Islanders Is Hockey 101
by BCISLEMAN on Nov 17, 2010 2:52 AM EST
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Islander Is Hockey: It's not for sissies!
By now, some of the shock of Scott Gordon's firing has worn off for most Islander fans. It wasn't bad enough that we were enduring this awful losing streak. We then had to cope with the shock of Gordon's sacking with which many of us disagreed and the absolute lampoonery of the team by the legions of Islander haters out there.
This included an absolutely moronic blogpost by Ken Campbell of THN in which he proved that (1) he hates the Islanders and (2) he knows nothing about them. In fairness to Ken, he is an equal opportunity hater. He made it very clear in his post that he has equal contempt for the Maple Leafs. Of course, all of these posts by "professional" writers only encouraged those Islander hating legions to an even greater frenzy.
On balance, the move was well intentioned, but misguided. The stated objective of getting players like Josh Bailey and Blake Comeau to return to the killer form they showed at the start of the season was a good one, but it might just as easily backfire in the short term while lending credence to the "Islander franchise is a circus" propaganda that prevails anytime most journalists and fans discuss the team.
For all the biased and distorted "reporting" of the Gordon firing, there is one thing that even Islander hater Campbell got right: the firing is unlikely to change much. The Islanders just do not have the horses to absorb lengthy injuries to five key players and still contend.
I know some folks were upset that I waved the white flag after the Kings game (though before the firing), but consider this. This team is six points behind its' pace at 17 games last year--and that was after a truly dreadful start to last season. This team finished with just under a point a game last season and I hardly need to add that Mark Streit, Kyle Okposo, Andy MacDonald, Rob Schremp, and last year's Milan Jurcina--Andy Sutton were playing just about all of the 82 games with the exception of Sutton who was traded at the deadline.
Even if we kept last year's pace for the remainder of the season, we would finish at 75 points which would have put us in pole position for third overall pick just one point ahead of Toronto in last year's standings. Given all of the losses to injury, however, it is more reasonable to suppose that the Isles will not be able to keep that pace. My guess is that the Isles will finish with significantly less than 75 points and will be neck and neck with the Oilers for the #1 overall pick.
And, of course, the great unwashed resume their chorus: "team is a...circus, joke, clown act," and Islander fans cringe with embarrassment. They are all missing the big picture.
Perhaps the cream and certainly the bulk of the Islander talent pool, with a few notable exceptions, has yet to spend a season with the team. Even just looking at likely additions next year, the team will likely add Nino, Hamonic, and De Haan and possibly Petrov and some of the Bridgeport elite. A host of other talented players will move up in the following 2-3 years. And then there is the draft.
The kind of finish the Isles are likely to have this year will put them in position to grab the #1 overall or perhaps the #2. Either way, they will have a good chance to draft Adam Larsson who could become the most talented defenseman since The Captain. Add him to the list noted above, and the Islanders become a legitimate contender next year.
Don't let the Islander-hating legion of doom fool you. This team's future is bright.
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"The cream of the Islander talent pool, with a few notable exceptions, has yet to spend a season with the team."
That quote is the main point, I think. Though I’d argue the cream of the talent pool is already here, but certainly the bulk of the pool.
Overall thoughts: There is a lot to criticize with this club, so with MSM I often find myself shouting, “But you’re criticizing the wrong thing!” When they say “it’s getting late in the rebuild” at Year 2+2 months, I’ve little patience for the conversation because I know where it leads. These same people bashed other teams for a decade until they got good, and then suddenly those teams were genius, genius!
Writers who raved about the team in Week 2 and then in Week 7 say obviously the rebuild is going nowhere either have zero long-term perspective or just need to fill space. Criticism is absolutely warranted on how management approached making the team competitive this season. But in terms of the future, the rebuild was about acquiring draft assets and keeping them; their oldest asset from this approach (unless you count keeping and extending Frans) is 22. Twenty-two! Most of the assets aren’t even with the team because they simply aren’t ready, nor should they be. The only real area where they can rip the rebuild right now is whether the young players currently on the roster might suffer developmentally for a lack of veterans to help. (But even then, I wonder, “Oh, so Tanguay is the answer?”)
