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Open Forum: Memories of the NHL Hockey Hall of Fame Class

Buncha old people.

For you younger fans out there, let me tell you one of the strange rites of passage in life is when players you remember as pimple-faced rookies start entering the Hockey Hall of Fame. With full heads of gray hair.

Since we have Islanders fans and LHH readers from all corners of the continent and globe, I thought I'd solicit your views and do something we don't often do here: Discuss the NHLers entering the Hockey Hall of Fame today.

Ed Belfour, Mark Howe, Doug Gilmour and Joe Nieuwendyk span the high-flying '80s/early '90s and the obstruction-weighted '90s. I'll start with my own associations with each, but I'd like to hear your stories in comments:

Star-divide

Ed Belfour

Makes me think of: "A billion dollars."

Generally: A very good goalie, master of the square, low-blocking butterfly. Cantankerous and unlikeable for opposing fans, with one gnarly mullet, he nonetheless earned everything he got.

He was part of some epic Blues-Blackhawks battled back in the day, and even today you'll occasionally hear a "Beelll-fooour" call in St. Louis just for old time's sake and because it just has a nice ring to it. (Incidentally, the brief stretch when he was a goalie consultant for the Blues was an awkward time for Blues fans.)

 

Mark Howe

Makes me think of: Flyers.

Generally: Impressive for a legend's son to be so good, in such an unassuming way. The stories of his switch from forward to defense remind me of that ideal hockey player: One who is simply good at hockey rather than possessing specialized skills conducive to one position only. For carrying the weight of Gordie on his shoulders, Mark Howe had one helluva career.

I haven't run across many Isles fans who hate Howe from those fantastic '80s battles -- there were other Flyers to draw rage -- but he always impressed me on their runs to the finals with the Oilers. I can't make a statistical case or elaborate analysis of whether Howe, who still saw spot duty at forward in the '80s, should be in the Hall. But for me it passes the gut test.

 

Joe Nieuwendyk

Makes me think of: 51 goals as a rookie. And again as a sophomore. (Technically he had a 9-game, 5-goal trial in his prenatal year, 1986-87).

Generally: Another great all-around player who did not require a lot of cajoling to get the defensive side of the game, Nieuwendyk's career spats are a perfect reflection of the transition from the '80s to the slogging mid-late '90s: His scoring went down as scoring went down leaguewide. 51-51-45-45 and then boom: Trap Country.

Impressively, he was still putting up 60-game, 20-goal seasons in his late 30s. Like so many, including all three of his HOF classmates, the end came when the injuries piled up and the body could no longer fight them off with youth.

Coda: Funny to think that he became a Star in exchange for Jarome Iginla. I remember that trade, how Iginla was a pup then, and now he's on the back nine of his own career.

Sometimes I think the Hall of Fame exists just to make everyone feel old.

 

Doug Gilmour

Makes me think of: Dreams shattered.

This is a tough one for me. Like so many kids, #9 was my favorite number. But for me it was because of Clark Gillies and Doug Gilmour -- two perfect blends of skill and toughness. Everything you desired of a hockey player. While Gillies was a fierce, imposing presence, Gilmour was a scrappy skillful dog who backed down from no man.

Unlike so many other Blues stars (see: Joey Mullen), Gilmour's exit from St. Louis came not because of money but because of the kind of scandal that the Post delightfully runs in giant, all-caps type: Something to do with a teen babysitter. In September 1988, the scandal broke and shocked a (relatively) small Midwestern city, the trade happened quickly ... and no criminal charges filed.

These situations always put fans in impossible positions: You do not know what (if anything) happened, you know that money can protect celebrities, and you know that same money makes them targets. Innocent until proven guilty meets the rights of the abused.

To this day I don't know what to think of it, but it was always sketchy, as the family allegedly tried to extort money from the Blues and Gilmour to remain quiet, and never contacted police. There was always a money element to it -- a $1 million civil suit which broke the story -- that made the allegations more suspicious than your typical athlete case. But who can ever know from the outside? Regardless, damage done. The next time he played in St. Louis, he heard chants of "Pervert!" from some sections of the crowd. I learned a powerful lesson about getting to attached to favorite players, about fans, about the ambiguity inherent in watching a sport where money, illusion, and opportunity for exploitation collide.

