"If the bell needs to be answered, we've got the guys to answer it." "If they want to start something, that's fine."- Trevor Gillies
by JW1970 on Nov 6, 2011 8:26 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
hahaha!
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 10:37 AM EST up reply actions
Nothing to see here...
“Now go clean your room.”
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
I can admit when I'm wrong...
I have never been a fan of Parenteau. I would be the first person to point to his playing on the top line as the reason his stats were high. After last night’s game, I am willing to admit that I was wrong. Very wrong. Parenteau was our best player last night, on a night when many players played very well.
by Peter Karamazov on Nov 6, 2011 6:52 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Yes indeed
Other than Tavares, he’s been the best forward all year. At a minimum, he brings energy. Not surprised that line played well.
I've been a fan of PA all along but I would caution anyone from letting one game change their opinion if a player
by MatthewM11 on Nov 6, 2011 10:41 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Including myself
I have been banging the PAP drum on LHH since early last season. I just don’t think anyone should let one game change their opinion of a player, good or bad.
It'll be interesting to see what PAP puts up this year, especially if
he plays more on the 2nd or 3rd lines. Is he overly talented, no, but he always shows effort. What will people say if if he puts of 23/45/68. Agreed, he’s been our 2nd or third best forward this year. He plays smart, he plays tough with effort, and he’s been consistently good. He might also just be worth signing for 2 more years at 1.75mil/year. 28 isn’t old.
He puts up that stat line
and you’re not signing him for 1.75. Closer to 3 I would think if not more. Think similar to Moulson.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
I thought that might be a little low, but I don't think he'll get Moulson money....slightly less. I still think he could be signed for 2 years 4-4.5mil.
He’ll be a little older than Moulson when he signed I believe, and he’s not the goal scorer of Moulson. I’d say 2-2.5 mil/year could do it. I think he has a decent chance of putting up 65 pts though. He’s underrated here by many. Is he top line talent on a championship team, no, but is he perhaps a good 2/3rd line guy on a championship team…perhaps. He works hard and is still plays hungry and smart IMO.
Don't underestimate his talent
He’s not very fast, but he has IMO above average stick-handling and passing skills. I’ve seen him consistently get the puck from the neutral zone into the offensive zone and there is no doubt Tavares has bennefitted from his playmaking skills last year and so far this year. I think his skill-set meshes very well with Moulson and Tavares and much of their success has been their ability to maintain possession and cycle the puck in the offensive zone. It will be interesting to see how Grabner plays with JT and Moulson (so far I am encouraged) and also to see if Parenteau can continue to mesh with Rolston and Nielsen. My guess is that both lines will play well together and hopefully moving PA will continue to give us more secondary scoring apart from the 1st line.
PA-FN-Rolston
If that combo holds, my hope is they’re good enough to sort of drag Rolston along with him. Rolston’s “good” period last year was with two superior Devils linemates. It’s not ideal but if it allows them to field three or four competent lines…
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
And for those that complain about his turnovers, there is this
I’ve seen him consistently get the puck from the neutral zone into the offensive zone
He is one of the few guys on the team that CAN carry the puck well. I go with the assumption that he handles more than most and thus, turns it over the most. I suspect that pound for pound, it is actually LESS than many others.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
by Keith Quinn on Nov 6, 2011 2:20 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
He is one of the few guys on the team that CAN carry the puck well. I go with the assumption that he handles more than most and thus, turns it over the most. I suspect that pound for pound, it is actually LESS than many others.
I think youre right.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 3:26 PM EST up reply actions
Well said
I didn’t even realize he lead the team in turnovers, but it doesn’t at all shock me or change my opinion that he is one of the best forwards on the isles at getting the puck into the offensive zone.
Not very fast?
I thought speed was one of his best attributes. Not very quick or especially good at accelerating, but I think his top speed is better than most top-6 NHL forwards. We’re talking about PAP, right?
by North Dakota Red Eagle on Nov 6, 2011 6:27 PM EST up reply actions
Speed is very hard to guage by watching players on TV
I never thought he was very fast, but that could just be perception, and because he plays with MM and JT, neither of whom are particulary speedy skaters. Without watching him race other players I can’t know for sure. Either way, he’s not Michael Grabner or Taylor Hall. I always thought his puck-handling and passing were his best attributes and most important considering his linemates.
I'd say he's above average in foot speed, but not elite.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
I think NdRE makes a good point about PA's acceleration
Once he gets going I agree he is at least average. Speed IMO, with the exception of truly elite speed like Grabner, is less important offensively than is the ability to move the puck through traffic, which is why Tavares has been so good despite average at best speed. Hockey, especially North American Hockey, is a game played on a small surface against very big opponents. Not a lot of open ice. Speed is most beneficial in 4 on 4 play and also defensively, where fore and backchecking is easier with a fast skater. When it comes to scoring and setting up goals you don’t need Pavel Bure wheels to be an elite forward. It doesn’t hurt though.
Goaltending again
Your analysis of the goaltending last night is a bit tepid.
A great win, but another uneven performance in goal by DP. The timing of the goals he gives up ALWAYS seem to be potentially demoralizing. The Isles start the game well, but he gives up the first goal.
They claw their way back, take the lead, and he gives up a bad goal to allow the Caps to tie it at 3 (the second goal he gave up was worse).
I’m glad the game winning goal came with little time remaining.
One positive- usually he is always the second best goalie on the ice, but last night he was the best goalie on the ice. But barely.
The real travesty here is Montoya is on the bench yet again.
Still don’t get it.
We Won
and still people complain about DP.
I swear he could take this team on a 70 game win streak, not giving up a goal on the way, win the Stanley Cup in 16 games, win the Veznia, the conn smyth, rescue all four Islander HOF’ers from a burning fire AND be personally responsible for cursing the Rangers to go another 54 years and someone will STILL find something to complain about him.
"Failing upwards! How come I can’t ever seem to do that?" - AP77 on Strang's ESPN Job
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
by Mark D on Nov 6, 2011 7:22 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Why not?
Weak puck control on the rebound led to the first. Multiple heart attack excursions from the net. And the only tough shots he faced went in.
If he did all that no one would complain, but he could never do that because he sucks.
Tavares is Tavares.
Just tired of it is all
even if last night was a weaker showing then he’s had during the season, we still won.
Plus this week we’ve had people claim that DP was responsible for losses in games the offense did not get going at all. I’m not even a fan of DP and his drafting was one of the things that set me over the edge as an Islander fan during the Milbury years. But it’s getting to a point with the DP bashing that the guy can just do no right.
In a week or a month, it’s not going to matter if DP had a good or a bad showing, as long as we get the win. It’s sort of like Jets fans who freak out when Sanchez has a bad game but we still win. No one remembers bad games a month later, cause all that matters is stacking up the wins.
