Not Gone Yet: Nino, de Haan survive latest Islanders cuts
by Dominik on Oct 3, 2010 2:56 PM EDT
in Roster Manoeuvres in the Dark
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Young Islanders hopefuls Nino Niederreiter and Calvin De Haan aren't going back to juniors just yet. The Islanders' latest roster cuts after the conclusion of preseason games pares the quasi-roster down to a healthy um...26 bodies(?), meaning they need to get rid of three-to-four more by Lou's Cap Circumvention Day Wednesday afternoon.
*There is much confusion on this; the team email release said 28 on the roster, the site release says 27, and Andy Hilbert and Calvin de Haan aren't listed on that roster but are not listed as demoted either, while Mark Streit and Kyle Okposo are still on the list without the traditional double-asterisk indicating IR (that comes later).
Regardless, we know where the decisions remain:
Gone (to Bridgeport) but leaving us hopeful for the future: Rhett Rakhshani, David Ullstrom, Travis Hamonic, Mikko Koskinen. The hopeful preseason high in me expects to see all of these youngsters wearing the NYI some time in the next two seasons.
Gone (to Bridgeport) and having fewer shots remaining than the above: Jesse Joensuu (who at lest scored twice this weekend), Justin DiBenedetto (who showed some spark and progress over last year), Dylan Reese (who was a nice callup last year), Mark Katic (who was in front of A-Mac before his injury last year), Tomas Marcinko, Micheal Haley, Rob Hisey, Jeremy Yablonski. All of these guys should be contributors to Bridgeport this year in some form.
All veteran PTO invites (Dean McAmmond, Krys Kolanos, Anders Eriksson, Manny Legace) have been shed and given their participation badges.
No shocks there. The big questions as I see them: At forward, who gets cut among Nino, two-ways Jon Sim, Trevor Gillies, Andy Hilbert (still here, right?) and possibly Matt Martin, or even Euro-out-clause P.A. Parentau? In the back, if the Isles start with eight D, then de Haan must bump a healthy someone (Bruno Gervais?) to stick around. All to come as the Isles roster turns...
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Do you guys think Parentau will make the team? Being a Rangers fan, I root for him to make the team. He played well with the Blueshirts last year. (Don’t kill me for liking the Rangers!)
Writer for Pinstripe Alley, MLB Daily Dish
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We won't kill you
But you’ll have to wear this scarlet “R” on your chest from now on.
They talked about him like they wanted him to. He has those powerplay-friendly hands. If it weren’t for the summer talk I’d have my doubts after this preseason (I just don’t see where he fits other than the PP), but my imaginary money is on him making it right now.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
Seconded,
he is that type that did great in the minors but never got a fair shot in the nhl. He’s gonna get that shot this year, and most likely with a starting job. If he’s not in the starting lineup, I’d be very surprised.
Go isles or Go home.
Isles Roster
I would think it is a safe bet that Parenteau will be a part of the opening day roster.What he does with the opportunity will be up to him.As far as liking the Rangers Brandon,we all make mistakes in life,some are just bigger than others.Someone that you didn’t mention in your post Dom was Dustin Kohn.I think it’s another safe bet to say that Kohn is not in the Isles future whether or not he is claimed on waivers.
Ditto Joe and Sue™.I would put Katic and DiBo on that list as well.Matt Martin will be with the big club for the entire season(remember you read it here first,I think).Gillies will be an in and outer for the Isles as well(depending on who their opponent is).
I won’t hazzard a guess as far as Sim and Hilbert(the tea leaves are starting to get a little cloudy).Please don’t tell me the Isles are seriously considering the totally inexperienced Calvin de Haan as a viable option on the powerplay.What ever happened to patience and the 5 year plan?Anyone that knows IOW knows what I would like to see happen instead.
Kohn
Yeah I wasn’t really high on him last year (thought Reese was much better, though granted he’s older) and don’t figure him in the long-term picture. Never know though; he has some size, and sometimes with non-minute-muching D they just have to figure out how to adapt their play to a role that can get them an NHL job.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
I'd take hilbert over sim,
Hilbert is a much much better 2-way player then sim and can be a great help on the penalty kill. Sim is just an agitating winger that’s very inconsistent. My dos cents.
Go isles or Go home.
I’d have to vote for Sim over Hilbert. Sim was in the NHL last year, he’s been in Gordon’s system for two years, he’s a winger which we always need more of, and Sim fits the mold of a 3rd/4th line grinder much better.