My two G's, Gillies and Gilmour defined #9 to me. Yet nobody thinks of Gilmour as #9 anymore. No one thinks of him as a Blue anymore. The rest of his career -- from a Cup with Calgary to a mid-season holdout on the Flames to his many heroics with the Leafs, to becoming a journeyman as his body and skills faded -- they are all just surreal postscripts to a jarring coming of age in my life as a fan: Ultimately, we know nothing.

But I know Gilmour is supposed to be #9. And they tell me he was a great player.

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Nov 2009 by Dominik - 4 comments

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Belfour

I always remember when my parents finally got around to getting me a mostly complete set of goalie gear, it was all Eddie The Eagle Belfour stuff. At the time I had no idea who it was, and I had to check online because I didn’t know Belfour’s nickname was The Eagle. I’m nearly certain my parents got them on discount from somewhere, cause this was before Staten Island had nationwide sports stores. Just a Modells and a few mom and pop places. Since he was a player from Chicago his pads wouldn’t have been nearly as popular and probably cheaper then the Richter or Soderstrom pads.

"Failing upwards! How come I can’t ever seem to do that?" - AP77 on Strang's ESPN Job
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.

by Mark D on Nov 14, 2011 3:20 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

Nothing against Howe

but I just don’t see him as HOF material…a very solid D man for a number of years, but not HOF-worthy. Also, didn’t Scott Stevens start out as a winger with the Caps before the move to D?

by 4PeatSake on Nov 14, 2011 3:49 PM EST reply actions  

The Eagle

Not only a great goalie, but successful and dependable into his professional dotage with the Leafs and Panthers. (Don’t let the extra forty pounds on him fool you.) One of the first NHL goalies (if not THE first) to wear #20 as an homage to Vladislav Tretiak… I believe it was because Tretiak did some work with the Blackhawks organization when he was a young keeper there.

Fun fact – Belfour was very briefly a San Jose Shark. It didn’t go well.

Mark Howe, I remember chiefly for not necessarily remembering him that much – which for a defenseman is high praise. He never got all his due while he was active for a couple of reasons: first, because he started off in that “other league,” the WHA; second, because he couldn’t crack through to win the Norris (though he was all-NHL first team three times). Look him up on hockey-reference: even discounting the insane scoring numbers from his WHA days, when he played a forward line alongside Mr. Hockey, he has some impressive statistical credentials. (He was +85 one year, holy schnieke.) Now he looks eerily like his father did in the 70’s.

Doug Gilmour, I don’t remember as much as a Blue, but more as a Leaf and even (for a time) a New Jersey Devil. Had two amazing years just before the ’95 season ushered in the dead puck era.

Ah, Joe Neiuwendyk… Always will be a Calgary Flame in my brain, though he was also a Brief Devil. (There isn’t enough room up there for too many roster updates.) There’s a clip that DGB ran once, in the wake of the Pacioretty-to-the-stanchion hit by Zdeno Chara, of an old Don Cherry’s Coach’s Corner, in which Neiuwendyk was similarly crushed as a rookie. (The crushee was a certain #32 of infamy around these parts.) A great player for a long time and it’s likely he could have scored more if he hadn’t spent so much time in the Admiral Ackbar Hockey League.

Fun (and pertinent) fact – he has exactly as many points as Mike Bossy, in 505 more games played.

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Nov 14, 2011 4:08 PM EST reply actions  

That trade to the Sharks was huge news at the time.

It was weird seeing Belfour in the jersey. I may be remembering incorrectly, but I believe there was talk at that time that he might have lost “it,” having been replaced by Jeff Hackett in Chicago. Then Belfour signed with Dallas and was almost unbeatable for three or four seasons.

I have fond memories of Neiuwendyk, Gilmour and Belfour. Howe not so much. But the other three were excellent, excellent players. For some reason, that ’89 Flames team is fascinating to me. ESPN Classic used to play their games all the time. Lot of real characters on that team, these two included.