"Failing upwards! How come I can’t ever seem to do that?" - AP77 on Strang's ESPN Job
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
by Mark D on Nov 6, 2011 8:23 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I get that
I think you’re either tired of hearing people complain, or tired of having to watch him play, or both.
Unfortunately, I doubt there is an end in sight. If they all are getting a four game tryout he put himself comfortably in third last night, but I’m not sure what that will mean at the end of the day.
Tavares is Tavares.
disagree
Honest, smart fandom means not holding back from warranted criticism when the team wins. The same way we’ve been applauding what’s the team has been doing well in losses.
by DP'sknee(andhipandflubugandotherknee) on Nov 6, 2011 9:09 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
except
it seems no matter what happens, DP is always going to be the goat
"Failing upwards! How come I can’t ever seem to do that?" - AP77 on Strang's ESPN Job
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
by Mark D on Nov 6, 2011 9:22 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Couldn't Agree More
Let me first say that I am critical of DiPietro at times when it is warranted. To Mark’s Point, regardless of he wins or not, DP will always be the goat of the team. To be brutally honest, I don’t see why everyone is chanting for Montoya every game. DP has only let in around 2 goals a game with this one being the highest GA on our losing streak despite it being the best offense in the East. Give the guy a break, his play every night has at least kept the team in the game for the most part. Can’t win when you’re not scoring goals and that isn’t DP’s job.
You should've seen her face. It was the exact same look my father gave me when I told him I wanted to be a ventriloquist.
by mikefromVA on Nov 6, 2011 9:38 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I'd like to see Montoya like most others
bur RDP has been OK. People just need to let him be to see what we have with him. He’s going nowhere….THe goalies have all played well, and I would agree Rick looks to be the third best, but not by much. I get it, he’s the goat no matter what, but really, the guy has always acted like he cares….it’s not like he’s dogging it. For me, that’s one of the biggest things that makes me root for him. I want to see him succeed because I love the Isles and he’s always acted like he cares.
by NewIsles on Nov 6, 2011 12:12 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
But have you seen the postgame threads?
DP has been playing mostly up to par with not making any real costly errors and ist still being talked about like he’s letting in 3 soft goals a game and making us get blown out. It’s completely rediculous given the circumstances. Some people just hate the living crap out of DP for no good reason this year.
It’s like those drunk people you hear at the game saying DP sucks after every goal or applauding his every save sarcastically. It makes no sense unless you have context for it, AND THERE IS VERY LITTLE TO NO CONTEXT FOR IT RIGHT NOW.
To be completely honest, there are a lot more players who deserve the verbal beatings he is taking: Mottau, Rolston, Okposo, Bailey, Comeau-a bit, and even A-mac are playing worse then DP in their respective positions given their talents so far. DP isn’t even in the top 5 for LOGICAL SCAPEWAGONS this year. It’s frigging stupid crazy for him to be getting the negative attention around here he has so far.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
by OzzyFan on Nov 6, 2011 10:34 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
there are a lot more players who deserve the verbal beatings he is taking: Mottau, Rolston,
Rolston’s taking a beating too, but it’s probably deserved most of the time.
Mottau, I don’t think anyone’s said anything nicer then “He’s not Reese”
"Failing upwards! How come I can’t ever seem to do that?" - AP77 on Strang's ESPN Job
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
He made some tough saves on the night.
He was mostly good last night.
Hunter said he was just finishing his check.
by Turgeon1992 on Nov 6, 2011 10:33 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Playing the puck
Actually I think he showed good restraint last night…and that was a great pass for the gamesealer!
"I can't really hear what Jeremy (Roenick) says, because I've got my two Stanley Cup rings plugging my ears." - Patrick Roy
A review
Just for fun, lets review the situation the Isles were in last night:
The current losing streak had all the feel of last year’s season ending 20 game losing streak. Pundits, fans, and probably even players were saying, “uh oh, here we go again.”
Now they are playing the top flight Caps, at home, and they fight their way back to take a third period lead.
That lead demanded that their goaltender shut the door. Spectacular saves needed to be on the menu. So under 3 minutes later, what happens?
A soft goal is given up. The fact that it was a PP goal is not an excuse.
And that is the problem. It always seems that the bad goals he gives up come at the worst possible time.
I get your feeling about timing
I just don’t put much stock in the thought of goalies “always giving up goals at the worst possible time” and that general line of thought.
I thought the first goal against vs. the Sharks was awful and said so. The first goal last night had three influencing factors that I do not blame on the goalie, no matter what number he is wearing.
The PP goal I mentioned, I can’t tell how good or bad that was without another angle.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
Fair enough
But I disagree…I put MUCH stock in a goaltender’s ability to make the big save at the biggest times. Let’s face it, every NHL goaltender in any game will make some good saves and the occasional great save. DP is not any different…some good and some great…in just about every game.
In last night’s game, every Cap goal was bad, from this perspective. The first Cap goal was the first goal of the game. DP did not play it that badly, but it still was the first goal of the game, after the Isles had put pressure on the Caps.
The last Cap goal could have been a back breaker- it was soft, and at the worst possible time.
And the middle goal was a long shot that DP just muffed.
To just give DP any credit just because the Isles won is like putting stock in only the won-lost record of a starting pitcher.
But contrary to opinion here, I don’t hate the guy. I hope he does better. And next game he plays, if he does, I will say so. But I do hope Montoya gets the next shot.
But I will ask you a different question:
When was the last game that DP stole for the Isles? You know, when they were outplayed completely, out shot, and had most of the game played in their defensive zone, and DP still won? I can’t remember it, but I will take your word if you do.
Every good NHL goaltender needs to steal a couple of games for the team.
by JackandAce on Nov 6, 2011 5:57 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Let’s face it, every NHL goaltender in any game will make some good saves and the occasional great save. DP is not any different…some good and some great…in just about every game.
Someone needs to go to Columbus and remind Mason of that lol.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 6:10 PM EST up reply actions
When was the last game that DP stole for the Isles? You know, when they were outplayed completely, out shot, and had most of the game played in their defensive zone, and DP still won? I can’t remember it, but I will take your word if you do.
Every good NHL goaltender needs to steal a couple of games for the team.
The guy has only played a few games… as have the other two. None of them have done that so far this season, that doesnt mean any of them are doing poorly because they arent.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 6:14 PM EST up reply actions
montoya stole the win against the wild
He was solid during multiple pps, including a 5-on-3.
by DP'sknee(andhipandflubugandotherknee) on Nov 6, 2011 6:19 PM EST up reply actions
I do not think ANY goalie has stolen a game OR lost a game for this team so far this season.
