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Islanders Mission: A 'rebuild' by any other name...

Official Party Communique: These young men are NOT part of a rebuild. Just call it a Great Leap Forward.

More photos » Nick Wass - AP

Official Party Communique: These young men are NOT part of a rebuild. Just call it a Great Leap Forward.

Since summer 2008, I've taken to referring to what the Islanders are doing as a "rebuild" -- from the ground up, no less, given the free agents who were allowed to walk that summer and the strategically restrained additions made since. So you bet I was bemused to hear the man I consider to be the architect of this rebuild tell James Mirtle (for the Globe and Mail) that's not what's happening:

"I don’t use that word rebuild. We’re trying to make the playoffs and win a Stanley Cup like every other team. We don’t go in with the mindset that losing is acceptable, and when that word is used, sometimes winning doesn’t matter. [snip] ... We’re trying to win every hockey game we play in. The group that we have in that locker room, it may be young, but that doesn’t mean it can’t have success."

(Note that impartial James was surprised at the parsing, too.)

Maybe losing isn't "acceptable," but, well, it's inevitable because ... we're in a rebuild! To parse here sounds a bit absurd. I understand Garth Snow doesn't want to officially decree a built-in excuse for losing. That, along with "trying to win" is part of his role as franchise director -- which I think he takes too seriously whenever speaking on record, leaving us always with carefully guarded quotes such as this one.

[After the jump: More on the Islanders rebu-- uh, hmm, "program," plus some questions for you.]

Star-divide

But let's not let the world of PC and hockey cliches 101 ("anything can happen ... one game at a time") muddy the big picture here, which is a familiar tale: The Islanders' prospect cupboard was thin, their veterans aging and their ability to attract free agents severely hindered by 1) reputation, 2) facilities/future uncertainty, and 3) lack of funds. Regardless of what Snow texts to Larry Brooks about the permission to add a salary should a playoff push warrant it [Note: discuss that in Chickendirt's FanPost here], the Islanders are basically at the salary cap floor.

They're saving their dry powder for a more promising season, or for when the Lighthouse Project is a go, or whatever reason you buy or suggest -- but the clearest hockey reason why their payroll is at a relative level where no team has ever won a Cup is because they are rebuilding. If losing isn't acceptable now, it's a whole lot closer to acceptable than it will be next year or the year after that.

"...almost two years ago, we set a direction, a course where we would build through the draft and develop our talent and sprinkle in free agents when it made sense."

The above is what is commonly referred to as "rebuilding." Suffering through last year's injury-per-day growing pains without adding in-season replacements was done not because that's how you "try to win every game" but because the Islanders were rebuilding. That sort of losing was -- if not acceptable -- at least tolerated because ... yeah, you get the picture. You got it more than a year ago.

I Guess It's Not a 'Rebuild' if Milbury Sold All the Bricks

I'm not harping on Snow's strategy -- I fully endorse it, whatever he calls it. I just shake my head at his tendency to play everything in public comments like a buttoned-up CEO rather than a guy who spent his career in hockey locker rooms and whose job is to build -- and sell, mind you -- a package for fans. Countless accounts say he's a funny, witty, let's-be-real guy in conversation and when off the record; but on the record we get the equivalent of, "We continue to shepherd fiduciary interests and work to build shareholder value." Yawn.

As far as rebuilding goes, I've always maintained the beginning is the easy part, in terms of decision-making. It hurts to lose like last year, but once that pill is swallowed, not much tough decision-making goes into sticking with the prospects you have and seeing how they pan out, as veteran injuries pile up. The truly tough decisions are down the road, when these youngsters have developed into NHLers, and fans have fallen in love with them, and you need to make brutally honest evaluations and painful decisions about which ones to part with in order to leap to the next level. That's when it gets tricky -- and really fun. (And for me, an unabashed Frans Nielsen fan, that's when it will get uncomfortable.)

We're not at that point yet and won't get there this season. But if the team stays in the vicinity of a playoff bubble, and if cap-squeezed teams are forced to make real assets available in the summer, and if a flat or lowered cap means the Isles have a good shot at claiming those assets, then some time in the next year or two the subjects of those tough decisions will come into focus.