So to me, talking about how they approached fielding a playoff-possible team this year and how the long-term rebuild is going are two separate issues, which receive two very different grades.
This team is six points behind its pace at 17 games last year—and that was after a truly dreadful start to last season.
Sobering.
last year’s Pavel JurcinaIt took me a while to see what was wrong with this typo. Somehow “Pavel Jurcina” just rolls off the tongue.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo and MacDonald were important.
fix
Certainly not the bulk of the pool, should say.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo and MacDonald were important.
A truly intelligent reporter might pick up on what a find we have in AMac
by noting how the wheels came off after he went down. Before the injuries, there was some chance at the playoffs. As I say, this team is just too thin right now to absorb those losses.
The cream of our defensive talent is mostly not here yet as well as three or even four of our best power forwards plus our three prime goaltending prospects.
Always general narratives for popular consumption
This is why there are so many national writers I can’t stomach unless they’re covering a local (to them) issue they know really well. I don’t share the same belief that there are “Islanders haters” out there exactly; more that writers who have to be generalists subscribe to common narratives and merely paint by numbers within those narratives. And thus they rarely tell us anything new. Some of them even use the opportunity to grind long-held grudges, which is completely irresponsible.
So the Isles have done little over the last 20 years to “earn” a different narrative. I get that. But when they make a relevant critique — as you cite: Will a coaching move change much? — yet go to the narrative well for evidence, I start to doubt if reading their coverage for any team is worthwhile. It works for the general fan, the casual fan, but obviously for many of us there’s more to glean by actually sifting through the micro/local coverage and sussing out who is focused on a given team day after day and who is just filling assignments that can range among all 30 teams (or rather, all 6 teams plus whichever of the other 24 have bad news that week).
As for Campbell specifically, he’s an odd one. Purely cantankerous all the time now, which is a very different tone from his writing in the ’80s. Something along the way has jaded him past the point of return.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo and MacDonald were important.
that's the thing
the popular writers—whether it is because of laziness, spite, or just being tired old grumps like Campbell (I have heard the same thing about him…maybe Garth kicked his dog at one time!)—have developed a narrative that is hard to distinguish from Islander-hating fans. The only way to change it is to keep building the franchise the right way—damn the haters, full speed ahead!!! Then, when the horses are all in place, just win, baby, win!!!
My wife would say that it served me right for staying up so late to write the post
My brain cells needed a rest!!!
It finally hit me
Pavel Kubina! That’s why it sounded so natural…never made that rhyming connection with them until now. They’d make a good song lyric.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo and MacDonald were important.
or Pavel Brendl (now in the SM-Liiga)
I think it was partly the fact that I am used to just calling him Jurcina.
the future isn't bad.
As long as garth/wang find/sign/trade-for/draft the missing pieces to the puzzle, the future should be good.
Definite future pieces that will likely be kept on the team now:
Tavares, Okposo, Moulson, Bailey, Nielsen, A-mac, Streit(for now), (Martin?), (These guys are the guys who all will or have earned their spot to stay on the team as important future pieces)
SHOULD DEFINITELY BE Future pieces in the system:
Hamonic, De Haan, Nino, Mikko/Poulin, (obviously there are others, but they all have too many question marks or too much developping to do to become serious parts of our team’s future)
The main core doesn’t look bad, but we still have a lot of whole to fill. I am confident in the team’s future, as long as garth/wang are willing to spend some money to bring in some guys. Obviously acquiring a young 2-way d guy, ala streit, would help this team out A LOT defensively and offensively.
Go isles or Go home.
they are all prospects
and you could argue that even the younger players on the squad now—not excepting JT either—are prospects as well. They have proven they can play in the NHL, but they have yet to prove that they will be what they were drafted to be.