But if you do, I would like you to work this through with me. Is it that easy to say that any game where a guy lets in fewer than 2 goals it must be that he “stole” it? That makes evaluation far easier I guess. So- by that exact same logic, letting in 4 or more goals automatically means that goalie personally lost the game for the team. The thing is, only Monty has done both those things… Rick and Nabokov have not.
So you tell me- which logic would you like to go with here? It doesnt really add up to promotet that kind of logic when it benefits the guy you seem to want to advocate. You cannot logically praise him for one but excuse the other and still be unbiased as far as Im concerned.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 6:44 PM EST up reply actions
No. My definition of "stealing a game"...
…is not based on goals against but on how the goalie played. The Isles could have easily lost the Wild game were it not for Montoya’s solid play. I thought Nabby played similarly against the Panthers in a losing effort. Florida completely dominated the Isles defense and Nabby singlehandedly kept them in the game until the very end (I realize this is unscientific but check out how many Nabby saves are included in the games highlights).
While Nabby and Montoya have both above average and shown flashes of brilliance, DP’s play has been average. Not horrible, but average.
by DP'sknee(andhipandflubugandotherknee) on Nov 6, 2011 7:20 PM EST up reply actions
I think they have all been in the average range, all doing their job. And I think all three of them have dealt with the team looking like shit in front of them at times, too… the team hasnt looked any better for one or two of them than they have for the other(s) as far as Ive seen, either. As far as the flashes of brilliance goes, I guess everyone has different definitions of brilliance. I think they have all made good saves at times. If any one of the three of them does have a truly brilliant game, Ill be happy to see it… but I just dont feel that I have seen it so far.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 7:37 PM EST up reply actions
As far as DP and Montoya
I am speaking about the last 2 years. I cannot remember one instance last year where DP stole a game for us…maybe I’m wrong, so let me know. But I do know there were a couple games last year that Montoya pulled the game out for the Isles.
Listen, I hope DP does better, and becomes number 1 for the team. I just think that playing Montoya gives us the past chance to win.
We will see.
As far as DP and Montoya
I am speaking about the last 2 years.
But how the heck can you even do that? Its impossible.
1- Montoya has not even played 1/2 a seasons worth of NHL games in his entire NHL career. Are you comparing his 4 starts this season plus his 20 something NHL games last season along with his time last season as an AHL backup? Come on. How is that going to be a fair comparison?
2- DiPietro has been injured- this is the first time he has gone into a season NOT rehabbing from surgery in half a decade. How is comparing him like that going to be a fair comparison?
There is simply no good way to compare what any of the Isles three goalies have “done in the last 2 seasons.” Thats wshy I advocate just looking at the NOW.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 10:19 PM EST up reply actions
Don't want to get embroiled in yet another DP thread, but I'll answer this
But I will ask you a different question: When was the last game that DP stole for the Isles?
Probably before the leg injuries piled up? But not sure how that relates to last night.
Again, I disagree with your take on the goals last night, but that doesn’t mean I don’t think DP still is probably 3rd best, is a massive health and performance worry, and has not been good since before his injuries. The organization has not exactly wiped the slate clean (they did keep three goalies after all) but they are giving him another chance to prove he’s healthy and able, so I’m just evaluating based on that, while keeping the history in mind. I thought my eval of last night’s goals was straight-forward and honest.
(I’m not a big DP fan, by the way. Nor am I a believer in the “win” column for goalies — “timely” saves or not.)
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
DiPietro WON the game
His pass to JT put the game out of reach. The Caps have scored an incredible amount of times with the goaltender pulled and another goaltedner would have let a goal in or at least not added to the offense (we make these types of declarative statements all off the time with no evidence). When it mattered MOST, DiPietro cleared the puck and got the team another goal to seal the game.
This sounds ridiculous doesn’t it? But if it is his fault the game was tied in the MOST important time of the game, wasn’t it the MORE importantER part of the game, that his puck handling clinched it?
Seems like Capuano has the goaltenders on a four game rotation, why the hate on DiPi when he was beaten by a tops shelf Ward shot, a shot by Ovechkin that is stoppable, but has beaten plenty of great golatenders over the years and a shot on a screen that also hit the top corner is beyond me. Montoya got beat over the glove unscreened from further out and not a peep. All three have played well.
by Hockey1919 on Nov 7, 2011 9:00 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah, I agree. It's getting a little pathetic around here with DP hate. He has done very little to nothing to warrant it with his play this year.
It’s completely ironic and rediculous.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
by OzzyFan on Nov 6, 2011 10:29 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I'm glad I was wrong
and I will continue to make wildly negative prognostications in hopes we keep winning.
Rolston certainly looked better, PAP looked the same, re: The Frans Effect. But I would also say Grabner looked much better (or made noticeable plays anyway), than he has for the past few games.
Matt Martin needs more minutes.
Tavares is Tavares.
by afrosupreme on Nov 6, 2011 7:53 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
I was genuinely surprised at how much he got done with the minutes he had.
But I was also wondering, is he this effective because he is not getting too many minutes? Maybe thats whats making him so hungry and effective.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 9:37 AM EST up reply actions
Without looking
Usually the difference in minutes between the lines isn’t that much, what really makes the difference in time on the PP. And Martin’s been getting some shots on the PP unit here and there.
"Failing upwards! How come I can’t ever seem to do that?" - AP77 on Strang's ESPN Job
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
There are people calling for Martin to get twice the minutes he is getting- I just wonder whether, if he DID get that that kind of ice time, whether he would just spread his effectiveness out over a larger amount of time.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 10:43 AM EST up reply actions
ouch, and if he’s averaging 9-10 minutes as is (once again I haven’t double checked, just going by last years 4th line minutes) 18-20 is near 1st/2nd line amount of minutes. That would be a bit much. I think he plays a high energy game, and if he played a lot of minutes it would show quickly.
"Failing upwards! How come I can’t ever seem to do that?" - AP77 on Strang's ESPN Job
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
Agreed
But if he gets into last year’s "Grabner range of 12-14 a night (with some of it being PP net presence), I don’t think it will kill him. 18-20, I would assume he’d be addicted to painkillers within three months.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
Something worth noting
Is it takes more energy to go out and hit everything in sight. Maybe that’s ultimately a desirable thing (less hitting, more focus on situational play), but giving him a ton more minutes would reduce his ability to make a ruckus or to make a ruckus and stay in the flow.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
Interesting question
I don’t think double the minutes would be smart, but probably more than Jay Pandolfo would be.
I actually wonder if he could take on a couple of shifts with the top line in Mouslon’s spot once in a while, getting in front of the net, and providing the allegedly lacking protection for JT as needed.
Tavares is Tavares.