"He's depriving some small village of a pretty good idiot" - Mike Milbury on Ziggy Palffy's agent. On Twitter: @Dan_of_Science

by PGI on Nov 14, 2011 5:19 PM EST up reply actions  

The '89 Flames was good fun

It helped me that they beat the Habs, of course.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Nov 14, 2011 5:27 PM EST up reply actions  

WHA years

Ken Hitchcock was on NHL Home Ice/whatever talking about Howe’s Houston WHA teams, how he used to watch them when they’d come to Edmonton because of the Howes, but found they played a great brand of hockey. No doubt the future Coach Hitchcock’s mind was already at work, but it was fun to hear him go.

Love that Niuewendyk-Bossy fact.

And Belfour as a Shark! Haha, that’s right, that didn’t go too well.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Nov 14, 2011 5:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Howe was a very good mobile defenseman, I was surprised he made the HOF though. Suffered one of the grimmest injuries ever. The bottom of the net used to curve together to form a razor sharp point in the middle. Howe slid into the net after a collision, and the net lifted up, came down and stabbed him, think it punctured his bowel, was touch and go for awhile. Gilmour, grit..and if you believed some of the stories about him…a little bit nuts..

by 7:11_OT on Nov 14, 2011 4:34 PM EST reply actions  

That Howe injury was gruesome

There used to be video of it back in the day, but I haven’t seen it. That’s probably for the best.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Nov 14, 2011 5:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Belfour

made the Blackhawks an illegal choice in NHL ‘94. Sure Roenick was a powerful hitting/scoring force, but Belfour was insanely hard to score on. If you were any good, you didn’t choose them, but you would certainly handicap a new player by giving them the Hawks.

You’re right, I’ll always think of Gilmour as a Leaf and as #93. And he was a player I loved to watch-had the talent, the drive, the sandpaper, everything really. And I recently mentioned that 93 series between the Leafs and Kings as being one of my all-time favorite playoff series. Gilmour was a beast that series, and playoffs in general. Really fun player to watch.

Tavares is Tavares.

by afrosupreme on Nov 14, 2011 5:51 PM EST reply actions  

Alas

Gilmour was a beast in the series before that one, too :(

That was a really, really crazy year for me as a hockey fan.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Nov 14, 2011 6:14 PM EST up reply actions  

This

Is what following a silly game is all about. Great story, skeeterman

by billymac23 on Nov 14, 2011 8:09 PM EST up reply actions  

Awesome story

thanks for sharing. I love this stuff, as BillyMac said, that’s what makes being a fan great.

Tavares is Tavares.

by afrosupreme on Nov 14, 2011 8:42 PM EST up reply actions  

thanks, skeeterman

I shouldn’t have been dusting the top of the bookcase before reading that.

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Nov 14, 2011 9:15 PM EST up reply actions  

This is so fantastic

Thanks for that.

Stuff like this is ultimately why this site is here.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Nov 15, 2011 12:33 PM EST up reply actions  

Damn it!

now i’m crying! lol

Back....
had to take a Campbell and wipe my Bettman.

by skeeterman on Nov 14, 2011 7:07 PM EST reply actions  

Gilmour

I really became a hardcore hockey fan (as opposed to just a good Isles fan) during the ‘92-’93 season and I became immediatly impressed with Gilmour. He seemed to possess everything a great hockey player should have as if he were made in a lab. I only knew him as a Leaf and as number 93 . I was aware of his Flames past but not his time with the Blues and I had never heard anything about the ‘babysitter’ incident mentioned above (kinda wish I still hadn’t). There are many players from the late 80’s and early 90’s that have played in the NHL that I have admired from different teams but only two that I frequently dreamed would have somehow wound up playing for the Isles…Rod Brind’Amour and Doug Gilmour (both mour’s and ex Blues (draft picks?) I’m just realizing)

by mdelbags on Nov 14, 2011 8:28 PM EST reply actions  

Yep, Brind'Amour was shipped for a late-career Sutter (Ron)

Ironically, one of the reasons was the coach (Brian Sutter) didn’t feel young Brind’Amour was playing intensely enough. Go figure, right?

