On Tavares, Calder Expectations, and 3 Stars
I'm not really sure how you judge a Calder race when it involves rookie candidates from all three positions (forward, defense, goalie), but I do think it's unfair to judge two rookie forwards differently based on preseason hype and expectations. It strikes me that this thinking infected the view of Matt Duchene vs. John Tavares in the Calder discussions.
Tavares (82 GP, 24G, 30A, 54 PTS) has been punished for not being the dominant force some expect of a 1st overall pick (even though it should have been obvious last summer that he wasn't a "generational" star), while Duchene (81 GP, 24-31-55) has been hyped thanks to Colorado's wild ride into the playoffs. The same stuff that's been heaped in praise of Duchene (lots of minutes, first powerplay, got better as the season went on, rookie points lead) has been ignored about Tavares (all of the same, except for one point off the lead).
The two-way play argument is probably the one most worth inspecting, though it's the hardest to get a good read on. As billed at the draft, Duchene is likely better defensively, but Tavares appears to drive offensive play more.
So this bit in The Hockey News gave me pause:
"There is more of a correlation between the three stars of a game and individual awards than you think. Don't be surprised to see trophy finalists (Hart, Vezina, Calder, Norris) at the top of those lists." >>p.45, May 10 2010 issue
To be clear, I do not think trophies should be decided by something as variable as three-stars-of-the-game selections. But it is true: The top of the three-star lists are filled with the trophy finalists. Except, of course, with the rookies:
| 3-Star Selections (rookies) |
1st | 2nd | 3rd | Total | |
| 1 | J. Howard, Det | 7 | 7 | 4 | 18 |
| 2 | T. Rask, Bos | 6 | 2 | 5 | 13 |
| 3 | J. Tavares, NYI | 5 | 7 | 1 | 13 |
| 4 | J. Deslauriers, Edm | 6 | 3 | 3 | 12 |
| 5 | N. Bergfors, NJ/Atl | 6 | 1 | 4 | 11 |
| 6 | T. Myers, Buf | 4 | 3 | 4 | 11 |
| 7 | M. Duchene, Col | 4 | 1 | 6 | 11 |
| 8 | J. Gustavsson, Tor | 4 | 4 | 2 | 10 |
I don't think that tells us anything brilliant, but it is another hint at the fact Tavares had a weaker team around him -- which I would think should be a bigger consideration than whether he matched the hype foisted upon him by juniors-obsessed hockey media. Tavares' team had 16 fewer points, 9 fewer wins, yet Tavares "starred" in a higher percentage of his team's successes. (Craig Anderson received 27 3-star nods, while Dwayne Roloson received 27 sharing time with Martin Biron and even Rick DiPietro.)
People talk about the rookie scoring race as a big deal, yet Duchene won that by one assist. His coach talked about Duchene being on the first powerplay unit all year long, but of course Tavares was too -- with less talent around him. Puck Daddy's Greg Wyshynski even said, "No John Tavares on our ballot. Thought he played good, but not great, and not up to our expectations" -- which is striking to me, since they were both neck-and-neck at the draft last summer, and many expect(ed) Duchene to be the more complete player anyway. Wysh actually put James van Riemsdyk on his ballot over Tavares. (The first sign of his pending conversion from Devils to Flyers faith, perhaps?)
And why the higher expectations, anyway? With rare "generational" exceptions, the #1 overall pick usually doesn't win the Calder anyway. It's usually someone joining a bad team. Unless the guy is truly amazing, it's silly to expect an 18-year-old to have that big of an impact on a weak team.
Tavares immediately became the leading scorer on a team that finished in 30th place the season before. Duchene became the third-leading scorer -- fellow center Paul Stastny had 24 more points -- on a team that made the playoffs. Duchene figured in 22.5% of Colorado's goals (244); Tavares figured in 24.3% of the Islanders' goals (222). Tavares had no Stastny to shelter his baptism.
* * *
Which is all much ado about nothing, of course: As a fan, I subscribe to the Earl Sleek theory of individual hardware: No point hoping your guy wins the Calder and meets his rookie bonuses -- it will only inflate the asking price on his second contract. So never any worries for me there.