Matt Martin got the lowest minutes at 9, and I'd like to see him get b/w 12-13/game.
He should be getting more time. His low minutes might have been a function of the lame ass 5 minute PAP major. What the heck are the refs looking at. No consistency. Okposo gets dumped, no call, RDP gets run over twice, no calls until it happens a third time, a puck is sent off and over the glass and they call a penalty, PAP nudges the guy and he gets a 5min major. WTF.
Garik, Garik, did someone say that Martin was a horrible 4th liner last year and wasn't being held back too much by his bad linemates?
What do you think of Martin now Garik? (I honestly would like to hear what you think of him so far this year).
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
Corsi Wise he was a horrible 4th liner. That aside, I at least always chalked it up to being a learning year. I think he’s better off now then having spent more time at the Bridge
"Failing upwards! How come I can’t ever seem to do that?" - AP77 on Strang's ESPN Job
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
Its not unusual for young players with fairly limited AHL/NHL ecperience to struggle defensivley
Major Junior hockey does not prepare most players for the defensive demands of the NHL. I think it takes some acclimation for forwards to be responsible defensivley. I would guess that process is accelerated in the NHL than in the AHL, as long as you are willing to accept the liability that player may pose. I hope Martin continues to make strides in this department , because with his hitting and offensive upside he would make a strong bottom six forward IMO.
Yeah, I think it was part of a "learning year"/"adjustment year" and a case of too many hiccups with bad linemates.
He is still really young too. If JT could jump 15-20pts in a year, you’d think Martin could go from OK to great 4th liner in a year’s timeframe (not that they are similar players, just saying).
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
Defense is always gonna seem to be the issue, but other then that.
I could definitely see him putting up 15goals/30pts on the 3rd line in the future. And if he’s used in a Holmstrom role offensively, why not 20goals a year possibly? He does get a lot of pucks on net.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
Don't underestimate players' abilities to go from poor to very good defensive players with good coaching and experience
Yeah, it's probably more of a learning what to do then having great natural tendencies for him.
I’m not sure he’ll ever be a takeaway monster, but I’m sure he “could” become an above average defensive forward if he was coached right.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
Matt Martin ...
is slowly but surely growing into his role as a foundation piece. Steadily rather than ‘slowly’ might even be a better word.
I’m surprised by all the negative feedback on Staios. He’s not real swift afoot and doesn’t bang like Scott Stevens but he looks like he’s playing pretty steady and smart defense to me. I must be watching a different game.
I saw a different side of Grabner last night. Rather than just waiting for a breakout and streaking in, he made some neat plays down low and into the slot. The guy is quick as well as fast and can pass the puck. Maybe it’s a positive by-product of the line changes.
by dose on Nov 6, 2011 8:14 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
I agree re: Grabner
Prior to last night I hadn’t been particulary impressed with his play so far, compared to his play in the second half of last year. Playing with Tavares and Moulson will require him to do things a little differently and I think this will be good for him. He was trying to do what worked for him last year before changing lines and the problem was that opponents knew what to expect and where ready for him.
When I saw the score was 3-3
My heart sank and I checked back a few minutes later expecting a 4-3 loss.
Imagine my surprise, and elation!
Hoping that Haley comes around more than once every 75 years.
Defensemen Grades
Kyle 0; Post 1.
I was a little drugged up last night (legally, I assure you), so if my assessments are a little off, that is my excuse.
Streit: B. About a normal game for Streit, which is a welcome thing.
3.153 (11 games played)
Staios: B-. Nice assist on Martin goal. I thought Staios looking especially slow this game had a lot to due with the speed of the Caps forwards.
2.309 (11)
Hamonic: B. Solid, but still not as physical as the first few games. He made a key Ovechkin block.
3.086 (11)
AMac: B-. Similar to Staios and Eaton (and probably Jurcina too), I think his apparent sluggishness had a lot to do with the big, speedy Caps forwards. Clearly this is not last year’s AMac, but some games he appears close.
2.764 (11)
Eaton: C+. Was caught in no-man’s land 3 or 4 times in the 1st period. (Wouldn’t blame him at all for the 1st goal, though.) Part of this was the forwards’ faults, and part of it was good low-to-high play by Caps, but not a good start for Eaton. Pretty good rest of the game, though. (It helps when Isles are controlling the play.)
2.400 (11)
Jurcina: B-. This is what is expected of Jurcina.
2.423 (4)
Not in action:
Mottau:
1.946 (7) (About a ‘C’ average.)
by North Dakota Red Eagle on Nov 6, 2011 8:45 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
A-mac's play still worries me. We are a month in and still he has some noticable issues.
Could it still be rust? Could it be his hip? Could it be an unsuccessful surgery? It’s weird, because A-mac has always been known for being a really heady player, but some of his decisions this year have been very mindboggling.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
Two contentions.
1. You know why Hamonic wasn’t as physical? He was on Ovechkin duty: He and AMac spent by far the most time (9 minutes) on the ice with Ovechkin (the other Defensemen didn’t play more than 4.2). Can’t get physical unless you’re careful there or AO goes off with no D men to counter him.
2. I actually thought AMac was fine yesterday…not really seeing the sluggishness and he made a few nice plays. He may be slightly slower (I’m not sure I can tell this anymore), but his Hockey IQ is making up for it.
Writer at Beyond the Box Score and The Hardball Times
Pitchf/x enthusiast.
http://twitter.com/#!/garik16
I thought AMac was fine too
Hamonic made a few Kane Goal-like maneuvers I didn’t like, but I’m pretty sure I’m being hard on him due to great expectations.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
I still don't like A-macs passing, he keeps throwing homeruns or making bad passes.
And he got pushed around, even into DP, a couple times yesterday. And the slow skating is still worrisome. I’m not saying he’s terrible, he’s definitely livable. Just not close to what he’s been the last year/2yrs.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
Hamonic vs Martinek
Hamonic wasn’t as physical? He was on Ovechkin duty
We’ve found Martinek’s replacement in that respect. I always thought Martinek played OVechkin well, and yet, he always racks up points against the Isles.
The most disappointing thing about last night
was that Blake Comeau couldnt bury that breakaway. Not that I was disappointed IN him. I was disappointed FOR him. Because if he fires that past Vokoun, that would’ve been the cherry on top of all of last nights good things. You know it just takes one to get Blake on one of his hot streaks.
author of "57 Easy Ways to Score More Than 2 Goals a Game"
by Chris McNally on Nov 6, 2011 10:05 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
No doubt
He looked driven and alive again. Loved him taking advantage of Vokoun’s DP moment with the puck, too. (Well I mean it led to a COZO, but still, it turned a near-icing into a near-scoring chance.)