When will the hurting stop?
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
Definitely
Simmer for me.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Oct 3, 2010 11:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Thirded!
I guess it depended on the need, but I’d prefer a world where we needed Sim for agitating duties than one where we needed Hilbert for PK duties.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
(or fourthed, I guess…)
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
not fifth
Are we rebuilding?,maybe. Are we getting top 6 help? NO. Since we are not making the play-offs, what is the strategy? To let as many kids as possible play on the Island? Or is it safer to let them deveop in the minors? In the meantime do we go thru the motions of having Sim and Hilbert hang on the Island and fill out a roster that isgoing no where ? Apparently that is the plan and I can’t see why anybody is happy with that. I’ll cheer for the team and hope they win some games, but let’s be honest , the situation is PATHETIC>
In the meantime do we go thru the motions of having Sim and Hilbert hang on the Island and fill out a roster that isgoing no where ? Apparently that is the plan
First of all nobody said that. The question here that you are responding to was which one of the two would you prefer.
Secondly if that was “the plan” they would both be on one way and not two way deals. They arent.
My advice to you is wait til the roster is decided before you assume you know who will be on the Island. Because you dont.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Oct 4, 2010 7:57 AM EDT up reply actions
The Question was: Sim vs. Hilbert
Beyond that, I’m not sure I understand the complaint. Some prospects need development in the minors, some are ready to take a step on the Island. If anyone has the secret formula for how to figure which is which, they haven’t shared it or had it peer-reviewed.
I half-suspect they are waiting to send Sim or Hilbert down (or both) because they are vets who don’t need AHL training camp and because injuries can happen between now and Opening Night (so don’t expose them to waivers until you absolutely have to), but regardless I’m sure some in a mid-December slump will complain that this team doesn’t have enough “veteran leadership.”
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
I can see where he was coming from,
he chose none of the above. I am somewhat with him, in the whole the season is looking very dim, so why not give EVERYBODY WORTHY/SOMEWHAT-READY at least a solid amount of games in the nhl. Example: Rhett-15gms+, Ulstrom-15gms+, Joensuu 15gms+, and anyone else worthy of a LONG look. And it’s better to check them all at separate times/lines so we get a better evaluation. I would love for this to happen. It honestly shouldn’t hurt any of them at all, it should actually help us evaluate them for next year and the future. How do we know someone’s ready for the actual job now or in the future until they get some testing field time first? That’s how I see it. If we were shooting for a playoff spot, then hilbert. But as the team is, I honestly would like to have Rhett/Ulstrom/Joensuu in a test role in 3rd line minutes and bump hunter’s min/gm down a bit so we can see their future team worth and readiness. I’m a believer in you never know how a player will perform until they are put in the exact situation they are going to be playing. We all have heard of hyped players in juniors/ahl/Europe that all were great there and flopped in the nhl. So why not give one of them a solid try at a time?
Go isles or Go home.
I'm sure each will get his shot via injuries
In the meantime, no harm in letting them prove it at the next level first. Show me you can do it in the AHL, then we’ll move you up.
There’s a long history (admittedly circumstantial) of guys being rushed into NHL action and not necessarily panning out. If you can’t give a scoring type good minutes in the NHL, all the more danger that you’re botching a significant stage of their development. The Oilers have consistently run their kids out there and have consistently cost themselves in either stuttered development and/or wasted entry-level years.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
The Caps rushed Steve Eminger and it blew up in their face. After that they were extremely cautious/conservative with Mike Green, Jeff Schultz, Karl Alzner, and arguably even John Carlson (even though his meteoric rise does not look conservative at all, I think he probably could have been an NHL regular months before he actually became one).
Lockout talk makes me want to go out and choke an old lady - Elliotte Friedman
And even aside from the development aspect is the question of whether it’s wise to burn an ELC year on Nino/CdH when you know that you aren’t going to be particularly competitive. It might just be smarter to save that year and hope you can save some money when it’s time to really challenge in a few years.
Lockout talk makes me want to go out and choke an old lady - Elliotte Friedman
I agree with that concern in principle, but I do wonder about a side effect I never see mentioned: Having multiple contracts come up at the same time.
So theoretically: If the Islanders are going to suck this year anyway, and they send Nino/CdH back for this reason, what if they get a #1 or #2 overall pick next summer who steps right into the lineup (because those guys always do, even when it’s wrong) at the same time Nino and CdH do? Suddenly you have three guys coming due in the same summer, one of whom is a top-of-the-draft pick and the other two who are that much better in their contract year than they would have been.
