Bits: So it's Flyers-Blackhawks (Yay.); Absurd draft coverage
by Dominik on May 25, 2010 6:15 AM EDT
in Bits o' Islanders News
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PrintFirst, will you be watching the Stanley Cup final, which begins Saturday night? (I will, I always do, and it has the chance of being a decent series.) Second, who will you root for against? As a lifelong follower of the Isles and Blues, both finalists evils for me; they both have players I can't stand.
But a weird thing happened to me last night: I former Islander Arron Asham and former Blue saw Ian Laperriere high five, and I pictured them hoisting the Cup, and I smiled. Laperriere has a very brief Ranger stench (only 28 games though!), but I always enjoyed him and advocated the Islanders signing him last summer. (Wasn't happening, I knew. A guy puts his life on the line like Lappy does, he needs to make sure it's for a contender.) All apologies to Mr. Sopel, but no one on the Hawks grabs me that way. On the other hand ... Pronger ... and the Flyers. Ugh. That's a stench in itself.
How I yearn for two months ago, when the Islanders were beating the Flyers and their fans were ready to have them shot. Now they're in the finals. You Bible scholars can surely tell me how this is one of the signs of the apocalypse, no? Oh well, some links brought to you by a horseman or two. Hold your excitement, as the Tim Jackman report card will be up later.
- Wang cancels China trip [Us here folk | FanHouse | Point Blank | ESPN | AP | Some paper that charges]
- Funny: The Islanders have two fairly promising European goalie prospects, which is part of an NHL trend with various causes. Of course if you point out that trend, you will be featured in a Don Cherry rant on Xenophobe's Corner.
- The Times piece wondering why the Islanders Dynasty is overlooked. [NYT | BC Fanshot]
- Travis Hamonic sounded so thrilled by the Wheat Kings' comeback to make the Memorial Cup final, it stinks the way it ended. It's alright though: He's moving on to better things, I promise.
- File this under Draft Coverage of the Absurd: "With a solid group of prospects up front and some potential defensive studs in Calvin de Haan and Travis Hamonic coming up through the junior ranks, the Islanders could very well take another shot at securing a franchise goaltender [Jack Campbell]." Seriously? Pass the Dutchie, pal.
- On that note, the NHL Combine is underway, as this nhl.com blog will tell you. That means half-naked teenagers being examined by men in white coats. Answering odd questions.
- Ed Snider sees his Flyers as a "team of destiny." I see him as an owner who whined about the refs in 1980.
- Picture a hipster Canadian who claims to like hockey but doesn't like the U.S. South but thinks the U.S. is eating at fast food chains and stealing hockey. Or something. (Honestly, in good conscience I can't advice you to read the whole thing. It's about 5,000 words too long.)
- Picture a Canadian fan of the Stars pointing out how Austin, Texas, draws better than Hamilton, Ontario.
- Picture the endless AHL shuffle moving the Smurfs' affiliate out of Hartford to ... Rochester?
- Brian Burke has decent reasons to question why the World Championships are held in Olympic years.
- A great question: No matter how the next two weeks go, how will Lavi's team respond to him next winter?
Word of the Day: "Procedural requirements."
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It's really not fair...
My roomie has been an on and off Flyers fan, she started watching again 3 seasons ago when they made the run behind Biron to the Conference Finals. And she admitted the only reason she’s been able to watch and follow hockey again is because I can answer her questions. So in 3 seasons she’s seen them make the playoffs all three times, the conference finals twice, Stanley Cup finals and one first round outer. Meanwhile I’ve been following the Isles since 93 (okay, I might have missed a season or two during the Yashin years) and the highlight of that time (not counting 93) is a 7 game first round outer. Hockey Gods I shake my fist at you!
BTW: The Franchise goalie debate is absurd. If they are saying we have Harmonic and De Haan on D, isn’t that ignoring that we have Poulin and Kikkosen? But yea, no more first round goalies.