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
by Dominik on Nov 6, 2011 1:43 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Can someone tell me what the exact lines were last night?
I was only able to catch the last half of the 3rd period.
You only figure 8 once.
Lines
Moulson-Tavares-Grabner (MM looked slow; JT-MG looks like they can be a good combo)
Rolston-Nielsen-PAP (outstanding nite)
Comeau-Reasoner-Okposo (KO still in a funk)
Pandolfo-Bailey-Martin (Matin is Isles’ David Clarkson)
1A, 1B, 4A, 4B
For me yesterdays game to me seems little like islanders has two first/second lines.
many hold Nielsen as a 3Th line center, well.
Let just say Bailey is more a 4’Th liner than a 3’Th liner, and Nielsen’s lines seem to work almost who ever on his lines.
I also think that we learned that Comeau and Okposo do currently not work any near the level that they was expected to grow to a par of years ago.
It also seems that PAP is not as bad a player as people here credit him for.
To me today it was Tavares line that look like Nielsen line the other days, like a line that almost connect. It seems like both Tavares and Nielsen currently have problem connect.
Moulson seem in a lot of game the week link on the Tavares line. Problem is Moulson is a goal score only, and when he does not score, he don’t do much else.
Rolston, I do not know how to evaluate him yet. He was where he should be in Saturdays game, but he is not the one creating the play.
So to replace him on Tavares line, for Grabner/PAP will not work, since Moulson is no to creative as well. Grabner and Moulson on Tavares line, really cut the work for Tavares. None of them are game controlling players.
That is my view of it.
PAP
“It also seems that PAP is not as bad as a player as people here credit him for”
I never understood this, and it peeves me that many fans are only just know coming around on this. We are talking about a player who has been one of our top three scorers since his first pro game with us, and isn’t costing us a lot of money. What more could he possibly have done to earn fan’s respect?
by MatthewM11 on Nov 7, 2011 12:24 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
KO didnt do much, again...
What happened to hs compete level? He signs a nice contract and hes not the same…Something is up with him. Could he be hurt?
It was good to see we have other lines who can contribute. This will help free up space for JT’s line.
Last night I saw some drive in him
and he did get off a nice shot that actually went on net (ok maybe a little sarcastic here) Theres two issues I have with KO right now. He seems to be shying away from all contact. He floats into the corners after the puck instead of going in with a full head of steam. And his decision making with the puck is awful. He consistently tries to stick handle around people, toe drag, pull pucks between his legs like hes Steve Nash. He needs to start trusting the guys hes on the ice with and pass to them. If he does ice will open up for him, easier shots will come, rebounds will find his stick. If not, hes heading right for a 2010-11 Josh Bailey regression.
Speaking of…Bailey was the only Islander forward not to attempt a shot last night. Still.
author of "57 Easy Ways to Score More Than 2 Goals a Game"
by Chris McNally on Nov 6, 2011 11:37 AM EST up reply actions
I agree, I don't think his problem is lack of effort
I think part of the problem is unrealistic offensive expectations from many fans. Without seeing the power-play time, even strength time, offensive zone starts and linemates he had his first two seasons, he will not be a 50+ point producer again. I would like to see more from him, but am not expecting 20 goals or 30 assists.
I disagree
I think even without such opportunities, he could be a 20/30/50+ guy. I agree, it’s NOT because of lack of effort. However, his effort is scattered IMO…he looks unsure of himself to me. Doesn’t know when to go, when not to go…leading to wasted effort and inefficiency.
Remember during the period where the teams were about to be cut for the olympics 2 yrs ago…OKie tried so much…almost too much at times too make that team? He struggled immensly over a long period of time.
I think he feels the weight of the team is on him. When he faces alot of pressure, he isnt good.
If he was a 50 point player with first line/first PP unit minutes
It might be a little optimistic IMO to think he could do the same with less, but its possible for him to devolop further as a player and make more use of his ice-time
I think he just needs to play like he did a few years ago. He "was" one of if not our best 2-way forward a couple years ago.
His defense was great and his offense was above average. He mostly creates for himself too, so it’s nor really weakness of linemates. Sure, he got more PP time in the past, but he still looks like he should be putting up ~40pts/yr w/2nd PP time duty. He is very strong and has the power/skating to be dominant offensively when he wants and be a great defensive forward. Lack of skills is never his problem. I know he likely won’t be an all-star offensively, but moderate 40pts+ production in his future repeatedly is definitely possible, and 20-25goals is definitely realistic if he plays his offensive game. 30 sounds high absolutely, but we have to remember his best career years were when he was 20/21, he had room for improvement and maturing then. I know a defensive role hurts him a little, but when he was on the top of his game in the past he’s been great and he’s been facing top 6 competition for years.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
He's getting bigger and stronger so he should be reaching towards his prime not regressing...
Think about it…Like you just said…He’s shying away from all contact. He isnt skating hard into the boards to get the puck. Maybe this is all to do with an injury we don’t know about. Maybe its his shoulder?Maybe it hurts to get hit?There has to be a reason for being afraid to get hit. He is bigger than he’s ever been. Imagine he brought the same intnesity he used to bring with his size and strength he has now….He would be a BIGGER BEAST than he was…If its not an injury then hes just plain playing like its pond hockey out there and he needs to sit…
The good; the bad and the going forward from here....
The Good:
Matt Martin:
He’s been one of the most consistent forwards so far; along with PAP, Nielsen and JT. He has earned more ice time but, as stated above maybe he’s playing so well because he’s gettng the right amount of ice time.
PAP:
I was wrong. After the first 40 to 50 games last year, I thought he was only a PP point player and benefited from time with JT. Since then he’s been gritty and consistent.
The Defense:
Streit, Staios and Jurcina have been good in every game they’ve played, some games more than others but still good. While Amac and Hamonic have not been great, they’ve been good and I think this is more our high expectations of them going into the season and Amac not being 100% healthy. Eaton has gotten better and this may be from playing with Jurcina and not Mottau. However, we could see some of Mottau with less time between games it may be a good idea to give some of the D a night off here and there.
The Bad:
Comeau; Bailey and Okposo: Still no offense coming from these three. It has been getting better but they need to score. Wait; maybe that should be the 3rd/4th line going forward.
DP:
Without a doubt his worst game so far. I don’t blame him on any of the goals he gave up last night, except maybe the last but, he got in the way of the defensemen a few times behind the night and had a few turnovers. His rebound control on the first goal was part of the problem.
The PP and breakout:
The team needs work on get it out of they’re end and up the ice. There may be too much space between the D and the forwards but, the D needs to do a better job of making out-let passes.
Going forward:
Nino should be back in a few games; so where does he fit in? If Pandolfo is the odd man out. Which line does Nino play with? How about this?