When Do You Flip the Switch?

Which brings me to today's question(s): I'm a fan of this rebuild operation, and I'm also accepting of the Islanders not spending assets to add help now. (Though Andy Sutton is out 2-4 weeks, Nielsen is being evaluated, Doug Weight is still a ways off, Radek Martinek is gone for the year. At some point ...). But sports fans are entitled to expect fast results, or at least progress. Are you one who thinks the time to beef up begins sometime this season? If not -- if you're in my camp, essentially -- when do you think the time to spend wildly above the cap floor will come?

In a way, this becomes a sketch of how you think the Islanders depth chart will look when they one day can consider themselves contenders. That's a discussion we've had here before but one that's always evolving as we learn more about current players (and as new commenters chime in, having only lurked before). But standing here at the end of November 2009, knowing what you know now, how do you see the, uh, rebuild playing out? When do we shed the "rebuild" tag, how do we get to that point, and who are your current-roster casualties? Obviously there are a thousand variables, some which rhyme with "Slick FeeBe-eightro," but this is an open-ended off-day topic to run in whichever direction you like.

And first-timers and lurkers: Don't be shy. Now's a fine time to state your philosophy and expectations for the Islanders, or if you like, project an elaborate version of their future in a FanPost to stir a separate discussion.

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The untouchables.....

Tavares, Moulson, Okposo, Streit, Hillen, Roloson (for the time being) Hunter, Bailey (earned the full season as of now – if not longer, depending upon trade considerations).

 Expendable: Sutton, Bergenheim, Tambellini, Park, Nielsen (sorry, Dom; all under same circumstances as Bailey – trades that can’t be passed up on) the rest, Biron, Jackman, Weight, Thompson, Sim (that said, he’s put forth the best effort he could; don’t think Gordon has always used him effectively) Martinek (sad case of a ‘glass body’!) and Witt (for all his notorious conditioning, has clearly lost his edge and focus – as much as a brown recluse bite demanded he be by his daughter’s side, can’t help suspecting it was also a very much-need opportunity to reevaluate how he feels about hockey and his particular game…..)

Question mark (but likely expendable too; his game demands too much of his body, unless he is able to successfully modify his style): DiPietro.

by ogam5 on Nov 30, 2009 9:14 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

I do hope the ageless wonder Roloson keeps his form up through next year. It’d be fun to see him carry this team a while and be around when they’re in a sustained playoff hunt.

Defense: I have to agree. It’s Streit, Hillen and then…? Makes for some interesting decisions this spring and summer. I hope de Haan and Hamonic don’t have to pass through Bridgeport first, but I don’t know how realistic it is to have both make the direct jump.

Oh well, at least we’re not “rebuilding”…

Lighthouse Hockey: Side effects may include Weight gain and frequent game loss.

by Dominik on Nov 30, 2009 10:50 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with your untouchables but...

I do not see trading Bergy, He is a valuable third line winger. Nielsen (since this latest injury), Thompson, Tambellini, and Jackman have a value to the team that would outweigh what we would be likely to get for them—the same really for Bergy.

Sutton, Park, and Biron (depending on DP’s health) will certainly be on the block. Weight will depend on team chemistry issues and what’s being offered. If I am Garth, I don’t move him for less than a second rounder. Witt and Martinek are virtually untradeable as is DP.

by BCISLEMAN on Nov 30, 2009 12:36 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Garth is a builder (not a rebuilder.)
He said so himself lol.

Old Logan-era Islanders article:
Snow caught between buy and sell at deadline
BY GREG LOGAN; 9:49 AM EST, February 22, 2008

http://www.newsday.com/sports/hockey…,6475822.story [NOTE: Link no longer works, but you can find the article pasted on various msg boards if you search for it]