I’m pretty sure you can’t quite plan for disaster that way — and I’ve never really thought through all the possible implications — but that scenario always comes to mind. (On the other hand, maybe if all three like what’s being built, it provides subtle pressure for them all to sign cap-friendly contracts. Don’t know if you can plan on that either.)
Then to add another wrinkle, I half wonder if the next CBA will provide unpredictable new variables (although the three-year rookie cap seems to be a popular and lasting feature).
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
Two excellent points. Who knows what the new CBA will look like, and, just to use EDM as an example, what happens if they have Hall, Eberle, and Paajarvi all coming for a new deal at the same time and they even come close to living up to expectations? That’s a tough situation (especially with their terrible long term contracts, to tie back to the discussion in the other thread).
Ultimately I guess it may make the most sense to just play the guy in the NHL when he is ready to play in the NHL. Whether Nino or CdH is ready, you guys would know much better than I. I just don’t think forcing them to play in the NHL just because they are close and there aren’t many better options is wise. I’d rather have Sim than a not-quite-ready stud prospect.
Lockout talk makes me want to go out and choke an old lady - Elliotte Friedman
I’d rather have Sim than a not-quite-ready stud prospect
Exactly. There are a lot of people who need to think about this statement.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Oct 6, 2010 8:02 PM EDT up reply actions
You are a sick and lonely man.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
Silly question if it's already been asked:
Are there any cuts of those BP-bound or camp invitees that any of you wished we had kept? Or are you happy with who is outski and inski?
Rhett
I was positive that he was in after the KO injury. Maybe he comes back if Nino is sent to juniors after the 9 game trial period. He had a good camp. I was hoping for Hamonic but I concede that he could use another year in the A.
Rhett is a good bet...
… to see some NHL time when/if Nino returns to juniors. Rhett might help them in some aspects, but I have a feeling he’ll be less affective in divisional games because of his size.
He, and Ullstrom, may offer a spark if the team is flat for the first 9-15 games.
Gordon said he wanted SIZE this year… well, he certainly didn’t add any size on defence if Katic and deHaan beat out Jurcina…. and he will not have gotten bigger up front if Rakhshani is in Okposo’s roster spot.
A lot of this team’s future may be made around the deadline… and after seeing some of these kids and having a better idea of what the next generation may be capable of… guys like Hunter and Weight may want to keep a bag packed.
I don’t think either one of those guys is a “problem” but we’re starting to see real live roster issues that some people thought they had in years past. There are REALLY some talented kids in the pipeline… and the team may need to shed some age (and talent) while they might be worth something.
Forget about the LHP, BKLYN, Queens or Hamilton... Wang is moving the Islanders to The Nassau University Medical Center.
Is there really any chance that Jurcina doesn’t make the team? He won’t make it through waivers and on his contract I’d love it if the Caps picked him back up to be the 6D. (I have dreams that he’s a depth acquisition at the deadline.) Plus, CdH doesn’t seem to be fighting for the same roster spot as Jurcina.
Lockout talk makes me want to go out and choke an old lady - Elliotte Friedman
PTOs on the outski
If you’d asked me going into camp who I’d rather have among Dean McAmmond, Jon Sim and Andy Hilbert, I’d have thrown my weight behind Deano (he had a PTO, the other two already had two-ways). Give that man a two-way and let the three of them be our “veteran help” down in Bridgeport and up here when necessary. That said, I have no gauge on how October 2010 versions of Dean, Sim, and First Base Andy are, not having seen more than a few meaningless minutes.
As far as prospects, I think everyone going down is where they belong right now, in the place that’s best for them. This is one of those situations where I (think I) know what’s best and clearly Garth knows what’s best, but I’m glad someone else’s hand is on the trigger because it sure is fun to watch the young’ns flash what might one day be.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
Last year on their Entry Deal For the Following
Jesse Joensuu
Robin Fingern
Tomas Marcinko
And Kohn and Reese are both on the final year of their deals
When will the hurting stop?
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
I wonder who's first callup on D?
For me I’d want Reese or Hamonic, depending on circumstances.
And how sour does the hockey career fee if you’re JJ, Figren or Marcinko right now?
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
I'd go hamonic because of his size and overall skills,
reese is aged and has looked good and has some o potential, but I just don’t see him getting the first shot given. Hamonic has been touted for a while, even in training camp and juniors for the big steps he took. He’s #1 call-up in my mind.