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
hey webby! do me a favor, remove your fanshot, you’re ruining BC’s chance to monopolize the entire fanshot section…
hey dom… when do you officially hand the reigns over?
who knew that when the court takes your license away, they ACTUALLY take you license away??? (now how am i supposed to provide proof of ID???)
lol, that is pretty funny.
Theres some teams that the fanshots barely last a day on the front (cough Jets and Mets) and then there’s ones where it never moves (cough From The Rink since Mirtle left)
I think ours moves at a pretty good clip, and they tend to be useful/informing and not “Haha this team sucks…”
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
and I just post stuff that I think everyone will be interested in
anyone else is free to do the same.
To be fair to Grapes,
he has lightened up and is actually saying loving things about Ovi and has praised Halak and Rask to the heavens. He just likes to promote Canadians, expecially from Ontario.
His act is tired.
To turn a benign article about goalie trends — one backed by indisputable numbers — into a rant that left-wing inferiority-complex pushers are trying to convince Canadian kids they’re no good … it’s pretty inexcusable. He should at least be required to read what he’s ranting about.
I know it’s just hockey, and he’s old, and lots love him, but having a clue only 50% of the time doesn’t do it for me, no matter how much of a living institution the guy is.
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One draft-related thought
If Chicago’s last two series are a portent of the future and Buff is dominant once again, Dylan McIlrath’s stock will probably go sky high. Teams are going to see the need to get a big superman defender who can kick Buff’s big butt.
Lavi
I am guessing that most people were sad to see him go. However how does a “master motivator” get fired for “losing a team”? Furthermore, talk about a dynasty…what is that all about?
As for the Austin area fans (the arena is actually in Cedar Park/Leander) they have been very supportive. They have been given a fantastic arena, an upgraded team (the Austin Ice Bats ((CHL)) played here which was entertaining as they used to have old Boston Bruin brethren running the show) and . However then they got rid of their old time hockey mentality and started downsizing (adding smaller “finesse” players) their team. Needless to say they had a loss in sales and there was word that the Stars were looking to put an AHL team near here. It is good to see that something can survive in a town where the University of Texas dictates what professional sports are allowed to play near their precious Longhorns.
Joe Thornton should be drug tested or checked to see if an imposter has taken over his jersey.
However how does a "master motivator" get fired for "losing a team"?
Like Mike Keenan (v. 1.0) light, perhaps? I was a Lavi fan, but there were certainly stories that made you wonder if he handled the room in the best way. Carolina is another curious case, though the owner’s involvement clouds that one.
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When do the players shut up and let the coach be the coach
How does one handle a non motivated Russian dating a supermodel? You know if they would have gotten rid of the right guy back then Lavi could have had a spectacular run in the Isles org. Instead they wasted a ton of $ and time and what did they learn? You spend big $ on character…enter DP. I know most people don’t appreciate Wang for his business manuvers but I can honestly say that I really do respect what he tried to do…he just got a little too crazy and with the wrong people. Which leads me to believe that if he ever picks another person to bless with a ridiculous contract they are going to have to have the personality of Mother Teresa and the physical composition of Wolverine.
Joe Thornton should be drug tested or checked to see if an imposter has taken over his jersey.
by metalcoconut on May 25, 2010 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions
If Wang had only fired Milbury. I would love to know what happened that Wang decided to give his complete trust to the maniac.
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
Force of personality?
I’ve always wondered that, too. I chalk it up to Wang not knowing the game, and Milbury being an engaging personality and an unconventional type. Wang probably saw some of himself in Milbury. “Hey, this guy does it his own way, no matter what other people say.”
Oh, and instead of saying, “No Charles, you don’t want to sign a hockey player with a mixed reputation to a 10-year deal,” Milbury just went along with it. A little yesmanship never hurts your job security.
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I like to rip Wang as much as the next guy but...
how obvious would it have been to anybody—especially a hockey neophyte like Wang—how incompetent Milbury was when Wang bought the team?
I just think there has to be one sane hockey person somewhere telling Wang that maybe keeping Milbury isn’t the best idea. If Bettman had to get involved in the Palffy trade to keep it from being too lopsided, he had to know Milbury was screwing up. To mess up a team (even if it’s the secondary team) in a major market isn’t good for the NHL. They can go without Florida, Tampa or Columbus but the Islanders being good only makes the league better as a whole.