…what will Islanders general manager Garth Snow do come 3 p.m. Tuesday? Is he a buyer or a seller?
“Neither,” Snow said after returning from the recent league GM meetings. “I’m a builder.”
With a laugh, Snow said he got that line from a more seasoned GM who told him to say that if he didn’t know what the heck he was going to do at the deadline. But there’s truth in jest, and the line perfectly captures Snow’s position.
A year ago at this time, the Islanders were in the middle of a tremendous February playoff push that had carried them solidly into sixth place and had them thinking about gaining home-ice advantage in the playoffs. When the opportunity arose to pluck Ryan Smyth from Edmonton in the final hours before the deadline, Snow sacrificed his first-round pick and two former first-round prospects to make the biggest blockbuster deal of the day. It turned out to be a 24-game rental including the Isles’ first-round playoff loss.
That type of move won’t happen this year. Snow is committed to keeping the Islanders’ first-round pick in a very deep draft this June, and generally speaking, the top prospects who remain in the organization are ones he declined to part with last year.
But that doesn’t mean Snow won’t make some noise at the deadline this year. With forwards Miroslav Satan, Mike Comrie, Ruslan Fedotenko, Trent Hunter, Josef Vasicek and Chris Simon all in the final year of their contracts, he’s certain to receive some attractive offers, and if there’s a chance to add a first-round pick and a useful player in exchange, he could sell.
At the same time, Snow has managed his salary cap so that the Islanders have plenty of room to take a big-ticket player. If he finds a trading partner who needs that salary flexibility and will take one of his pending free agents in return rather than picks and prospects, Snow could end up as a buyer.
Although the Islanders’ winning streak has placed them solidly back in the playoff picture, it hasn’t altered the principles on which Snow’s approach to the trade deadline is based. He’s a builder.
“It’s weird,” Snow said. “A six-game winning streak changes a lot for us in some ways. But what I’m focused on is how we’re going to build a team that can win the Stanley Cup someday on Long Island. When you focus on that, the extraneous variables fall by the wayside. They get eliminated from your thought process. My only focus is on what’s best for the organization for the long haul.
…“I firmly believe that, if you want my cap space, you better give me a good asset for it,” Snow said. “We’ve managed our cap in a pretty good manner, and if somebody wants some of it, there’s a price to pay for it. It does have a value … It is a new system. Who says I’m right? Maybe I’m wrong, but it’s what I believe.”

I remembered this sp specifically because I made a msg board sig called “Garth the Builder” as a response. If youre interested lol: http://i34.tinypic.com/35am6o5.jpg

Let Us Go, Islanders!
(Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Nov 30, 2009 11:20 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Nice find

I remember that one. That was reassuring to hear at the time. I didn’t have a problem with the Smyth deal because hey, you have prospects you’re not high on? Go ahead, spend ‘em and take your shot. Didn’t work, but the cost was worth it. And it was nice to hear he wouldn’t do it over and over.

"I firmly believe that, if you want my cap space, you better give me a good asset for it,"

I hope he still believes this and sticks to it.

Lighthouse Hockey: Side effects may include Weight gain and frequent game loss.

by Dominik on Nov 30, 2009 11:54 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Hells yeah. This is the season where that concept might really start to pay off.

Let Us Go, Islanders!
(Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Nov 30, 2009 12:59 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

As a long suffering fan (been around since 1973 — OK, maybe not always suffering — still have and wear my Fishsticks jersey), I am very happy with the plan as I see it coming together over time. This will, however, take some time and I do not want the powers that be to take their eyes off the long term goal for some short term sucess, since I do not consider a one series playoff run to be sucess. No Ryan Smyth type trades, Garth, TYIA.

Obviously, Biron is here as deadline trade-bait. he knows it, that’s been the plan all along. There are the youngsters who are untouchable, Streit should be around for the whole rebuild, DiP is (even if we could) not trade material, Some of the older players, and I am thinking Witt, Park, Weight, etc., should be allowed a opportunity to go to contenders IF THEY WANT to. Whether or not they have NMCs, I’d like to think there is enough loyalty to keep them to the end of the season if they want to stay. Next year is of course, next year.

Good job so far, Garth. Keep it up.

by Nova Scotia Isles Fan on Nov 30, 2009 11:35 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Welcome

Thanks for joining; Nova Scotia — I think we have both ends of Canada represented now.