MM-JT-Nino
Grabs-Frans-PAP
Martin-Reasoner-Rols
Comeau-Bailey-OK (this could wake these guys up and its not that bad of a line.)
Who plays goal against Boston? Should Al get another shot? Is Nabakov healthy enough to go?
I actually really like a possible Comeau-Bailey-Okposo line.
I actually like all those lines.
re: PAP
I was definitely wrong on him earlier last year (first 10 to maybe 20 games, possibly). I was sure I was seeing a PP specialist who shied from contact. I don’t know if I just saw what his Smurf/AHL history told me I wanted to see, or if he adapted and evolved under Capuano or something, but since then I’ve just continued to appreciate his play.
Man, you just never know where useful pieces are going to come from.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
by Dominik on Nov 6, 2011 1:45 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Some thoughts on the goals.
The first Wash goal: hit a stick. That’s a tough shot to stop when it redirects off your own forward.
The second Wash goal: Ovechkin laser. That’s hard to stop as well. Ovechkin has an absolute cannon. I can’t fault DP for giving up that goal.
The third Wash goal: DP can’t go down right after following the puck. He has to be better there.
The first Isles goal: love the work Nielsen did to get that goal.
The second Isles goal: wow can Brian Rolston shoot the puck. Maybe if he keeps doing those things, he’ll be useful.
The third Isles goal: Martin is my new favorite. He works hard, he brings lots of energy, he hits like crazy and is the only Isle who consistently plants himself in front of the goalie. Good things happen in that area.
The fourth Isles goal: Loving PAP right now. He is absolutely underrated. He takes the puck in alone, he gets himself in good positions to make plays.
The fifth Isles goal: this is the one time where I liked DP playing the puck. Granted I would hate it if things turned out differently, but the risk worked this time.
Any non-goals: that drive in the first should have ended up in a goal, but good things happen when the point men can get the puck on net.
Comeau’s breakaway was unfortunate. He should have buried it, but Vokoun got the best of him. It happens.
Overall, I was happy with the game. Some missteps, but they were hungrier and better all around. Few games are going to be perfect, but as long as they stay hungry it will be okay.
Hunter said he was just finishing his check.
With the Comeau breakaway
He didnt have much time to tee it up. He was going so fast and because the puck was lobbed up ice it took time to settle it. I think he only had a chance to pick a low corner. If he had enough time to tee it up, he couldve roofed it.
Good analysis of all the goals. Pretty much summed up everything exactly how I saw it.
author of "57 Easy Ways to Score More Than 2 Goals a Game"
by Chris McNally on Nov 6, 2011 11:31 AM EST up reply actions
With the Comeau breakaway
He didnt have much time to tee it up. He was going so fast and because the puck was lobbed up ice it took time to settle it. I think he only had a chance to pick a low corner. If he had enough time to tee it up, he couldve roofed it.
Yup. Still great to see him get such a nice chance though- IMO that (and him playing a decent game) shows hope for him. :)
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 3:22 PM EST up reply actions
In case there was any doubt anymore, this game proves AMac-Hamonic is the #1 D Pairing.
While Ovechkin was on the ice, the D men on the ice were:
AMac: 9.2 minutes
Hamonic: 9 minutes
Streit: 3.8 minutes
Staios: 4.1 minutes
Jurcina: 2.8 minutes
Eaton: 2.7 minutes.
I’d say we really wanted one pairing out there to deal with the best player in the league.
Writer at Beyond the Box Score and The Hardball Times
Pitchf/x enthusiast.
http://twitter.com/#!/garik16
DP
I’ll admit I’ve been impressed so far, but the stupid things he does still aggrivate me. I was at the game and I yelled at least 10 times “What the fuck are you doing?!” He still plays the puck and still slides around the goalie area. But I will definitely admit that he goes into “ready position” more often, and is looking less lazy. So in a way, he’s a new player, but in a way, he isn’t.
It’s going to be a cruel and terrible irony if he gets his health and shot-stopping ability back but still continues to do the roaming things that drive everyone nuts.
Maybe it was JP who mentioned it, but even his assist on the game-icer was a risk-reward move that could have blown up in his face. Still want industrial straps to keep him tethered to the crease.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
Agree, Risky play
At the game, DP’s pass to Tavares looked sound and a great play. But when I saw the replay at home, you see that his pass to DP went right under Ovechkin’s stick (with an open net behind DP)!. Still a great play, but too risky with a 4-3 lead.
Yea
Incredibly risky, and he also held the puck for a beat, and it made me wonder if he was thinking of trying for a goal himself.
Tavares is Tavares.
by afrosupreme on Nov 6, 2011 2:04 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
No question he was thinking goal for himself first. lol
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
and yet on the previous play he started to move towards the puck and retreated.
He had a chance to race for the puck in the corner, he waited, then went back into the crease. The next play the puck was a couple of feet away and he hesitated to make sure it didn’t hit the Cap on the forecheck and made the play to JT.
He is high risk, high reward. This time it was a reward and he still gets the blame.He could win a game 1-0 in OT with the other team pulling their goaltender and scoring the winning goal into an empty net and I’m sure there would be comments like – “but we have better players in the shootout he shouldn’t have shot the puck the length of the ice to score”. I used to dislike the guy quite a bit, especially since he was drafted number 1 overall, big contract MASS cockiness about him and the idiot traded away Luongo for a bag of beans to make room for him, not I find myself rooting for him with all of the negativity.
Seems like if the Islanders would just lose with him in the net, some people would be more happy than having him in net for a win.
That pass to JT wasn't high risk at all. Trying to score a goal would have been high risk, but DP just chipped it toward the boards where no Caps were to JT for a good shot.
The only person close to the puck then was Ovechkin and his stick was on the total opposite side of RDP’s holding the puck and Rick got rid of it anyway when Ovy got near.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
Of course the industrial straps idea wouldn't have even worked on that play
…since he was right next to his post.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
even his assist on the game-icer was a risk-reward move that could have blown up in his face. Still want industrial straps to keep him tethered to the crease.
I looked at that move as him taking far LESS of a risk than I thought he might. I think Rick considered going straight up the middle to score the goal himself… a move which could very well have led to a turnover and given the Caps a chance to tie the game. Instead, he passed that opportunity up and passed it to JT. I Was glad to see him make a better choice. Nobody can tell me he didnt consider the riskier choice… I could smell it lol.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 3:03 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Definitely did
I said that above. But we’re now in lesser of two evils category here.
Tavares is Tavares.
But passing the puck up to JT was not an "evil" at all, it was a perfectly reasonable move.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 7, 2011 11:43 AM EST up reply actions
What do you think would have been the safer move then? Hold the puck?