I hate bringing up the babysitting thing because if there was nothing to it then it’s a shame that it follows someone all their life. (And on the other hand, if it’s the other way around…) Sucks. No way around those situations.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Nov 15, 2011 12:35 PM EST up reply actions  

Sadly, first thing that comes to mind for me when someone says "Mark Howe"...

Traded to Philly for Rat, Greg Adams (Huh?) and two go nowhere draft picks…then, to make the trade even worse, SAME DAY, Rat to the Oilers for Risto Siltanen and the rights to Brent Loney (What a prize

If you ever thought being an Isles fan was tough, let me assure you: Being a Whalers fan was absolutely excruciating.

Third worst trade in franchise history, the second worst being the MacLeish/Blake Wesley/Don Gillen (lasted 34 NHL games!) that sent the #4 pick in ‘82 to Philly, who used it to take Ron Sutter, where the Whale could have landed either Scott Stevens or Phil Housley with it and included the loss of the #47 pick in the ’84 draft…a pick that they could’ve used to take Patrick Roy. The same Patrick Roy who would end up stopping the Whalers in the Adams Division finals in ’86…

Joe Nieuwendyk: The guy who was taken with the pick in the 1985 draft right after the Whale took Kay Whitmore…yeah, you guys think Milbury made some bad picks? Emile Francis was an imbecile. The only reason the Isles got LaFontaine was because “The Cat” was too damn stupid to take him with the #2 pick in ’83.

Ed Belfour: The original NHL Hockey, by EA. A friend of mine always insisted on using the Pengos…I countered with the Blackhawks.

In the original NHL Hockey, a skilled player could waste an opponent using the Pens massive offense by learning how to effectively work the Chelios-Larmer- Roenick combo and letting the seriously broken “Brick Wall Belfour” matrix do it’s work. (No joke, the tables they used on that game were broken badly by certain players stats and that game was using stats from the 90-91 season…Belfour was a beast in that game.)

Doug Gilmour: Once described on ESPN as “The Hardest Working Man in Hockey”…and that was a pretty solid assessment.

John Tavares: Loyalty. Character. The power to put every sports writer in Toronto on anti-depressants just by signing a piece of paper.

by BrassBonanza10 on Nov 15, 2011 4:14 AM EST reply actions  

Yikes

Brutal. Thanks for the Whalers misery lesson. Those chains are always fascinating, if painful.

On Nieuwendyk: Apparently Fletcher/Calgary really wanted Whitmore!

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Nov 15, 2011 12:37 PM EST up reply actions  

They got him, eventually, didn't they?

Didn’t he go the other way when Hartford (by now, Carolina) obtained Trevor Kidd?

We may be in the box, but you get the penalty.
Lighthouse Hockey - a beacon of greatness on the rocky coast of sports blog mediocrity
Non-hockey scribblings at nightflyblog

by mikb on Nov 15, 2011 1:17 PM EST up reply actions  

Nice memory!

I’m pretty sure you’re 100% correct there. (And here I am not bothering to Wiki.)

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Nov 16, 2011 12:33 AM EST up reply actions  

Dom...I could have gone the rest of my life not ever knowing that.

Excuse now, I’m going out back to beat on my Pete Karmanos “voodoo doll” (more of a tackling dummy with a picture of his face stapled to it…) with a shovel.

Right after I put a few more airsoft rounds through my dartboard picture of Emile Francis…

grumblegrumblegrumble

John Tavares: Loyalty. Character. The power to put every sports writer in Toronto on anti-depressants just by signing a piece of paper.

by BrassBonanza10 on Nov 15, 2011 7:03 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm sorry

I think it was a TSN or CBC writer who recently relayed that tail. Calgary wanted one of the three goalies and had to “settle” for Nieuwendyk.

P.S. I’m really tired of spelling out “Niuewendyk.”

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Nov 16, 2011 12:34 AM EST up reply actions  

S'okay, I vented fairly well (then vented again after tonight's loss to the Smurfs) and have, for the most part, returned to normal.