Part of my confidence in Garth is that I really believe he won’t take his eyes off the long-term goal. As much as I wish he’d open up a little and be just a tad more of a showman, I appreciate that he’s all about sticking to the plan, not falling prey to the panic of the day. Hopefully that serves him well when the fans (and even Wang?) start to get antsy about fast-forwarding things before it’s time.

Lighthouse Hockey: Side effects may include Weight gain and frequent game loss.

by Dominik on Nov 30, 2009 11:59 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Personally, I’d like to see the Islanders play more Rob Schremp hockey.

I’m not really joking. I’d much, much rather see Schremp out there than the odious Jon Sim. Hell, I’d rather see Schremp out on the blueline than Sutton.

by AP77 on Nov 30, 2009 11:39 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

The Pens

Did it perfectly two years ago on when they got Hossa. When you know your going to be a presence in the playoffs, not when you think making a trade might get you into the playoffs.

But then again I’d sell my first, second and third born right about now just to see them get back to the Conference finals. Its been 16 long hard years.

"So basically, the Stats make no sense whatsoever."

by WebBard on Nov 30, 2009 12:07 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

No doubt. That was the right time. Not that this was in the equation for them back then (although Esposito’s worth was already in question), but now Angelo Esposito has torn his ACL again. Ouch. HF had him down to #10 on the Thrashers’ prospect list.

I hope we don’t go 20 years between conference finals appearances. Hell, I hope we don’t go 20 years between series wins.

Lighthouse Hockey: Side effects may include Weight gain and frequent game loss.

by Dominik on Nov 30, 2009 12:11 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Trades

In the cap era it’s going to be interesting to see if Snow can get creative and leverage teams with goaltending needs and cap issues to land some players he might not otherwise be able to nab.

Take the Caps for example. They have major issues in the pipes and on D, and biggest of all are completely crushed by the salary cap. What if they Islanders were willing to take on Nylander and Theodore (who total $10 million) and ship out Rolo or Biron and Witt (who would fit better with the Caps. This would net the Caps about $5 million in cap space. The Islanders would take on salary for this year, and possibly the next (Nylander is signed for next season),

Under such a scenario the Caps get help at two spots they need it, and maybe more importantly, cap space to add another player or players. I wonder what Snow we be able to pry away in addition to make the deal worthwhile for the Islanders. Could he get someone as good as Semin (a restricted FA next year, who the Caps probably can’t resign)? Could he pry away an NHL-ready prospect like Alzner? Could he get a Boyd Gordon and picks?

In essence the Islanders would have an opportunity to leverage the cap, and basically buy top prospects for nothing more than cash. This would seem like an ideal situation, but maybe it’s too good to be true.

by afrosupreme on Nov 30, 2009 5:04 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

That scenario is probably too good to be true, but it’s an interesting question — and there’s no book on it yet. How much is cap relief worth? I guess beyond need and demand, the variables also include the time of year (e.g. is there time to seek other options, or is the deadline around the corner? Is this a playoff push move, or a summer move to create cap room? etc.). A lot of time and market demand variables that make it hard to project.

If a team is only needing cap relief, they always have the last resort of just burying a cap hit in the minors (and recently, maybe even a loan to the KHL). But someone like Semin or Alzner — I mean a team is going to pursue every exhaustible option and, failing that, just stand pat rather than give up that kind of asset. I don’t know what they could possibly need that would justify giving that up; even once Semin hits RFA, you look at Kessel fetching two first-round picks in a similar situation.

This is why Bob Gainey’s Gomez trade pissed me off. He bailed Sather out and he paid with real assets. If there’s always going to be a sucker, I’m not sure how much Snow will be able to pry away when taking on someone’s cap mistakes.

Lighthouse Hockey: Side effects may include Weight gain and frequent game loss.

by Dominik on Nov 30, 2009 5:21 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Good points, and I agree-it’s hard to know since there is now book out there on this yet.

The one caveat I’d offer with the Caps is that we are offering more than just cap relief. Witt could be the physical dman they really need, and Rolo/Biron would be a nice upgrade from Theodore. The other part with the Caps is they are on the doorstep of a championship and they know it. I think it will be the same as last year, with the winner of Caps/Pens taking it all. So they may e more willing than most to trade away parts of the future and play for now.

by afrosupreme on Nov 30, 2009 8:33 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with that premise, but I honestly doubt anyone around Washington fancies Witt at this point, particularly with another year to go on his deal.