The players you mention are all promising prospects, but they have yet to prove even that they can play at the NHL level. I am reasonably confident that they will be able to achieve that and become very good NHLers…but I have similar confidence about Petrov, Lee, Nilsson, Kabanov, Kessel, Cizikas, Donovan, Reese, Nelson, and Ullstrom. Nino and Lee, in particular, I believe have great careers ahead of them. I suspect that they will have careers at least worthy of comparison with JT’s.
I should add that other prospects
such as Gregoire, Day, Joensuu, Figren, and others look promising as well. It will be interesting to see how they develop.
That's a lot of faith right there in all those prospects.
I was just trying to post the ones I thought would 95-100% become solid nhl players with long nhl careers, obviously there are other solid prospects in the system as you mentioned, I am just not so high on them that I think they will become long-term islander/nhl players. I’m not convinced yet at least.
Go isles or Go home.
they absolutely have the talent
all of them. Petrov just has to decide to come over here when his contract is up in 2012. I believe his coming to the prospect sessions this summer is a sign that he intends to do just that. Lee is a special player, a special athlete. His issue is that he also has a special brain and he might be distracted by scholastic opportunities and a future outside of hockey. Nilsson, by all accounts, is developing quite well. In fact, in 9 games in the SEL, he has a 1.98 GAA and a .905 sv%. Kessel, Cizikas, and Donovan are all progressing quite well and you know about Reese, Nelson, and Ullstrom. As I say, they are ALL prospects and nothing is guaranteed, but these guys seem to be safe bets.
I also think....................
that the pool of forwards down the pipeline is not great, you can’t count on the Russians, I’m
not blown away by our forwards at the Bridge. The rest are at least a couple of years away. The Defense and G look good.
Nino will be a star
I am convinced that Petrov will come over when his contract is up and that he will also be a quality top six. Kabanov is a great talent. He needs to grow up is all. If he does, fine. If not, he is sure to start producing enough at some point that somebody will want him and give up a pick and / or a prospect for him. We have so many forwards who are performing well in collegiate and junior settings that some of them are bound to become effective NHL players. Nino and Anders are the two who I am convinced will not only play but will become stars.
I feel the same way,
aside from nino, I wouldn’t have high hopes in the kirill “projects” or other prospects in the forward department. The d though of a-mac, de haan, and hamonic is pretty solid though(although undersized). And goalies, yeah we’re good there.
Go isles or Go home.
both of the kirills were going to be top ten or even top five picks
but one was immature and the other had a contract in the KHL. They both have loads of talent. Petrov has one more year on his contract after this one and he’s made it clear that he wants to come here. Kabanov just has to grow up a bit.
All of our prospects are doing VERY well in college and juniors…so I don’t really get what you are so worried about. With Nino, you have five legit top six forwards. You need one more and with the Kirills, Anders, and probably Nelson as well, you have as many as five potential top six forwards.
On defense, we need four top four quality defenders, We have three young top four quality guys. We need one more. Simple math really.
I think I lied...
…when I said so many times that I did not care about this season. Obviously, I DO care and it is disappointing to see what was a promising (if unnaturally inflated) start tail off into the disaster that we are now living through.
On balance, the move was well intentioned, but misguided.
I hate that Gordon is being blamed for the streak that has gutted our enthusiasm. I think it has as much to do with the expectations that came with the new season as with the streak itself. Otherwise, why wasn’t he canned during or after the 2-12-1 sreak in January-February that killed the 2009-2010 season? This was going to be the year that the team competed every night, even if they weren’t going to win every game. This was the year we all, after so many years of Valdemort induced drek, were supposed to see what the future would hold. Unfortunately,
1. the major injuries to Streit and Okposo,
2. the (unexpectedly disastrous) injury to AMac,
3. the myriad of other injuries,
4. the need to see what RickyD can do (or not do, if that’s your take — don’t want to start an RDP debate here), and
5. the fragile psyche of a very young team,
have conspired to make this a very difficult time.
The Islanders just do not have the horses to absorb lengthy injuries to five key players and still contend.
However, I am not convinced that all is lost.