Watch the replay, both d-men in the zone were within 3ft of him and skating towards him, he couldn’t pass to them. DP made the smartest move possible.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
by OzzyFan on Nov 7, 2011 1:50 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
As a rule, I think the goalie handling the puck is the last resort.
And when they take time to do it, they’re inviting disaster.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
Moulson?
For all the mostly deserved bashing KO has gotten, Moulson seems to be getting off lightly. Top line, 2 more points, 1 more shot.
Let’s come out skating Monday.
by 7:11_OT on Nov 6, 2011 11:17 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Moulson has proven he has the ability. KO has not.
Writer at Beyond the Box Score and The Hardball Times
Pitchf/x enthusiast.
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Still Moulson has not done well this sesson
He must improve, sooooon
He got a ton of playing time. And he scored less than 20 and had a shooting % he's never duplicated before or after.
It’s more than likely that season was a statistical fluke.
Writer at Beyond the Box Score and The Hardball Times
Pitchf/x enthusiast.
http://twitter.com/#!/garik16
I think you are really underrating pre-shoulder injury Okposo.
Was 08-09 a fluke too then when he was playing 18min/gm against top 6 competition again(like 09/10) and still put up great numbers? With Comrie/Bailey/Comeau as hit top linemates no less. I agree, somewhat his numbers were inflated by toi in 09/10, but the man still put up a lot of points, 2nd highest among all isles forwards in 09/10 and 2nd in PPG among forwards in 08/09. It’s not like he was feeding off any of the top scorers to rank his pts. He played with JT some in 09/10, but he still only played ~half his time with JT/MM and half his time with Bailey/Nielsen, it’s not like he’s playing with the Sedins full time (not saying that you said that).
Both against top 6 competition:
08/09: 65GP: 18goals/39pts 10.9 shooting%. Full season= 23goals/49pts
09/10: 80GP: 19goals/52pts 7.6 shooting%
I think it’s safe to say, even with 2nd unit PP time he should be putting up 20goals/40pts, possibly more. Even with a sub-par goalscorer shooting % he almost hit 20goals in 09/10. If he could maintain his sh% to around 9-10%, what he’s capable of, there’s no reason he shouldn’t be a 20goal/40pts forward, maybe even better. It’s just that he has to play his game and not the “soft”/“don’t get my hands dirty” okposo he’s been. The kid put up great things when he was 20/21, you know players progressively get better till ~mid-20’s unless they are elite talents. So you saying this is a bit mindpuzzling. 20goals/40pts should be the minimum expected from Okposo any way you look at it. Anything else is underperforming.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
Right I think 09/10 is a good baseline for his career #s.
I don’t think the 08/09 season’s numbers were anything but just a lucky fluke. Happens with shooting %.
Writer at Beyond the Box Score and The Hardball Times
Pitchf/x enthusiast.
http://twitter.com/#!/garik16
People just are so manic at times.
Gee, I’ll take a 20/35/55 year, which is basically what he did in 09/10. Even if he splits the difference between 7.6% and 10.9% S%, he could still get to a 24/36/60 year. You act like the guys is a schlub because “he’s never scores 20 goals”…..even though he did score 18 and 19 with no one around him at age of 20 and 21.. Yes, he got lots of ice time, but as Ozzyfan said, wasn’t like he was playing with Sedin.KO nbo doubt needs to get it together, but have a smidgeon of faith.
Even if he splits the difference between 7.6% and 10.9% S%, he could still get to a 24/36/60 year.
If he shot at 9%, he’d need about 265 shots to get to 24. He’s not likely to get that many without playing on the first line, without PP time, and most importantly, if he has shutdown defensive responsibilities like last year. Basically, he needs to average 3.25 shots per game.
In 08: 2.54 10.9%
’09: 3.11 7.6%
’10: 1.89 6.9%
’11: 2.0 0%…which if at this pace, he shoots at 10% , leaves him at 16.4 goals.
The problem becomes, why would you play KO a lot if you have better guys in the system who shoot 13-14% and manage to get off 4 shots per game? He may be destined for more of a defensive role given those shooting percentages.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
that may not make sense
first numbers are avg shots per game, next column is that season’s shooting percentage. Also notable, he would need about 3 goals over his next 8 shots to even be at 10% now…it’s doable of course, but he is already behind the 8 ball to get there.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
At least 250 players at 13.99 or more (some with more sample than others)
http://www.hockey-reference.com/leaders/shot_pct_career.html
I would expect the amount of persons on this list to celerate as the % decreased towards 13, and also, I would expect that others that may have been on the list for a while regressed as their careers got longer (toward their mid to late 30’s)
For example, in the last 3 years of his career, Mats Sundin dropped his % significantly with sh% under his career norms. http://www.hockey-reference.com/players/s/sundima01.html
As did Jarri Kurri http://www.hockey-reference.com/players/k/kurrija01.html
This is just using some greats as examples, but I’m sure this happens with even the “not so greats” which is particularly disturbing when you are talking about guys that shoot at 8% to begin with.
I believe BTN (now Arctic Ice Hockey) did a project where they looked at the peak years for goal scorers and how their shots for totals peak in what most people say are the “prime years” and that their shooting percentage stays relatively the same and then their shot totals and shooting percentages start to dip after those years. Can’t remember what it was called though (the article).
Really, 13-14 isn’t that high for a good player, it’s just a bit high to expect that it is done year in and year out.
NY Islanders, just one irrational free agent signing away from contention!
Website:Lighthouse HockeyTwitter: @KeithLHHockey
Interesting stuff, Keith.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 7, 2011 3:01 PM EST up reply actions
I hear you, but that's a bit rough. He has some proven ability. I still think he can be a 20/40/60 guy.
Last year he was on a 42 (11/31/42) pt pace. Wasn’t his shooting % 7.6% but 10.9% his 20 year old year? I agree he’s regressed some, but he’s proven ability, but can he put it together to prove consistency and become that 20/40/60 guy. I’m sure everyone was saying Moulson wasn’t much when he was 23, 24, 25 years old. Overall though, I like the ID of putting Comeau-Bailey-Okposo together. These three need to start putting it together.
OzzyFan ---nice to know we agree on Okposo. Even though I sound like the contrarian regarding your take on Bailey, I still largely agree with your Bailey assessment too.
Bailey is much more of an enigma. I would say one of Bailey, PAP or Como are gone next year.
I try and call it like it is. And honestly, Bailey has been the worst of the bunch. He had a good game against the Caps though, not that he was asked to do a lot but still.