Go isles or Go home.
Just a thought, you think maybe Garth prefers calling up his acquisitions and draftees as compared to the leftover Milbury players? Joensuu, Fingern, Kohn and Marcinko are all Leftovers from the old regime.
When will the hurting stop?
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
I could buy that…although I could also see why he’d have good reason to default that way. Amazing the contrast between the cupboard he inherited and the one he’s built up.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
Lets Go Already Huh
I can’t even read anymore….i just wanna get going with it already.
Tavares will be a stud this year….a breakout season…I really believe that. We have received our major injury tally for the season (This will be a blessing in Disguise though….getting Streit back will be like a deadline trade….Okposo will only miss 25 games or so….and since we have already met our injury quota….DiPietro and Martinek will stay healthy all season). Plus…the injuries will give a little time to take a closer look at the two kids still alive to make the team (DeHaan and Nino).
Plus…I think they we will be surprised by some of the usual suspects in the league this year…(Prediction from me:….Brodeur shows some age and the Devils will disappoint).
FB4Real
"Past performance Is Not A Guarantee For Future Results"
In my view of your uncuts list,
Gillies is the reserve, Martin and Parenteau are locks, and the final starting spot is down to nino, hilbert, and sim. And right now, my money is on Gordon having nino play a full-season here. I just have the feeling that if Gordon is seeing this season like most of us with low low expectations, that he might as well give nino the minutes since he has the big nhl body and raw skills. Remember, this is a similar but not exact situation(team overall) that occurred when bailey was drafted. And not only was bailey smaller at ~185lbs, but he wasn’t as good/nhl-ready as/as-an overall player as nino is now too. So that’s what will happen in my mind. Nino will get his break-in season and 15min/gm and play decent in it(30pts+ if he adjusts well, 20pts+ if he adjusts ok). That’s how I see it. I just don’t see Gordon going with sim on the team to start, especially because he doesn’t like sim, and I’m not sure hilbert is enough of a veteran and multi-tool guy for gordon to give him a starting job.
Go isles or Go home.
Comeau an "A"
I noticed from some of the pics from Saturday’s game at the Coliseum that Blake Comeau was wearing an “A”…..has the team already decided on its captains? Since Streit and Okposo are out for a while….who will take their place? Weight obviously wears the “C”….who wears the A’s?
I would think maybe Frans and Hunter? Its tough to give it to a newcomer but maybe someone like a Mark Eaton?
FB4Real
"Past performance Is Not A Guarantee For Future Results"
I think they've filtered around a bit during the preseason
I know Hunter and Martinek were wearing them in various games (if the Getty/AP picture stream is to be believed).
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
The Youngans
The Youngans…I like them down the road….I’d like for Tavares and Bailey to just focus on getting better this year…I totally agree that its really just a matter of time before Tavares is a captain with us….still too young though.
Wiz is a good choice…I like Eaton because he has that Stanley Cup pedigree (been through it with Pittsburgh). Bailey won’t step up vocally like that just yet….hes a smart kid….he knows his place still.
What about a Roloson? is that unusual? a Gaolie I mean.
FB4Real
"Past performance Is Not A Guarantee For Future Results"
Goalies with letters
Unusual, technically illegal, and recently frowned upon. (The Canucks having tried Luongo as their de facto captain — sans de jure letter — and then reversing that decision a year later.)
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
OK...
So, the 28 guys who are left:
Josh Bailey
Blake Comeau
Calvin deHaan
Rick DiPietro
Mark Eaton
Bruno Gervais
Trevor Gillies
Andy Hilbert
Jack Hillen
Trent Hunter
Milan Jurcina
Zenon Konopka
Andrew MacDonald
Matt Martin
Radek Martinek
Mike Mottau
Matt Moulson
Nino Niederreiter
Frans Nielsen
Kyle Okposo “A”
P.A. Parenteau
Dwayne Roloson
Rob Schremp
Jon Sim
Mark Streit “A”
John Tavares
Doug Weight “C”
James Wisniewski
One question: Why is nobody mentioning Nathan Lawson?
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
My guess is because he’s going to be BP until something goes wrong.
When will the hurting stop?
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
Yeah thats possible but then that would be three… and a 3-goalie rotation isnt the best way to develop Lawson, Poulin, and Koskinen. I wonder if one of them will go to the ECHL to get more playing time. But Strang doesnt even seem to remember Lawson is on the team & even mention him, which is kinda odd.