This team is six points behind its’ pace at 17 games last year—and that was after a truly dreadful start to last season.
If the Isles can return somewhat to the form we expected and can avoid the February swoon, we may come close to what we did last year, which was raeally all we can hope for.
I am confident in the team’s future, …
I love our future.
Half a league, half a league,
Half a league onward,
All in the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
"Forward, the Light Brigade!
"Charge for the guns!" he said:
Into the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
by Nova Scotia Isles Fan on Nov 17, 2010 3:41 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
best case scenario from a competitive standpoint
the coaching change really sparks the guys—esp Blake who has to realize that he has no more excuses—and they manage to get back in the hunt BEFORE Jurcina, Kyle and AMac return. Then the team takes it to another level, Garth buys instead of sells (Jamie Langenbrunner, for example), and Mark’s return puts the team over the top. That would spell the end of any hope of getting Larsson. In fact, Musil might even be a long shot.
That seems unlikely, however. The team was playing well the last five games. They were just outmanned. I suspect that we will be on the lottery special in April.
Speaking of Islander Mockery...
Anyone ever watch that horrible Islanders Draft video from the Ranger Crisis Show? That video is just a punch in the stomach to Islander Fans. Watch it if you dare. I would put the link up, but that would be too kind to the Rags fans lacking brain cells who made it.
A pefect example of people who speak spitefully about the Islanders.
All Who Oppose Grabner Shall Perish.
they say living well is the best revenge
Charlie and Garth may be clueless regarding the media and PR, but Garth is putting together quite an array of talent. They should be ready to rock and roll over the next 1-2 years. Then the mouth will be reduced to maing assinine comments about them such as he made about Bobby N. I forget the exact comment he made, but to any objective observer who is familiar with Bobby’s career, it was an incredible display of ignorance.
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1979-80
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May 24, 1980: Tonelli to Nystrom. At long last, the steady build of the New York Islanders from expansion doormat to surprise semifinalist to annual contender reaches the promised land: Buoyed by a late season trade for Butch Goring that gave the team the depth up the middle GM Bill Torrey had been seeking, the Islanders knock off the Philadelphia Flyers in six games.
The victory justified the faith in coach Al Arbour who guided them from their second season to their first Stanley Cup seven seasons later. The Islanders would not be the first expansion team to win the Stanley Cup, but they would be the only one capable of a dynasty.
1980-81
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May 21, 1981: This time it was much easier. After falling to "only" 91 points in the 1979-80 season, the Islanders returned to their division title tradition, piling up 110 points -- a whole 13 points over second-place Philadelphia.
Between the quarterfinals (where they beat the upstart Oilers in six games) and the finals, the Islanders reeled off eight consecutive wins -- with a four-game sweep of archrival Rangers in between. As they defeated the Minnesota North Stars in five games for their second Cup, their goal difference in the final was a combined +10.
1981-82
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May 16, 1982: Another year, another landslide title. The Islanders won the Patrick Division by a whopping 26 points over the second-place Rangers, and were seven points clear of their nearest competition for the President's Trophy, the still-not-quite-ripe Edmonton Oilers.
A first-round scare against the Pittsburgh Penguins turned in the Isles' favor thanks to John Tonelli's heroics, and a true dynasty was on its way: Past the Rangers in six games, then an eight-game sweep of the Quebec Nordiques and Vancouver Canucks to run away with the Stanley Cup.
1982-83
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May 17, 1983: Not so fast, whipper-snappers. The Edmonton Oilers' steadily rising challenge for league supremacy took them all the way to the finals for the first time, where the New York Islanders summarily dispatched them in a four-game sweep. For the Islanders, the Dynasty was secured. For the Oilers, it was a powerful lesson in where talent ends and the demands of playoff hockey begin.
Four years, four Cups, 16 consecutive playoff series wins (a record that would grow to 19 until the rematch with the Oilers the following year). Mike Bossy scored 60 goals yet again, and Wayne Gretzky became acquainted with Billy Smith's crease.