John Tavares: Loyalty. Character. The power to put every sports writer in Toronto on anti-depressants just by signing a piece of paper.

by BrassBonanza10 on Nov 16, 2011 1:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Nieuwendyk

Whenever Nieuwendyk is mentioned somewhere, I feel obliged to chime in: I went to school with him! We were both at Cornell at the exact same time (freshmen in 1984-85; he left school after his junior year to do his hockey thing, so he didn’t make it into the class of ‘88 yearbook – if he had, he would have been on the same page as me). Anyway, our paths never crossed in college – he was a high-flying jock on campus, I was a skinny, anti-social physics major. I did see him play hockey, though, a bunch of times, for the Big Red. What I remember is that he was the team. He was a star as a freshman (he didn’t need a period of adjustment to the speed of the college game) and, along with Doug Dadswell (our goalie), carried the team on his back.
Those were the post-Islanders-dynasty days in the NHL, and when Nieuwendyk was drafted by Calgary (2nd round, 27th overall in ‘85) after his freshman year, I was a bit disappointed he didn’t end up on my Isles. After all, he was playing in the Islanders backyard, in upstate NY. But, Bill Torrey was busy drafting Brad Dalgarno and Derek King ahead of him in round one – it would have been too risky to draft a kid from the Ivies in the first round, I guess.
When Nieuwendyk entered the NHL in ‘87, he didn’t need a period of adjustment there, either, it turned out. He almost equalled Bossy’s record for goals by a rookie, and won the Calder.

by Gabor66 on Nov 15, 2011 4:52 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

Nice
he was a high-flying jock on campus, I was a skinny, anti-social physics major.

Haha, very good.

At the time, it was crazy to see a college kid burst on to the scene like that. That had to change some minds.

Lighthouse Hockey: A flute with no holes is not a flute. A Dane with no holes is Frans Nielsen.

by Dominik on Nov 15, 2011 12:39 PM EST up reply actions  

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1979-80


May 24, 1980: Tonelli to Nystrom. At long last, the steady build of the New York Islanders from expansion doormat to surprise semifinalist to annual contender reaches the promised land: Buoyed by a late season trade for Butch Goring that gave the team the depth up the middle GM Bill Torrey had been seeking, the Islanders knock off the Philadelphia Flyers in six games.

The victory justified the faith in coach Al Arbour who guided them from their second season to their first Stanley Cup seven seasons later. The Islanders would not be the first expansion team to win the Stanley Cup, but they would be the only one capable of a dynasty.

1980-81


May 21, 1981: This time it was much easier. After falling to "only" 91 points in the 1979-80 season, the Islanders returned to their division title tradition, piling up 110 points -- a whole 13 points over second-place Philadelphia.

Between the quarterfinals (where they beat the upstart Oilers in six games) and the finals, the Islanders reeled off eight consecutive wins -- with a four-game sweep of archrival Rangers in between. As they defeated the Minnesota North Stars in five games for their second Cup, their goal difference in the final was a combined +10.

1981-82


May 16, 1982: Another year, another landslide title. The Islanders won the Patrick Division by a whopping 26 points over the second-place Rangers, and were seven points clear of their nearest competition for the President's Trophy, the still-not-quite-ripe Edmonton Oilers.

A first-round scare against the Pittsburgh Penguins turned in the Isles' favor thanks to John Tonelli's heroics, and a true dynasty was on its way: Past the Rangers in six games, then an eight-game sweep of the Quebec Nordiques and Vancouver Canucks to run away with the Stanley Cup.

1982-83


May 17, 1983: Not so fast, whipper-snappers. The Edmonton Oilers' steadily rising challenge for league supremacy took them all the way to the finals for the first time, where the New York Islanders summarily dispatched them in a four-game sweep. For the Islanders, the Dynasty was secured. For the Oilers, it was a powerful lesson in where talent ends and the demands of playoff hockey begin.

Four years, four Cups, 16 consecutive playoff series wins (a record that would grow to 19 until the rematch with the Oilers the following year). Mike Bossy scored 60 goals yet again, and Wayne Gretzky became acquainted with Billy Smith's crease.


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