Let Us Go, Islanders! (Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)
by TheMetalChick on Oct 4, 2010 8:00 AM EDT up reply actions
Injured still?
I haven’t head any mention either…not even sure what the ailment was that kept him out (and thus whether it’s still keeping him out now).
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
Oops, here you go: Still injured
Matt Martin is shooting on No. 3 goalie Nathan Lawson, who is working his way back from some kind of groin/hip injury.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
Oh a hip injury he should have had that last year with everyone else...
this is the year of the shoulder injury
Kids these days
Can’t follow simple instructions.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
They’ve done it before, Lawson will barely see any AHL games unless Poulin or Koskinen gets hurt. If DP or Rollie goes down they’ll call up Lawson and get him back into game shape ASAP.
When will the hurting stop?
Contributor to Lighthouse Hockey not sure if I'm the Sniper or the Enforcer.
Question....
Excuse my ignorance, but how do Okposo, Streit and (now) Schremp factor in to the 23 man roster? They do not need to be named to the 23 man roster, right? Only when they are ready to be re-activated, then the Isles will need to make some moves?
If that’s the case, then I see only 2 guys from the above list as the odd men out, and I’d say it’s a no brainer that it would be Gillies and Hilbert….guys with 2-way contracts….right? Or maybe Martin if he’s still not 100%.
If this is correct, it seems more and more apparent that deHaan and Nino are going to get their 9 game tryout. Otherwise, they would have been cut by now, no?
Basically the rosters begin "season mode" Wednesday
So that is the point when Okposo and Streit and now Schremp will be on IR, and the rest of the survivors will fill out the 23-man.
Just to clarify, Sim also has a two-way contract.
And on de Haan and Nino: I would think so, particularly Nino. (De Haan would at least require cutting a one-way veteran D.) But it’s possible the Isles just want them “around the club” to get them as much education before freeing them to their junior clubs. I just get the feeling in recent years that the Isles like to keep their kids close for as long as possible.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
what's the different between Trevor Gillies and Jeremy Yablonski?
some handbars
Don't TOEWS Me Bro!! - 2010 Stanley Cup Champions - James M. Fitzgerald is THE MAN!!
I would add
Gillies can at least nominally skate.
Lighthouse Hockey: You say that like Streit and Okposo were important to this team.
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1979-80
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May 24, 1980: Tonelli to Nystrom. At long last, the steady build of the New York Islanders from expansion doormat to surprise semifinalist to annual contender reaches the promised land: Buoyed by a late season trade for Butch Goring that gave the team the depth up the middle GM Bill Torrey had been seeking, the Islanders knock off the Philadelphia Flyers in six games.
The victory justified the faith in coach Al Arbour who guided them from their second season to their first Stanley Cup seven seasons later. The Islanders would not be the first expansion team to win the Stanley Cup, but they would be the only one capable of a dynasty.
1980-81
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May 21, 1981: This time it was much easier. After falling to "only" 91 points in the 1979-80 season, the Islanders returned to their division title tradition, piling up 110 points -- a whole 13 points over second-place Philadelphia.
Between the quarterfinals (where they beat the upstart Oilers in six games) and the finals, the Islanders reeled off eight consecutive wins -- with a four-game sweep of archrival Rangers in between. As they defeated the Minnesota North Stars in five games for their second Cup, their goal difference in the final was a combined +10.
1981-82
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May 16, 1982: Another year, another landslide title. The Islanders won the Patrick Division by a whopping 26 points over the second-place Rangers, and were seven points clear of their nearest competition for the President's Trophy, the still-not-quite-ripe Edmonton Oilers.
A first-round scare against the Pittsburgh Penguins turned in the Isles' favor thanks to John Tonelli's heroics, and a true dynasty was on its way: Past the Rangers in six games, then an eight-game sweep of the Quebec Nordiques and Vancouver Canucks to run away with the Stanley Cup.
1982-83
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May 17, 1983: Not so fast, whipper-snappers. The Edmonton Oilers' steadily rising challenge for league supremacy took them all the way to the finals for the first time, where the New York Islanders summarily dispatched them in a four-game sweep. For the Islanders, the Dynasty was secured. For the Oilers, it was a powerful lesson in where talent ends and the demands of playoff hockey begin.
Four years, four Cups, 16 consecutive playoff series wins (a record that would grow to 19 until the rematch with the Oilers the following year). Mike Bossy scored 60 goals yet again, and Wayne Gretzky became acquainted with Billy Smith's crease.