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
They just didn’t want to pay Palffy’s contract. I would think Milbury would be doing all the legwork.
I’m also talking about the rumor that Bettman forced the Kings to give up either Jokinen or the First Rounder in the trade. I forget which one.
If Bettman was getting involved to that degree, he would have at the very least an inkling that Milbury was incompetent.
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
If we’re going to go that route, he should have resigned when he said the 00 team would make the playoffs “Or it’ll be my head”
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
Palffy
My read of that was the owner forced MM to trade him, and with only one bidder (NYR) the commish had to step into say, “No way we’re letting a distressed team trade its only star cross-town for pennies on the dollar. We need a second bidder to make it halfway passable.”
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I think you and BC misread what I was saying. Actually I had never heard before that Palffy was going to the Rangers. I’m just referring to the rumor that Bettman forced the Kings to include either the first rounder or Jokinen in the deal.
One thing I try not to bash Milbury on is the Palffy trade, it was the one trade he made that his hands were basically tied. There’s plenty of other insane deals in which there are no excuse for.
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
Ah, I gotcha
The whole scenario was so shady and painful. I’m gonna need a therapist.
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When do the players shut up and let the coach be the coach
I’m a believer in this line of thinking, but there does come a point where you have too much on your hands and the old “you can’t fire 20 players” thing kicks in. I’m not saying Laviolette should have been fired — it really pissed me off at the time, actually — just that Hahn reported on some major locker room issues with the coach that didn’t revolve around Yashin. I think had Milbury done the right roster pruning and the right talk with Laviollette, Lavi could have stayed on and been successful.
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Well I don’t remember any of the specifics of that locker room debacle but I really would have liked to see an interview with the Isles from his era after he won a cup shortly thereafter. By all means that entire thing should be pinned on Milbury. As Bill Cosby once said (albeit to his kids) I put you in this (locker room) and I can take you out.
Instead he decided to fire Lavi and kept the players that haunt us for a couple more years.
Joe Thornton should be drug tested or checked to see if an imposter has taken over his jersey.
by metalcoconut on May 25, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions
maybe the Isles should have kept Lavorlette around as coach
I know I mis-spelled it
by Rickfansince76 on May 25, 2010 10:10 AM EDT reply actions
I know I mis-spelled it
That’s why “Lavi” is a great shortcut!
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Hey now, the Prestigious Iserlohn Roosters just let Steve Stirling go! The guy hasn’t coached more then one season anywhere since the Isles fired him.
It’s amazing the one quality coach Milbury hired (Personally I liked Bowness, and they only hired Goring to bring in fans) in his whole tenure was fired with this infamous line
“We felt a change was necessary for this team to move to the next level and compete for a Stanley Cup. Just making the playoffs is not enough.”
Excuse me, I need to ram a few more pins into my Milbury VooDoo Doll.
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
save some pins for me
Good for Lavs and all, but… sigh. The team had to scrape itself into the playoffs on a Bettman point in shootouts, went down 3-0 (and then 3-0 in game seven) to the Bruins, and now they’re playing for Lord Stanley’s Latte Mug with their seventh-string keeper and Old-Ass Captain Elbows.
The funny thing is, I think we Isles fans were absolutely right to say that barely making the eighth seed and going home would short-circuit the rebuild. They most likely would have gone home. They would never have beaten Washington. I don’t say that because I’m being cynical, either, but because Montreal, for all their flaws, had one absolutely legit line in Gomez-Gionta-Cammalleri. (Cam did some amazing things in this playoff.) That line is better than anything the Isles could have run out. I have hopes for Tavares-Moulson-Okposo, but they are not yet realized.
Sadly, I love Lavs, but having him stick another Cup in the cupboard is a little much. And all this “karma for ’80” and team of destiny crap is a total load. The Isles earned that Cup and owe nobody for nothing, least of all Leon Steckel. Snider can stick it. Here’s your team of destiny, Philly.