I didn't really expect Tavares to win the Calder -- his hot start surprised me -- and in any case his long mid-season slump would have kept me from voting for him over Tyler Myers or the goalies. Goalies are such a huge part of the game by the nature of the position, I don't like them as candidates for the Hart unless they've done something truly Hasek-like. For Calder, I'm a little more open, and Duchesne's and Tavares' hardly historic seasons probably would leave room for Jimmy Howard or Tuukka Rask on my ballot behind Tyler Myers anyway.
But when the rookie years of Tavares and Duchene are remembered, a little context may be in order.
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I was always pissed when people were writing off JT in the Calder race. It’s almost as though he was punished because Moulson came out of nowhere and had a good season. Throw in the large amount of crossbars hit and near misses for JT, and he should have been in the Calder race.
BTW: Dom, if you remember that post that listed the worst players of the season, and we had Thompson (although he was with TB), Witt and someone else on the list. In the comments someone asked who was the most averagely average player for the season and by the numbers it was van Riemsdyk..
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
van Riemsdyk?
That is shocking. I guess I did not pay much attention to the rookie race. Although it is a nice trophy to place on your mantle the overall goal is to improve a team rather than the individual effort. I think that has been Washington’s problem and this year Montreal got to show Washington and Pitt why a team beats a group of individuals. Well that and hot goaltender.
The Moulson observation was something in the back of my mind as well. It kind of felt like most of the media could only give the Isles credit for one thing they did right and by the halfway point of the season they focused on Coulson rather than Tavares. That is probably better for Tavares. Let the media hound Duchene next year. It could give Tavares a little more time away from the media and more time on the game. In the end I bet he is better for it.
Joe Thornton should be drug tested or checked to see if an imposter has taken over his jersey.
by metalcoconut on May 20, 2010 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions
For the Curious...
I Was talking about This Article
and in the comments
Beats me… The NHL’s Most Remarkably Unremarkable, Average Performers???
By the way… That honor goes to James VanRiemsdyk in Philadelphia. His net impact (relative to the rest of the Flyers) is +0.01 goals.
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
I know people here are saying Tavares should have gotten the finalist nod over Duchene but
I’m sick of this Howard being a finalist. New rule, you can’t win the calder if your older than the 4 previous winners of the award. I’m not saying he didn’t play great but he is 6 years or more older than Tavares, Meyers, or Duchene. Also he played in 195 AHL or NHL games over his carrer before this year and if he played one more game over the past 3 years in the NHL he wouldn’t be a rookie. Pekka Rinne is similar in age and has only 11 more pro games played than Howard. We don’t see him being nominated for rookie of the year.
Goalies are different
they usually take longer to mature. The fact that Rinne matured quicker shouldn’t be held against Howard.
I’m particularly suspicious of Howard’s long initiation process and the strong team in front of him. But on the topic of goalies and their long development, you have me convinced … they should probably be cut more slack.
Ironically, Steve Mason’s Calder last year was “earned” through the sake of a flash-in-the-pan first half; his second half in 2008-09 was about as unremarkable as his entire 2009-10 was.
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Ironically its Sather and the Rangers who take the prize for proper development of a prospect and resultant payoff
HL was drafted in 2000 just like somebody else…but long after him. It was five years before he stepped foot on MSG ice. Wonder whether DP’s story would have been different if he’d had that kind of patient development?
Maybe
I still tend to think of DP’s issue as injury-related, though. At the time his leg injuries began, he’d finally showed the form that many expected of him. The first half of that season, the Islanders were in a playoff spot basically on his shoulders.
And if there’s any truth to his athletic/roaming style being an extra tax on his body, I doubt anything short of going to Finnish school could have helped him in that area.
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Future Focus
I’m not overly concerned about the Calder because I agree with Dominik’s assertion that there are a lot of exogenous factors that carry influence. I did, however, catch the end of Canada’s game today against Russia [on tape delay]. Guess who took a pass in the neutral zone, skated up the right side, cut hard to the middle as he skated into the offensive zone, separated a Russian defenseman from his jock, and finally fired a wrist shot past Varlamov for Canada’s first goal. Yup – Tavares. I can’t wait for next year.
Oh – Duchene had Canada’s second goal. Also a nice wrist shot.