A goalie upgrade would be interesting, but again they’d have to see it as a sure enough upgrade, and with the way Biron’s numbers have looked…

Lighthouse Hockey: Side effects may include Weight gain and frequent game loss.

by Dominik on Dec 1, 2009 1:21 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

not sure there's anybody on the Caps they'd be willing to part with...

who we would really want. A better fit might be the Hawks. For example, Cam Barker’s name has been mentioned as a potential salary dump. The improved play of Hillen might make a postseason trade involving Barker and Hillen attractive for both teams. I do not want to take on salaries of players who we don’t need. Our cap space should be more productive than that.

by BCISLEMAN on Nov 30, 2009 7:35 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I’d gladly take on the contracts of players we don’t need, if they are one year deals (like Theodore), and they land us good young prospects. The reality is, there is no scenario under which the Islanders win the Cup this year. That’s why they are the longest odds on the board right now. So I’m not sure how using cap space to land good players wouldn’t be productive. Sure it wouldn’t help us immediately this year, but we don’t need help this year. We need help for the coming years. Right now we don’t have enough depth at forward in the minors to say that we could skate three solid lines next year or the one after. We need to add some scorers to put out there with JT and KO, and I think if it meant eating some schlub’s salary for a year to do it, so be it.

by afrosupreme on Nov 30, 2009 8:28 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

we need to add defense more...

and I see no reason for us to take on salary of players we don’t want or need. They will simply be taking up roster space that could be used for a more productive player. And you seem to be talking about doing a deal this season. I do not think Garth is planning these leveraged trades until after the season ends and everyone knows where they stand capwise.

by BCISLEMAN on Nov 30, 2009 8:48 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

rebuild

As a frequent reader I was prompted to post as a result of being called a “lurker”- kinda creepy sounding. I want to know who claimed my “since72” handle on this site? like my variation? I too am a Nova Scotia fan, (probably since 73 as well, but since the marquee players were Bert Marshall and Ed Westfall I figure I can claim since the begining.)
On topic it is to early in the “not a rebuld” to start winning. we still requre too many key assets. One more good draft required. J.T. and K.O. only untouchables on roster, But lets be careful what we wish for, the memories of Mad Mike are still too fresh. Save the trades for when a Butch can put us over the top.

by since70too on Nov 30, 2009 5:24 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

Well-played
As a frequent reader I was prompted to post as a result of being called a "lurker"- kinda creepy sounding.

LOL. Welcome! Looks like “”http://www.sbnation.com/users/since72" >since72" is used on another site within SBN — but I do love your workaround. And you’re right, “lurker” does have a sort of creepy neighbor sound to it. Didn’t mean to shame you into the public eye — but now you can be brought to justice :)

“Careful what we wish for.” Yeah, I find myself in that mode a lot. I know that whenever The Moment comes when I expect far more from this team, part of how they perform at that point will depend on the luck of what fell in their laps before then. So I doubt I’ll be rushing. But I know while most fans are on board with things now, people are going to choose a lot of different jumping off points. It’ll be interesting.

P.S.: For everyone who was around “since 72” and in the days of Westfall and Harris and such, don’t hesitate to leave us a story or two about the OLD old days. For my money, I always figured history pieces or even “my first game, it was against the Barons” make for great FanPosts.

Lighthouse Hockey: Side effects may include Weight gain and frequent game loss.

by Dominik on Nov 30, 2009 5:39 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

trade dreaming

Am I the only one whose heart did a double beat with reports of Filatov’s trouble in Columbus. This kid could be magic on J.T.s wing. Straight up for Baily? Reshuffle the ‘08 draft. We’re deep at center and we’ve been “turning Josh into a third liner.” A first line wing for a 2-3 line center- in a heart beat from here.

by since70too on Nov 30, 2009 6:17 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

sounds like the kid's got issues in that one square foot of real estate where it reall matters...

and if he wouldn’t work within Hitchcock’s system, why would he work within ours? We’ve been down this road before…very talented Russian forward who never seemed to be able to leave all of it—or even most of it —on the ice. No thanks…ummm…actually nyet.

by BCISLEMAN on Nov 30, 2009 7:40 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I’m actually more sold on Bailey than I am on Filatov at this point. I think the “turning Josh into a third liner” was a bit of an exaggeration from whoever that was. You can take a 19-20 year-old on any night, or any week, and wonder if he’s hit a wall.