Of course I'm an expert, I've seen Slap Shot eleven times!
I didn’t want to see the Isles make any trades to make the playoffs, but you can’t say that the Isles wouldn’t beat the Caps. I don’t have the season stats for the Caps Vs Isles, but the reality is all we would need is two things.
Shutdown Ovie (and a Horrible Rangers team managed that and got to a 3-1 Series Lead)
Rollie Getting Hot
We’ve seen how good Rollie can be when he gets hot. I just don’t think the level of Talent between the Isles/Flyers/Habs was that great.
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
Montreal, for all their flaws, had one absolutely legit line in Gomez-Gionta-Cammalleri. (Cam did some amazing things in this playoff.)
HOW DARE YOU SLIGHT DOMINIC MOORE AND TRAVIS MOEN!
Kidding, of course. I agree: Montreal captured lightning in a bottle with: Goaltending, insane Cami shooting, everyone buying in to the “block shots ’cause what else can we do?” theory, and luck. In seriousness, Moen and Moore were good for checkers, but they stumbled into some damn good fortune in both victorious series. It’s funny how now Habs watchers have a new evaluation of their team than they did down the stretch, when in reality they need major improvements if they hope to even repeat this modest success.
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LAVIOLETTE
I have asked this question before, but someone explain to me again WHY Laviolette was not good enough for the Islanders???!!! I can only imagine where this team would be now if they just stuck with him as coach. I cried when Carolina won their Cup, and I believe Carolina will also regret the day they fired Lavi.
The Daily News Article On Lavi’s firing. Although there’s nothing from his mouth, there’s plenty of hideous Milbury quotes.
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
Laviolette tends to wear down his players after a few seasons
and they stop responding to him.
Same thing happened in Carolina.
Laviolette is a good coach but not the kind you wanna keep on board for more than three seasons.
Fishsticks
That Hahn/Botte book “Fishsticks” archives some of the aftermath. I need to dig that up and add it to the discussion. Definitely no smoking gun (like I said above, the firing pissed me off) but some lingering issues in the locker room. As a GM though, MM should have found a better solution than firing his best coach.
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I saw that book while looking for some Fishstick Islanders stuff. I thought it was going to be about how Milbury took a bad team and just ran it into the ground. I can’t believe it’s subtitled the Fall and Rise.
I wish I had the contacts (I would love to interview Rick Bowness especially) and the ability to write more then 500-1000 words so I could do a book done right on Milbury’s Isles era.
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
to be fair to Hahn and Botta
…at the time, it seemed like a rise. First playoffs in ten years, making it three years in a row… This didn’t seem like a team about to unravel. I’m not even completely convinced Yashin was the big problem. He was obviously a talented player, he was just making too much money for what he produced. He got hurt for a while too.
In some ways (for me) 2003 had a 1994 feeling to it, where we limped along though we should have been as good as we had been, and then the Maloney-esque detonation: firing Lavs, the Janne Niinimaa thing, watching Asham and Scatchard crater and get dealt… and the drafts, my stars. No top-flight talent coming up, except possibly RDP and his styrofoam joints. The last impact guy who actually made an impact HERE was McCabe, however briefly. They dealt nearly everyone else before they broke out: Bertuzzi, Chara, Luongo; lesser lights like Connolly, Dumont, Brewer… it’s been a disaster. Neilsen, KO, Bails, Tavares, and such have got to hit. We’ve got to keep them or get a king’s ransom if we send them somewhere. Maybe you’ll be writing about the True Rise of the Abominable Snow-Men Years: the Return to Royal Blue.
Of course I'm an expert, I've seen Slap Shot eleven times!
In some ways (for me) 2003 had a 1994 feeling to it, where we limped along though we should have been as good as we had been, and then the Maloney-esque detonation: firing Lavs, the Janne Niinimaa thing, watching Asham and Scatchard crater and get dealt… and the drafts
God, that’s exactly what it felt like. A “not again!” feel.