PAP has been lights out and unless he’s traded or wants to test UFA waters, I see garth resigning him for at least 1yr. Comeau is RFA still? Worst comes to worst and Comeau doesn’t score(which I doubt, he’ll likely get his 20goals one way or another), he becomes a 4th liner I’d guess. I doubt Garth Bergenheim’s him/let’s him walk as a RFA. But with talent coming in next year. Who knows.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
Garth will need to go to 2 years to get PAP though. I'd say 2 years 2.2mil/year...if he continues.
Ozzyfantoo
lol, he toured this past year too. I have no idea when he's gonna have his last farewell tour, but as long as he can sing, I think he'll keep touring and possibly even making albums.
Even if he is in his early 60’s. I love pretty much all his music, from his sabbath days to his whole solo career. He knows how to make great heavy metal.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
In 1992 (I think) Ozzy went on his "No More Tours" Tour
I saw him at Jones Beach three years later on his tour for Ozzmisis. When he doesn’t tour, he drinks. So he keeps touring, or so the story I heard goes. I’m just glad he’s still doing what he does.
"He's depriving some small village of a pretty good idiot" - Mike Milbury on Ziggy Palffy's agent. On Twitter: @Dan_of_Science
by PGI on Nov 6, 2011 10:13 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
my memory is pretty good.
I saw Ozzy in late 80’s and then again on his first (of many) “no More Tours” Tour in ‘92. I’m glad he’s still touring too. Saw Rush last year for first time in 13 years and they were awesome. Prolly should revisit Oz too.
Yeah, I hear he can still perform a great concert.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
I thought he retired
And now everyone thinks he should be in the Hall of Fame or something.
We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog
The thing with DP.....
Every soft goal he gives up is going to be questioned because of the, “Is he afraid of getting injured again?” or, “he didn’t move well on that one.”, etc. Look, no question he is a competitor! BUT………..folks are just waiting for the other knee/hip/concussion to drop. It will take an entire season before he convinces fans he can be a consistent NHL 1/1A goalie again. I originally didn’t have an issue with his deal ( no, don’t laugh, honestly!) because he was improving and we would of had a legit Top 10 goalie locked up for a reasonable cost. It was obviously a crap shoot .
BTW, do I get a sympathy point for picking DP for an assist on last night’s FIG?
"Is that all you got, I'll take your best shot......Here comes the BOOM!"
by FireGarthSnow on Nov 6, 2011 2:13 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
You sir have a great outlook on the DP situation all around. Sounds like one of the most fairminded looks at DP here.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
Don't give me too much credit Ozzy.......
I still think he’s only there because his salary is needed to reach the floor, he’s basically un-tradeable because his contract follows him where he might go, and I have said in the past that they should medically retire him and cash in the insurance policy. But I do have the rare ability at times to put my bias aside and look at a situation realistically. You can count me as one of those who need the convincing. Pre-injury DP could have been one of the good ones. Damn that Skills Competition!
"Is that all you got, I'll take your best shot......Here comes the BOOM!"
by FireGarthSnow on Nov 6, 2011 8:03 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, it is what it is.
People act like he purposely gets himself injured and he demanded a 15yr contract. It’s crazy. He doesn’t deserve a ton of blame beyond the occassional questionable puckhandling. Last year was the 1st year he played a “full” season in almost half a decade. People always take the DP situation out of context. Unless he’s playing bad, which he hasn’t done this year yet, there is nothing to complain about.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
by OzzyFan on Nov 7, 2011 9:28 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Last year was the 1st year he may have played a full season- but he still didnt, thanks to Johnson.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 7, 2011 9:30 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, there is that and a knee swelling here and there.
What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?
I'd love to do so, FGS....
It was a rather bold prediction, after all. Unfortunately, he waited until the third period to look like the pre-injury Ricky.
Yet another Moulson brother-in-law.
by ICanSeeForIslesAndIsles on Nov 6, 2011 4:39 PM EST up reply actions
Very lucky
The first two Islander goals were horrible — Vokoun absolutely should have stopped them. Lucky to catch a break on those.
Nice work by Martin and PAP on the next two.
Inexcusably awful coaching from Crappy. Eaton/Jurcina demonstrated time and time again they did not belong out there against Ovi and yet there they were all night.
=d
Inexcusably awful coaching from Crappy. Eaton/Jurcina demonstrated time and time again they did not belong out there against Ovi and yet there they were all night.
Sarcasm font? :) Because there were no Isles Dmen who had LESS TOI with Ovie than those two.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 6:16 PM EST up reply actions
Would be interested to see those numbers if so. Admittedly I paid less attention to it in the 3rd, but I saw them out there several times in the first two periods against that line — and they got repeatedly undressed.
=d
garik posted the numbers earlier (by garik16 on Nov 6, 2011 10:54 AM EST)
While Ovechkin was on the ice, the D men on the ice were:
AMac: 9.2 minutes
Hamonic: 9 minutes
Streit: 3.8 minutes
Staios: 4.1 minutes
Jurcina: 2.8 minutes
Eaton: 2.7 minutes.
AMac and Hamonic were on the Ice with Ovie more than triple the time that those two were.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 6:47 PM EST up reply actions
Interesting. Only 2.7 mins? That doesn’t seem right at all. I might have to investigate if I feel less lazy.
=d
For the record I didnt confirm it myself, I just trusted garik on this one :)
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 6:55 PM EST up reply actions
I used the H2H charts generated by Time On Ice above.
Writer at Beyond the Box Score and The Hardball Times
Pitchf/x enthusiast.
http://twitter.com/#!/garik16
The H2H link
is in every plus/minus and recap post.
Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.
Early on
there were a couple of shifts which stood out because it seemed like it would be a thing (otherwise why do it in the first period), but they didn’t face off much after that.
Tavares is Tavares.
Which makes me think Cappy made a nice in-game adjustment.
Could he have been thinking Jucina’s familairity with Ovie would be to the defenders benefit?
by Hockey1919 on Nov 7, 2011 9:43 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It could also be that every Eaton shift seems like an eternity anyway….
=d
by AP77 on Nov 6, 2011 6:36 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
lol
I think this was one of his better games.
Maybe I just have lower expectations for him lol?
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 6:48 PM EST up reply actions
Kirill tearing up the Q
islesinfo Tom Mascioli
Kirill Kabanov with 4 pts today (2g, 2a) in Shawinigan’s 7-1 win vs. PEI. Named first star. He’s now 5-5-10 in 6 GP. #isles
by DP'sknee(andhipandflubugandotherknee) on Nov 6, 2011 7:33 PM EST reply actions
Oy. Meant to post this on the prospects thread.
by DP'sknee(andhipandflubugandotherknee) on Nov 6, 2011 7:39 PM EST up reply actions
Thats so nice to see you can post it all over the place as far as Im concerned. :)
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Nov 6, 2011 10:22 PM EST up reply actions

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