Link
Here’s the goal, 9:00 minute mark:
Thanks for the link
He made the D look like a traffic cone. That was great.
Joe Thornton should be drug tested or checked to see if an imposter has taken over his jersey.
by metalcoconut on May 21, 2010 9:13 AM EDT up reply actions
Woot!
Thanks for posting that. I heard about it but hadn’t gotten a chance to find it yet.
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Down Goes Brown - What Bettman does all day
Does it again, I’d say another Classic. Poor Isles at the end though…
The Islanders went from Marty McInnis and a 2nd Overall pick to Jesse Joensuu.
and yet it was JT outperforming MD in the worlds… a good sign he left with the lead in goals, a better sign were the articles i read describing his goals as wicked, pretty, sick, etc… we saw most of his wickedness ring off the pipe this year, so that he’s sinking some in is good news…
who knew that when the court takes your license away, they ACTUALLY take you license away??? (now how am i supposed to provide proof of ID???)
umm, not so sure about this. As Dom points out here, JT and Duchene are difficult to compare, so, it’s though to tell. But I watched most of their games at the Worlds and Duchene was a bit more noticeable and certainly more consistent than JT. That obviously doesn’t mean a lot, though, as the game on the bigger rink should suit Duchene better and as he had an easier time in terms of how he was used. He played on his natural position at center, whereas JT mostly played on the wing and was shuffled around quite a bit. And you’re right, JT scored a few great goals and that’s nice to see. But I don’t think it makes much sense to claim he was outperforming Duchene in this tournament.
As for the NHL season, I can’t really tell, as I hardly ever saw Duchene. But I’d have him over JT indeed in the Calder race. The two-way play argument is a pretty strong one there to me. JT improved in the finish, but Duchene seems to be quite a bit ahead there right now.
By the way, Mark Streit analyzed a couple of Swiss games on TV at the Worlds and talked very highly of Tavares. He loves to play with him and thinks JT had as good a rookie season as you can expect. And that he’d have been even better if he hadn’t needed to create so much on his own. According to Streit, JT had been very shy at the beginning, but opened up a lot. And JT won the majority of bets they made on Champions-League games.
And JT won the majority of bets they made on Champions-League games.
Ha, that’s a nice unexpected tidbit. Didn’t know JT was a fan.
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Zone Starts
Zone Starts tell the story – Tavares started in the offensive zone 56.9% of the time, Duchene 50.3%; Tavares finished in the O-zone 49.9% of the time and Duchene 50.7%. Tavares pushed the puck in the wrong direction 7% of the time. This is big, and worst on the team. Who is the best you ask – the Great Dane (of course) being +5%.
But, paradoxically, Duchene and Tavares defensive GVT is roughly the same (1.7 v 1.5). So, Tavares defense isn’t actually terrible. There is a slight difference in their quality of opposition but this isn’t massive (4th and 7th amongst forwards on their respective teams).
I noticed that with zone starts, but I figured the people rating them weren’t looking at that. Regardless, the stuff beyond zone starts (GVT as one example, teammates and Corsi rel. to QoC another) is why I’m still keeping an open mind on it.
I generally assume Duchene is the more two-way oriented player, but might Tavares create enough offense (yet to be determined) to make up for it? We’ll see. I’m curious to see how their results go in year two.
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Regarding Myers
I would go for him as Calder. A defensman isn’t often a 3-star choice if he doesn’t show up with any points, so I think a big kid playing a shutdown game isn’t always noticed based just on 3-star selections. Defensemen in general are probably under-represented. I am having the devil’s own trouble trying to find a game-by-game listing of 3-star selections, or I’d match it up to his game logs and see if any of those 11 picks were in a game where he didn’t get a point.
Myers did lead the league in neck. (LOOK AT THE THING – mesmerizing.) That’s gotta count a little.
Of course I'm an expert, I've seen Slap Shot eleven times!
He needs to be called The Ostrich
…but they probably use some lazy nickname like “Tyles” or “Mysie.”
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If I had any Photoshop skills at all...
He looks like one of those cloner dudes from the crappy Star Wars prequels.
Of course I'm an expert, I've seen Slap Shot eleven times!

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