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After watching a little more of Hamonic in this Memorial Cup
I am really much more impressed with this kid than I was earlier this season. OTOH I think folks slating him as a top two defensemen might be dissapointed. Those expectations are really unrealistic and too high for this kid. He’s really a second pairing Defensmen when he tops out.
I will say this though. He is a rare gem of a Defensemen. There is really no major weaknesses in his game. He’s not a guy that overly excels at anything outside of the rough stuff but he’s good in all areas of the game. I’d slate him as a reliable stay at home defensemen who can put up 25-30 points a season (most of em PP assists).
I will say this though, and this where I think he will be known as one of the more underappreciated Defensemen in the game. Having guys like Hamonic on your team is why forwards win Selke Trophies. As Hamonic levels outon the NHL level I would expect to see Neilsen and Bailey named as Selke finalists for many years to come.
Looking at it in terms of the draft
Which is closer: Petrov coming over here and being a top six or Hamonic being at least passable as a top pairing defender? Then you compare Nino and Connolly (if he is still on the board) with whatever defensemen are still available at #5 and you make your pick.
Back To The Finals
Hockey is great and unpredictable, no? I can’t believe I haven’t read anything [especially in these comments] about how the two teams that made it to the Finals were declared non-contenders by many at the trade deadline because they failed to “address” their goaltending “issues.”
These teams represent two great stories about GM’s believing in their goalies and being rewarded. Or maybe Snow was holding out for more than they were willing to pay and Philly & Chicago decided to roll the dice with who they had – despite serious reservations? Then again, I think the Flyers are on their 3rd goalie since the trade deadline anyway, so who knows?
I think I am rooting for Philly’s grit [in seven] over the Original Six siren song. And really, who wants irrefutable evidence that someone’s death was the best thing that ever happened to a hockey franchise and its fan base.
And really, who wants irrefutable evidence that someone’s death was the best thing that ever happened to a hockey franchise and its fan base.
Ha! Good point. That could lead to ugly things.
To the goalies, I bet Snow’s price was too high for either (Philly probably couldn’t make the cap work anyway), but I don’t blame him for not giving anyone away. Chicago, I suspected all along that they thought Niemi was a “good enough” backup plan. I don’t know about him because of his lack of “at bats,” but he at least appeared capable and, perhaps as importantly, didn’t have the “headcase” rap on him that Huet does. Their players can pay lip service to believing in Huet, but in Niemi’s case I actually believe it.
I’m actually pretty thrilled for Leighton. It made no sense to me that Maurice wouldn’t even use him in Carolina to the point they brought in Legace, who has his own cranial lapses.
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also height lapses
It always amused me that everyone hates on Chris Osgood, but Legace did doodly when he was there, and CuJo did doodly. Osgood wasn’t as good as Curtis Joseph was, prime to prime, but you know, he really wasn’t terrible either.
Of course I'm an expert, I've seen Slap Shot eleven times!
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Islanders Schedule
Next 5 Games
@
St. Louis
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Thu 02/16 | 8:00 PM EST |
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Carolina
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Sat 02/18 | 7:00 PM EST |
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Ottawa
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Mon 02/20 | 1:00 PM EST |
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@
Buffalo
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Tue 02/21 | 7:00 PM EST |
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New York Rangers
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Fri 02/24 | 7:00 PM EST |
Last 5 Games
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@
Winnipeg
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Tue 02/14 | W 3 - 1 |
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Florida
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Sun 02/12 | L 1 - 4 |
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Los Angeles
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Sat 02/11 | OT - W 2 - 1 |
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Montreal
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Thu 02/09 | L 2 - 4 |
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Philadelphia
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Tue 02/07 | SO - W 1 - 0 |
Atlantic Standings
| GP | W | L | OTL | PT | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
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New York Rangers
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55 | 37 | 13 | 5 | 79 |
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Philadelphia
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56 | 31 | 18 | 7 | 69 |
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Pittsburgh
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56 | 32 | 19 | 5 | 69 |
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New Jersey
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56 | 32 | 20 | 4 | 68 |
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New York Islanders
|
56 | 24 | 24 | 8 | 56 |
(updated 2.15.2012 at 8:59 AM EST)
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