That said, I’m sure Hitchcock was the worst coach for Filatov to have at this early stage of his career.

Lighthouse Hockey: Side effects may include Weight gain and frequent game loss.

by Dominik on Dec 1, 2009 1:18 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

The way I see it if Josh’s home country, where his friends and family all live, where people know who he is and treat him like a hockey player instead of a rook, was offering him way more ice time and a 400% salary increase to boot, well maybe his head would be screwed on a bit differently, as well.

Let Us Go, Islanders!
(Ever notice how strange that sounds without the contraction?)

by TheMetalChick on Dec 1, 2009 10:31 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I seem to recall some Isle fans voicing their displeasure when Josh was picked...

and the Islanders probably wouldn’t have been his first choice. No one held a gun to Filatov’s gead.

by BCISLEMAN on Dec 1, 2009 11:57 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Too early to tell where Filatov’s head is. One of the reasons he was picked so high is because he was determined to make the NHL and intentionally hadn’t tied himself to Russian clubs. But playing real minutes in the KHL rather than 7 minutes (when he’s not healthy scratched) in the NHL might be a better way to accomplish that.

Since his future, should it work out, is as a scoring winger, a break from life as Hitchcock’s fourth-line whipping boy might do him some good. We’ll see.

Lighthouse Hockey: Side effects may include Weight gain and frequent game loss.

by Dominik on Dec 1, 2009 12:23 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

OBTW, Dom, not that you should care, but...

I’m guessing Charles W. might have an attack of apoplexy if he read your caption. He and his family fled Shanghai and Chairman Mao right after the takeover.

by BCISLEMAN on Dec 1, 2009 4:44 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Interesting

Didn’t know that was the timing of it.

Ah well, Party jargon is so absurd it’s hard not to joke about it in retrospect. My grandfather was assassinated by the SS and my father exiled from his homeland for four decades by the Soviets, so maybe I have some cover on the “how the 20th century’s worst regimes screwed my family” front.

Lighthouse Hockey: Side effects may include Weight gain and frequent game loss.

by Dominik on Dec 1, 2009 9:54 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

OK....sorry about your grandfather...

Wang’s bio has him born in 1944 and his family fleeing Shanghai when he was 8.

by BCISLEMAN on Dec 1, 2009 10:34 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs


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(updated 2.9.2010 at 9:00 AM EST)

New York Islanders Roster

# Pos. DOB W H
Josh Bailey 12 C 10/2/1989 188 6-1
Sean Bergenheim 20 LW 2/8/1984 205 5-10
Blake Comeau 57 RW 2/18/1986 207 6-1
Rick DiPietro 39 G 9/19/1981 210 6-1
Bruno Gervais 8 D 10/3/1984 205 6-1
Trent Hunter 7 RW 7/5/1980 210 6-3
Dustin Kohn 56 D 2/2/1987 200 6-2
Andrew MacDonald 47 D 9/7/1986 188 6-1
Freddy Meyer 44 D 1/4/1981 192 5-10
Matt Moulson 26 LW 11/1/1983 206 6-1
Frans Nielsen 51 C 4/24/1984 172 5-11
Kyle Okposo 21 RW 4/16/1988 200 6-1
Richard Park 10 RW 5/27/1976 190 5-11
Dwayne Roloson 30 G 10/12/1969 180 6-1
Rob Schremp 13 C 7/1/1986 200 5-11
Jon Sim 16 LW 9/29/1977 195 5-10
Mark Streit 2 D 12/11/1977 197 6-0
Andy Sutton 25 D 3/10/1975 245 6-6
Jeff Tambellini 15 LW 4/13/1984 186 5-11
John Tavares 91 C 9/20/1990 195 6-0
Doug Weight 93 C 1/21/1971 196 5-11

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